Ripping (off?) movies.......Why? [Archive]

wantok

29th September 2002, 03:05

I do it for one reason...because I have a 2 year old. We travel a lot and I have a portable DVD player. The last thing I'm going to do is take originals with me in a car or airplane and give her a chance to scratch beyond being view able.

I suppose a second reason which is somewhat related due to travel, when I travel to Europe and Japan I take the same portable DVD player and watch copies in the room. This allows the originals to stay home and be used by the family. This is a sticky issue on legality, as if by some chance we are watching the same title at the same time then we have violated strict intrepration of copyright law. But I'll take my chances.

My 2cents
Wantok

jggimi

29th September 2002, 03:34

From http://www.doom9.org/disclaimer.htm:In most countries copyright laws allow the original purchaser/owner to legally make one personal backup/copy for their own personal use. The owner would like to stress that it is illegal to backup/copy a movie that you do not own (i.e.. personally purchased). It is also illegal to backup/copy your own movie and give copies away. The legality of copying a movie for a friend (if he owns that particular movie) may also depend on your country's' legislation concerning that matter.

zeroseven

29th September 2002, 09:15

Don't get me wrong, I'm not on some moral high horse, though I do earn my living in the film industry I am also a realist. It seems a lot of effort just watch film in your hotel room. I also work all over the world, in fact I very rarely work in the UK, but I have to say the last place I want to spend my evenings is in my hotel room, get out more - better than any film!

Also DVD's are becoming so cheap, is it really worth all the effort? Its an interestin technology for sure, I have to send out 'show reels' of my work, so its great to be able to make them to order instead of ordering batches of clunky old U-matic tapes from a post production house. Maybe its not as complex as it all seems to start with...........

It seems a shame though that someone will post a question on here about getting round encryption and a flood of replies come in. I've posted several times over several months asking how to load and edit/split VOB's that are my own material - and never had a single reply.

jggimi

29th September 2002, 15:13

I beg to differ. A search by your user name shows a total of 4 posts, 3 in this thread. You posted your very first question under this user name on 28 September: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=34591

[EDIT] That was less than 24 hours ago.

And I would have replied, had I had an answer.

zeroseven

29th September 2002, 16:13

Originally posted by jggimi
I beg to differ. A search by your user name shows a total of 4 posts, 3 in this thread. You posted your very first question under this user name on 28 September: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=34591

[EDIT] That was less than 24 hours ago.

And I would have replied, had I had an answer.

I originally joined under another name but for some reason I could not access the forum using it, so re registered - so beg all you like:p

zeroseven

29th September 2002, 16:18

....also interesting that the same people seem to adopt a beligerent manner when newcomers ask questions.

What was that saying about hiding ignorance in a flurry of condemnation? Twain I think.

jggimi

29th September 2002, 16:53

Roget’s II: The New Thesaurus, Third Edition. 1995.

belligerent

NOUN: One who engages in a combat or struggle: combatant, fighter, soldier, warrior. See CONFLICT.

ADJECTIVE: 1. Inclined to act in a hostile way: aggressive, combative, contentious, hostile, militant. See ATTACK, ATTITUDE. 2. Having or showing an eagerness to fight: bellicose, combative, contentious, hostile, militant, pugnacious, quarrelsome, scrappy, truculent, warlike. See ATTACK. 3. Of or engaged in warfare: combatant, hostile, militant. Idioms: at war. See ATTACK. Look in the mirror, sir.

zeroseven

29th September 2002, 17:18

I know what it means - I didn't have to look it up as you did.

I've asked a simple question and had two very childish answers. Yet you seem to think that my curiosity is based in some form of attack on your forum ethics (?).

I fail to see why else you wish to contribute (dubious point)to a thread which you obviously have no interest in.

Back to the Ryder Cup....

jggimi

29th September 2002, 17:54

And you were caught in what appeared to be an obvious prevarication.

Whether or not that is the case, you are in violation of rule 4.

xox

29th September 2002, 18:42

ouch...i just wonder what sort of answer zeroseven was expecting anyway..or better...why even bother to ask? and i really don't understand how someone can join but unable to access the forum :confused:

DJ Bobo

29th September 2002, 19:18

Hehe, I'm in a good mood right now, should I answer once again?! hmm... let me think... yeah, I will put some salt in the soup :D

@ zeroseven
I'm always that helpful for people like you! :p
Thanks for calling me sharp btw, I appreciate the compliment, thanks :D

biscuit

29th September 2002, 19:20

I cant believe you people-

Its not a stupid question at all, its a great question. And in fact, probably the best question on the entire board.

Whats the point? (meaning ... why do it? or WHY are YOU doing it?)

I think everyone on here should ask themselves this. Someone out there just asked you, and it seems like the people on here that responded took offense to this question (except for me), and tried to dodge the question by saying it was stupid, or saying that he was breaking a certain rule. To me, it really made me think about it, and if its worth it at all.

And another thing, someone telling me that im breaking a rule, doesnt mean a whole lot coming from somebody that is breaking the law (copying a DVD) so you high horse rule keepers keep your mouths shut, and go back to your pirating.

zeroseven

29th September 2002, 19:33

Thank you biscuit.

I am genuinely interested as to why so many people devote so much time applying this fantastic, though at times frustrating technology, just to save themselves, what, $15 ??

It all seems a little unconstructive. I have probably 60 or 70 DVD's, they've not been treated with any special reverance, yet I've never had one fail to play. If it was a fragile technology - then fair enough. If it was to 're cut' a movie for your own satisfaction - great. But just to have a 'back up'? So some of you sell them to your friends, what do you get $5....$7 ?

So, I'll ask again. Whats the point?

And btw it seems I was not the only one who was lost from the member list - it occurred during a forum software change around March.

jggimi

29th September 2002, 20:34

I am not concerned about the question; only about the tone of the discourse. Rule 4, Buscuit, has to do with civililty -- something that is lacking from this thread.

I tried to point out that fair use is subject to legal interpretation, and is not the same globally. It didn't answer "why" but it did provide one data point on legality.

I had my head handed to me in response.

zeroseven

29th September 2002, 21:01

Originally posted by jggimi

I had my head handed to me in response.

Perhaps you read something into my words that I didn't write. Perhaps you could quote the offensive section.

The 'attitude' on here didn't originate from me. And you still seem reluctant to answer the question. Perhaps there lies the answer.

xox

29th September 2002, 21:11

doesn't (off) sound offensive enough? what are you trying to insinuate by asking why we rip (off) movies?

Swede

29th September 2002, 21:19

Ok, it is time to lower the tone now.

@zeroseven: There are different places for different discussions and since this is a forum about HOW, not WHY, I suggest that you take this discussion elsewhere.

And your orignal question:
Forgive me if this is a stupid question, but whats the point? along with your title "Ripping (off?) movies.......Why?" *is* quite offensive.

jggimi

29th September 2002, 21:57

Many members of this community do not use dvd content as input, but use various other video technology (DV, capture, etc.) as input.

I'm sorry, zeroseven, if I never answered the questions you've posed on this forum in the past. I couldn't answer the one you asked yesterday, as I don't use Adobe Premier.

I'll try to answer the original question from this post; why I bother with dvd content, though I also encode my own DV[list=1]. I enjoy the process of manipulating video and audio. I enjoy the analysis and "art" often needed to pruduce what I think is a high quality transcode. I travel upwards of 120,000 miles per year by air. My laptop does not have a dvd player, and while I do read or work on airplanes, sometimes I enjoy watching a film of my own choosing, rather than that of the airline. (I'll admit that, over the last 24 months, the investment made by airlines for inflight entertainment has improved. Even so, I still prefer something from my personal collection. I sometimes will watch a film when stuck in a hotel room, and the same reasoning applies.[/list=1]

zeroseven

29th September 2002, 22:12

Swede:

So you don't make copies to rip off the distribution companies (and I believe that - like I said too much effort for no reward). Surely my post is only offensive to somebody who is breaking the law , so I'm perplexed that you try to exaggerate my question into being some sort of moral stance against forum members.

Something about my question has made a few people become very defensive. That makes me want to know the answer all the more.

I'm asking a simple question, but as you don't seem to understand it in the 'why' form and would like to play games with words, try:

How do you justify the time and effort spent copying commercial DVD's to no obvious advantage to any of the partys involved? Its the same question, but maybe it fits the forum criteria now. Please advise and I'll be happy to rephrase it again

jjgimi:

Thank you for your answer. I understand completely how you derive enjoyment from conquering and utilising the technology to your advantage. I wish I had the ability to use it myself albeit for slightly different reasons (reference to my 'other' recent post re editing .vobs - answers PLEASE!!). I still do not understand the benefits of the 'back up' policy long term, but that is your choice and I am NOT taking issue with you for that. I appreciate the answer.

I appreciate that most people do not utilise DVD as a source, in fact does anybody ?? It's exactly the techniques they use I'm trying to learn about

Swede

29th September 2002, 22:38

How do you justify the time and effort spent copying commercial DVD's to no obvious advantage to any of the partys involved? Learning time. I can't justify anyone elses time spent but I started all this to save my old VHS-tapes of the kids for a longer time that a tape lasts. That was a couple of years ago and if I'd not spent all that time and effort I wouldn't have got the results I now get.

Oh and: I'm asking a simple question, but as you don't seem to understand it in the 'why' form and would like to play games with words, try: Is still too aggresive/ironic for my taste. I don't have a problem reading english.

GregS

29th September 2002, 22:39

zeroseven ,
Your initial post could have been worded
better .
There are alot of people here doing alot
of different things and for different reasons .
"Ripping Off" implied ... well you figure it out.

I started "backing up" dvds because of my eight
yr. old daughter (fingerprints, scratches ) and
became obsessed with the technology of it .

As for the effort , now I just insert a dvd in
my pc , make a few mouse clicks and in the morning
burn 2 or 3 cds that cost me less than a dollar
including cases .
I also use my pc w/ a tv card as a vcr and video
capture from my videocamera .

Greg

zeroseven

29th September 2002, 22:47

Originally posted by GregS
zeroseven ,
Your initial post could have been worded
better .
....."Ripping Off" implied ... well you figure it out.

Greg

The 'off' was bracketed deliberately, a question within the question to generate discussion and explanation. I am suprised that so many people took it as a finger pointed at them personally.

It was a question, not a statement of accusation.

GregS

29th September 2002, 22:50

Not a problem . :)

zeroseven

29th September 2002, 22:51

Originally posted by Swede

Oh and: Is still too aggresive/ironic for my taste. I don't have a problem reading english.

My irony is lost on myself it seems. Do you mean sarcasm. (Rhetorical ):D

inoteb

2nd October 2002, 00:50

As for me, I'm found of A/V processing techniques. And ripping DVDs is an excellent method to learn a lot of things on the subject. I don't rip a lot of DVD, and guess what : often, the same ripped movie stays on my HD for several months and I encode it several times to test/compare different methods... You realize what a fool I am ? :D
I also make video acquisition (from TV, VHS, DV-camera...), video editing (Premiere) and DivX encoding... sometimes for backup purposes, sometimes just for fun :cool:
What is important is not the time you think we waste, but rather the pleasure we do have (for most of us I think) manipulating A/V files and having fun in this wonderful digital world.
I prefer that to a Quake3 round, am I wrong ? ;) (although sometimes a good - virtual - slaughter is not that bad...)

Regards
inoteb ;-]

zeroseven

2nd October 2002, 11:11

No you're not wrong for a moment, nor are you wasting your time.

My comments regarding wasting time were regarding those who utilise this technology for the sake of saving / making a few dollars burning a 'back up copy'. I completely understand anybody getting satisfaction from such a process.

What suprises me is nobody has a go at recutting scenes for example, after all what you essentially have is a complete set of 'selects' as editors call them. It would be impossible to completely restructure a film obviously without access to the disgarded material but it would be interesting to 'tinker'.

raymondh

2nd October 2002, 18:25

I backup my DVDs (and CDs) to my file server and then use a "home theater PC" to watch the movies on my entertainment center. The movie also gets modulated on an unused cable channel so all of the TV's in the house can watch the movie.

My kids (or wife, or me) can push a button on a touch screen monitor and the movie starts. No fishing for the DVD (that never seemed to get returned to the right case), no issues with the young kids needing to choose the right language/aspect ratio/etc.

It works even better than the cable pay-per-view. That's why I do it.

Ray

zeroseven

2nd October 2002, 19:55

Excellent!! Must be some hard drive!!

stl

2nd October 2002, 21:07

BECAUSE WE CAN

raymondh

2nd October 2002, 23:10

Throw a couple 120 gig drives in a server and at about 1.4 gigs each (including AC3), you can get 150+ movies on demand.

I just ordered another 120 WD 7200 rpm drive from newegg.com for $140.

Ray

biscuit

4th October 2002, 09:41

yeh ray, and what happens when a silly wicked virus comes along and wipes out your machine and/or server -

it happened to me about 3 months ago, i got chernobyl virus, and i lost EVERYTHING that was not backed up on cd-r. major sucky

Phatty2x4

4th October 2002, 17:28

Originally posted by zeroseven
I'm amazed that the majority of questions here seem to relate to copying commercially made DVD's. Forgive me if this is a stupid question, but what’s the point?

07 (heh get it? zeroseven. sigh. sorry very poor play on letters)

I can see some .... hostility to this question here and I will try to be as civil as I can.

The main reason is - because I can. When you dig into the whole process, it is pretty darn neat (uck - such a retro saying... sorry for it!). Seriously though, this happens to be the IT item that has caught my attention for the time being. Is it worth it? Mostly no (if I am doing only a single movie - there's an exception to this rule further down). For the time spent making the back up, for me because I am kinda lazy and impatient, buying another DVD is actually cheaper and usually what I end up doing anyways. But where is the fun in that? With the coping I get to learn about the technology behind making a DVD, mastering a DVD, etc - which I might add, I more than likely would not have gotten into if I never came across a tech board like this that said it could be done.

Another reason, for me at least is the wasted space. I own a ton of anime and with these DVD's and compilations, there are like 2 - 4 episodes on one DVD. To me that's a waste - I prefer to see if I can fit 6 - 8 episodes with reasonable quality onto a DVD. Same with the adult DVD. A large majority of adult movies I own are about an hour long. That is a huge waste! I prefer to put 3 - 6 with reasonable quality loss onto 1 DVD and save space!

Consolidating DVD's also saves on shelf space. For example - Robotech takes up around 24 inches (based upon what collectors kit you own) - I was able to reduce that down to 10 inches by consolidating the collection and then storing the originals back in my computer room.

Anyways - that's just me.

Anyone else gonna step up?

wmansir

4th October 2002, 17:47

Originally posted by biscuit
yeh ray, and what happens when a silly wicked virus comes along and wipes out your machine and/or server -

it happened to me about 3 months ago, i got chernobyl virus, and i lost EVERYTHING that was not backed up on cd-r. major sucky
Since he said each movie is 1.4G I imagine he is also backing up the compressed movies to CD.

@zeroseven

I have made a couple of attempts at re-edits of feature films, but it's very difficult. Re-cutting the video is fairly easy, but the hard part for me was audio.

However, I did manage to insert half a dozen cut scenes back into "Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back", ones that were cut to avoid an NC-17 rating.

Also, you've mentioned a couple of times that people here may be selling copies of movies. I don't think many people here are in it for the money. Your right in thinking that it's not worth the money. Unless you want to invest in a lot of money in CD/DVD burners, Label makers, ect. And if that's the case you had better live in south east asia, or be partial to the idea of living in a small room with a man named Bubba. And believe me, being busted for selling copies of "The Fluffer" ain't gonna help your prison rep.