A nose job that went horribly wrong? :-)

[Swan]

Each time this video is shown on Vh1, I wonder what the heck went wrong. In "How Deep Is Your Love" by the Bee-Gees, falsetto brother Barry gets a doubled nose! :D
I have captured this video three times and his nose is always messed up. And it's always in the same scenes (close-ups of him), the rest of the video looks fine. To make sure I wasn't losing my mind (or my capture card/software) messed up up, I watched the video live, on the TV this morning. And would you believe it? His nose looks the same. So, I'm not doing anything wrong. :)
I'm wondering, does anyone have a clue as to why this happened?
Was it in the conversion from film to PAL, Film to NTSC, then to PAL?

Clips are available for download here:
http://w1.837.telia.com/~u83704103/clips/weird_nosejob.mpg
(this is Barry's messed-up nose, 720 x 575, PAL, MPEG-2 clip, 5.41 MB)

http://w1.837.telia.com/~u83704103/clips/ok.mpg
(Just to show that the rest of the video and close-ups of the other Gibb brothers look fine. 720 x 575, PAL, MPEG-2, 2.14 MB)

Screen shot (jpg):
http://w1.837.telia.com/~u83704103/clips/barrys_nose.jpg

I find this hilarious, but I'm also curious how something like this can happen?

/Swan

[waldok]

Well Swan, I know you are a big fan of the Bee Gees, but sorry to be cruel here, his real nose is like that. The guy was very well known as "twice-a-nose Barry boy" in his area.
You'll have to get the famous "nose reduction" filter to improve the poor situation...

:D

Waldok (:cool: as ever)

[Swan]

Nose reduction filter, huh? LOL!

Maybe his nose is the secret behind how he manages to sing those unbelieveably high notes?
With a double nose, more air can be inhaled, expanding the lungs, yeah, that explains it for me. :D

But seriously. This is a weird thing. Why is just the nose distorted? Everything else is in place from frame to frame? What went wrong when this video was made? Or converted to PAL/NTSC? I'm sure there's a technical explanation. I just can't figure it out.

/Swan

[^^-+I4004+-^^]

Originally posted by Swan
What went wrong when this video was made? Or converted to PAL/NTSC? I'm sure there's a technical explanation.

/Swan

yes,there is "tehnical" explanation->he has some tehnical problems with his nose!(hehe)

video is OK! (rest assured)
(i've tested it in frame & field mode)

he is either naturally "talented" or perhaps broke his nose few (like 10...hehe) times!

and the light-atmosphere in the video helps THE NOSE (hehe) to get that monstruos look

nothing weird....

cheers

Ivo

[SansGrip]

and the light-atmosphere in the video helps THE NOSE (hehe) to get that monstruos look

I agree. The scene is kinda lit from below which causes shadows that look like a second set of nostrils. Nothing to worry about, unless you were the lighting director ;)

[\AX]

i can assure you that is not his noise..i know exactly what he looks like anyhow

http://www.splange.freeserve.co.uk/ironic/beegees.jpg

anyways it looks like to me it happened because of the camera..not the lighting. maybe that is what you meant i dont know.


anyhow why do you listen to the beegee's??? you must be old because i only know what he looks like from old record covers from my parents...im 25 so you must be ollllllllllld :-P

[waldok]

AX, go to bed now :D

(Can't bear a 25 rookie laughing when I also used to listen to the big nose Bee gees. Damn, pay some respect, I could be your father (well..no..that's not what I meant, I'm not THAT old..whatever...sigh...already 36....Damn...how time goes by...where did I put my fake teeth now...Can't remember...

waldok :cool:

[waldok]

More seriously now, looking at the picture, it seems to me there is a serious problem with interlaced frames here. Seems the capture process grabbed the odd field on frame 1 let's say, and arranged it with the even field from frame 5 for example. That could be an explanation to this "double nose" feeling.
I used to work in a company that designed capture cards long ago (right after world war 1...by the way I find my fake teeth now, thanks to those who worried for me) and this kind of thing happened when the capture driver was not fast enough to grab both odd and even field in 1/30th second (30 full interlaced frames per second NTSC). Then the driver got the odd and even fields from different incoming pictures and then combined them to rebuild the full picture, which produced this effect, due to the motion that occured in the original sequence in the meantime.

Am I clear here ? Not even sure I understood what I just wrote... :D

Damn, use your brains guys !:rolleyes:

Triple nose Waldok :cool:

[Swan]

@waldok
Thanks for defending me. :)
But mr. \AX needs to learn to read better. I guess today's snotty-nosed kids don't get the same, thorough education we senior citizens got, right waldok? :-D
No offense, \AX, I'm joking to 100%.

I never wrote that I like the Bee-Gees, did I?
How do you know that I captured this clip because I have a thing for Barry Gibb? Did I say so? LOL!

I captured it because of the doubled nose. I've seen it several times and finally thought I'd post about it here, to get some professional suggestions on what the problem may be.
Having said that, I am not ashamed to say that I have nothing against the Bee-Gees, and I'm old enough to remember "Saturday Night Fever" and the impact it had on pop music is an undisputable fact.
But I much prefer "You Should Be Dancin'" to the plodding "How Deep Is Your Love". And I'd much rather capture a real, bonafide disco video like Sylvester "You Make Me Feel Mighty Real".
Sadly, you don't see much of the "real thing" on Vh1 here in Europe.
By "the real thing" I mean disco with African-American artists who are the true inventors of dance/disco music (of ALL music that's any good, if you ask me, he, he). Bee-Gees was just something a little more acceptable to the White pop audience, that's one of the reasons why they were so successful. There, \AX. Maybe you shouldn't be so quick to laugh at us old folks. We do know a thing or two about music. ;)

@^^-+I4004+-^^ and Sansgrip
I think you are on to something. The lighting director being incompetent is one possible explanation as to why this phenomena occured. In combination with a bad lens on the camera, or perhaps more plausible: the lighting caused some freakish, unusal behaviour in the camera's optics. Yes, that sounds reasonable to me. The rest of the video looks fine, except for all the close-ups of Barry, he has a doubled nose in those.
I don't believe the capture card was involved at all. Barry had a double nose when I watched the video on the TV, the live signal, as it was being broadcast. Also, if if was the card, ^^-+I4004+-^^ , would have seen it when he studied the clip, frame by frame. And if it wa the card, then why is just the nose messed up? All other facial features are right where they should be.

Thank you all for your suggestions, I laughed a lot. And learned some too.

/Swan

[^^-+I4004+-^^]

wotef>More seriously now, looking at the picture, it seems to me there is a serious problem with interlaced frames here. Seems the capture process grabbed the odd field on frame 1 let's say, and arranged it with the even field from frame 5 for example. That could be an explanation to this "double nose" feeling.
I used to work in a company that designed capture cards long ago (right after world war 1.......


_nope,no messing found that would ressemble that....
(i guess those cards you mantion were old....hehehe.....
perhaps older than "FAST movie machine" (ISA,cca '96.
btw i didn't used it but only am interested in how all this sttarted...)

Swan>Also, if if was the card, ^^-+I4004+-^^ , would have seen it when he studied the clip, frame by frame.

_AND field by field......also "telecide" heals the combing pretty good
(finds fields that make up frames...)

video is OK:there's NO WAY(!) that capturing (or converting from film)
process would be selective for the one part of the picture and not for another...(ie. that messes one part of the field/frame,and not another)

case closed_

Ivo

[waldok]

Well I4004 (or whatever symbols you want to add around) ;)

I'm old enough indeed to have played with the first capture cards FAST designed a few centuries ago (FAST were direct competitors to the small company I was working for at the time).

Anyway, You seem to forget something here and I'm pleased to relind you some lines of the excellent Bee gees biography written by William Shakespeare :

"Very early, the young Barry Gibb surprised every member of his family with his unbelievable ability to move his nose very fast, without moving any other single part of his face....
(exceirpt from "Bee Gees : Who Nose the truth ?"

Yes, bro, I can swear it, good old Barry likes to joke around, and he sure did in this clip, moving his nose so fast he fooled the capture devices even and odd fields all around the world.

As you said, case nosed (sorry, closed).

What ? Drunk ? the hell I swear I'm not :p

Waldok :cool: (Burp...)

[Guest]

Weird.

The clips and all you guys!

[\AX]

Every time i turn around i see this either on tv, internet, radio...wtf ever.

"...African-American artists who are the true inventors of dance/disco music"

totally wrong...couldnt be more futher from the truth.

"African-Americans" (???) did not have a damn thing to do with disco/dance music...it was completely the whited wasted youth that gave up on glory and hope for a revolution. You think the black panthers listened to disco?? "African-Americans" stuck to more sole by redefining the early GREAT jazz artist's (who which where not even american) with a tongue and different culture.

If you would ask any older "African-American" the ? opf "Who is the true inventor's of Disco and Dance??" ...I rest assure you if he was old enought to know...he would not say a "African-American" in response.

I should just say Disco because using Disco/Dance is incorrect being who really knows who invented Dance or even Modern Dance...Dance is a mixture of all culture's...that is why all culture's can Dance together.

Disco comes from white hardcore user's of illicit drugs...mostly the halu's and down's that came with all that crazy zhit.

Im not a authority figure on this by any means. But don't forget im 25 not 12. My father and uncle where at woodstock and the other side of my family was "Disco".

Sader fact..."African-Americans" did not invent Rap music either...again it was the same white drug addicts...in fact the band that broke Rap music off to a larger crowd was the same band that started to break off Disco to the larger crowd...do you know this band?????

"Modern Jazz" is what the "African-Americans" have totally ownership when it comes to excellance in that field. Along with "Rap" if you would say...and "Soul" ("Soul" is however debateable again due to culture is not prominant in "Soul"...only "("Soul"}")

[Swan]

\AX
Your ignorance on the subject is sad to read. Obviously, you don't know much about music history. I don't want to get into an argument with you, but check facts before you post misinformation like this.

You''re one of those people who think Disco is the Bee-Gees. Or Bette Midler, or any other artist that jumped on the "disco bandwagon" in the late 70's (and which eventually caused the "disco sucks" event when thousands of record were burned).

Disco is much more than the watered down stuff, which was made for mass consumption by white audiences.
There is no question that disco was born from from African-American Soul music. The first disco ever produced came out on labels like Philadelphia International which was an African-American owned label, with African-American artists, songwriters, arrangers, producers, etc. Ever heard of Kenny Gamble and Leon Huff?
Probably not.

Your statements regarding rap are equally ridiculous. African-American radio DJ's invented rap. You must have got that mixed up with the statistical fact that today's rap music has a large white audience (more white kids buy Hip-Hop records than African American). But hey, tell Jocko, Superwolf - and all the other African-American DJ's who rapped on the air long before you were born - that whites invented rap. :-)

I really didn't want to respond to this, because what you're saying is just as silly as proposing that the earth is flat. So, let's leave it at that. You can believe what you want. And I know who is right. I won't discuss this further with you. Let's stick to discussing capture cards. No hard feelings, eh?

/Swan

[\AX]

you know who's right...i dont think you should be so quick. if your going to completely call me silly then give me some time to track info...if im so silly now...you wont like what i dig up for you later :-).

i shouldnt respond either..but for the rap you better dig up some more info...im not aruging..believe me..just check out a band's history before they went south and broke to clear up the rap issue.. "Fleetwood Mac" <--- in discovery with this band you should find CROSS reference's between this band and what you call "African-American DJ's" with artiste's like "DJ Grand Master Flash" or in reality the actual name of his band was the "Furious Five" (alot of people forget he was in a BAND...not just solo). Anyhow you can cross reference what Grandmaster flash said about the group "Fleetwood Mac" and also some reference's from a group called Run DMC.

How do i know the above??? a extremely boring night watching behind the music on the history of rap. Yep..the had Grandmaster flash even comparing what he did to the song by Fleetwood Mac. I believe it was "Albatrose"...i think. It should of been off there ~1977 release...whatever that is.

Ok DJ's did not invent rap...either rap. The rap your talking about..i believe had absolutely nothing to do with "DJ's"...DJ's are Disc Jokey's...and rap wasnt borned from the table...but from the drum machine and sample's. Like to listen to Ghetto boys'(if this is what you mean by rap), NWA, CPO, Apache, Shine Ad, DJ Quick, Ice-T, Leader's of the New School even...this was all done with drum machines...every bit of it (not sure on LOTNS but im pretty sure..never listen much of them growing up...but the rest i listen obitualy). Even groups/artists to spawn from these did aswell (Ice Cube, Dr. Dre, Eazy-E, etc...). zhit even today this is so..like P-ditty (or whatever), Luniz, Lil' Flipp, Big Pun, Biggie Smalls(R.I.P.), Tupac, etc..
These are not DJ's. DJ's are like Paul Oakenfold, Timo Mass, Banco De Gaia, JunkieXL, etc...these are Disc Jokey's

Ok enough on that...now to get to what i have written in college.

Disco...Bee Gee's???? Yes and No. That is questionable to when and where you lived in the United State's Of America and also what society. Today there is societies in Apalachian mountains that never even heard of Brittny Spears...so likewise 30+ years ago regarding disco in other part's of the country. Disco however has branched from Germany during WW2. Yes that long ago. It was a dervived sound that came from the music which is called "Swing". Djano (spelling sux) was one of the more popular swing artist's to the German Youth. About somewhere in the 1950's Swing had a collapse of listener's with the "Baby Boom Generation" who really just wanted to hear new style music like "Rock". Evlis is certainly one that come's to mind...aswell my favorit of that era...the legend who married his cousing..the man who wrote "Great Balls of Fire"(you know who). However, this man also stayed with "Blue's" crowd for inspirational music....im getting off subject BIG time.

Disco is not a new word obviously...like over a thousand years old. But when AMERCICANS first started using the word Disco it was in reference to music that was just "Scatty". Disco poped it's head out once again in the 1960's with the "Hippie's" lack of trained thought to create a happy feeling (I can't stand Hippie's and i due have a REALLY good reason, it involve's someone i love very much). In 1969 Disco was already popular...however..."African-Americans" did not see anything of it. There wasnt too many African-Americans to walk with the "White Man" at that time that were either A. were not hippies' B. looking for a way out. Getting off subject AGAIN.

Disco was already in the street's long before any record label ("Philadelphia International ") even thought about signing artist's. I mean due you really think the frist disco song was on a record that was signed??? Not even close. Like all other new music, it was around for many years before a company steped up and saw there was money in it. Look at "Rock-N-Roll"...you really thing Elvis and the Beatles invented it...not even close.

Q. Who really invented "Rock-N-Roll"????
A. "African-Americans"

Rock-N-Roll was being played in halfway house's, dock's, and third town bars by African-American artist's as far back as the 1900's. Zhit there was a supposed to be a Rock-N-Roll band (African-American) on the Titanic...but due to obvious reason's no entertainment was allowed by "African American" people at that time or was highly limited to what was scheduled by so. After conclusion that what these "African Americans" were playing was unsuitable they were canceled months before the Titanic ever left dock...that first time :-P

What i really hate...Hippies and Racist's
What i hate equally...people regarding the heritage of art from TV, word of mouth, and skin color. All those times you or someone else gets your history from tv, book, radio, word of mouth...you better look in older books...for the real history of something is never documented as history...but current event's. All history book's due is take the past current events, the manifest's of society, and word of mouth and put it on paper. Yeh i could of believed the history books, but if i did i would believe JFK was shot by lee oswald, Buffalo Bill was a good guy, George Washington was a enterpanuer, Christopher Columbus only wanted royalites, etc...

Im not aruging. I know what i konw about Disco music for 2 reason's. 1. Ive donea report & 2. The worst of them all...i have heard the history, feel, what's great about it...from all kinds of people...not just white people either.

Due you think us Americans that are white never talk or learn about history of what is to be so called a "Black" heritage or a "White" heritage or a "Oriental" heritage. We due only becuase what is taught to us in school is not the truth...only becuase the truth is not so pleasant. I thought very hard about taking a major in history, and playing (your gonna laugh) the clarinet and piano is something i really love. The piccalo is nice...just cant hold the damn thing :-P...and fuc the flute (not afending you "flutist's" out there)..the flute is too sharp for me...or atleast sounds that way.

Again im no proffessor on music history...but it sound's you know what you know from word of mouth and a couple books, maybe even the internet.

This could all be wrong, the paper i wrote and many source's i extracted this disco history could of been so old that they just were not documented correctly. it could be that the periodical's where written incorrectly. it could of been alot of things...but i got a "A" on it...but then again did she, my proffesor really know as much about disco as the next person...or just think what i wrote is what is??

I will, as usually with the other thread i have posted here, will re-track proof of this, periodcals, and other source's of American Heritage to give you. You will read what i have read, however, you might not believe it for you might not want to believe it.

As far as the history of "Rap"...well that was just 1 hour of a boring night on VH1. However, being that they got grandmaster on archive reffering to Fleetwood mac and vice versa...i can only believe it since it is what they said. Again i think the song was "Albatrause"...but im not sure. I will find that for you aswell, along with the date, lyric's, and piece's from VH1 show (if i can...ive honestly never tried to however). Im sure if i can call VH1 they would sell me a copy of that episode (they would sell anything im sure). But yeh, grandmaster flash (one of the supposed inventor's of rap) stated the idea of rhyming lyrics was from the "Catchy" sound of that Fleetwood Mac. This was not the direct invention of it however...but if you hear it you will see how the sound is incorporated in the Furious Five.

If you read this then plese look into all of the following. You don't have to however, i will supply the information. The History of "Rock-N-Roll" is a most interesting one. The fact that it came from "African American's" is not what is interesting...it is why the "African American's" never took credit for it is what is interesting. If you get bored look into that...it's strangely sad but true.

Im trying to see if you can, like me, provide a answer to the above Rock-N-Roll history on why it's strangely sad but true. I can retract that information...although that might actually requiring scanning page's for me...unless i can find it else where.

btw you never mentioned your age...or atleast i missed it. I know your female, and i know your smart...but i missed your age. I could go without knowing your female, i cant go without knowing your smart from your post's, and i still wonder your age.

I guess you didnt believe me, and still don't...but i dont lie. And i hope you don't hate me when i get proof...that isnt why i responded. I responded for what you have said about music heritage is commonly a misconecption. There is other's in other music even. Ive heard boat loads say just what you have said about Disco and Rap...but none ever really put in hours upon hours digging and griding everything one could find to dig up the truth like i have...and im sure other's. (again im talking about disco..rap was from VH1)

Thanks for calling me silly :-) eh? OK? :-P IM JOKING!!

But like you said...let's just talk about capture cards.

Jonathon 10.21.2002

[bb]

Any further constructive on-topic statements? Otherwise this thread should be closed.

bb

[Swan]

Let me just say this:
As for my credentials, \AX, I am more than qualified.
I have collected records (soul, funk, disco, r&b, hip-hop, reggae) since 1977. I have worked as a music journalist (specializing in interviewing soul, funk and hip-hop artists) for more than 15 years.

If I didn't know my African-American music history, do you really think I would have got away with it? Out of the *hundreds* of interviews I've made, don't you think at least *one artist* would have told me - or at least hinted - that I was incompetent at my job or had the facts wrong?
You're either joking to provoke me (but it's not funny) or is terribly misinformed.

BB, please close the thread.
I will not write any more about this here.

/Swan

[waldok]

Yeah, I think everything was said about the Gibb family nose problems.
Back to real life guys :D

Waldok :cool: