Changing to DVD - suggested reading

[ux-3]

To me it seems that the haydays of svcd are counted, DVD media seems available at a price comparable to the CDR90 or CDR99 discs. The DVD-toasters are beeing cheaper every day and with Sony's announced +/- burner, the risk of setting on the wrong method is minimized. So it seems to me that many of us here will sooner or later make the jump and dive into DVD recording. The 5.1 or DS2 debate indicates that the interest in multi-channel audio will further accelerate that process.

Those of us, who learned SVCD creation before the spreading of DVD2SVCD, can surely remember how complicated, timeconsuming and frustrating this efford can be and how important any well organized information on the topic can be.

I am planning to get one of these new Sony Toasters when they become available, and perhaps others here are thinking into this direction as well. Perhaps we can use this thread to share and exchange information which will help us in the transition from DVD2SVCD to DVD2DVD and SVCD2DVD. In any case, it would be nice to have some well or at least better informed feedback. That way, this thread would contain "suggested reading" for those who would like to move on to DVD creation.

waiting for yet another "undiscovered country"
ux-3

[hoozdapimp]

down at the bottom of this page (http://www.vcdhelp.com/dvdripping.htm) you can find lots of good information on DVD2DVD...

[UltimateDBZ]

Though the ability to do so will certainly be desired, IMO the conversion from SVCD2DVD is unlikely to become popular, past those users who really like their SVCD collection and don't mind using their quality on DVDs.

Ripping with your favorite ripper, editing with IFOEdit, and burning with your favorite burner, is most likely to be the preferred method given it's speed, and perfect 1:1 quality reproduction.

[LeonMcNichol]

SVCD2DVD would probably just put the 2 to 3 discs on one DVD. For the people who don't like to switch discs.

Right now, I'd rather wait until DVDs are still cheeper to buy. I'm still happy with SVCD conversions. Hell... I don't mind VCD conversions.

But Ultimate is right, the fact you can do editing and just burn w/o any re-encoding is a plus.

[UltimateDBZ]

I was in a chatroom the other day, just seeing what was going on, and a few guys happened to be talking about video encoding. I couldn't help but chuckle when one of them said that blank dvd discs are $50 apeice... I mean, c'mon! So to clarify for those who haven't been keeping tabs on the latest prices of such stuff, you can get a good DVD-RW drive from Pioneer (dvr-a04) for about $250 new. And blank DVD-R media costs anywhere from $2-5, depending on brand and bulk. Prices continue to plummet, and technology continues to soar... now is a great time to buy, folks!

[LeonMcNichol]

No, actually now isn't the great time to buy... You are looking at about $0.10 per CD-R compaired to $5 per DVD-R. The DVD burner costs about 3x the ammount of a CD burner. You are looking at a pretty penny to back them up. I think maybe a few more months (possibly 6) it would be much cheeper and be a good time to buy.

[UltimateDBZ]

Well it's obviously going to be more expensive as going up in technology always is, the point is that prices are as low as they've ever been, and it is a good time to buy (PCWorld, PCMagazine, and ExtremeTech concur). The ease, time savings, 1 disc instead of several, and added quality are enough to make me want to do the switch.. but I have an income of $0 so it's kind hard to ;)

For now, SVCDs will remain the price/quality ratio champion, but those looking ahead are advised to keep a keen eye on DVD merchandise prices.

[hoozdapimp]

i don't know where you buy your dvd-r's at but $5 is way too much...you can find them for around $2 and as low as $1.20 per disc

[ux-3]

Well, the talk about the costs depends on the perspective. I usually use CDR90 for SVCD, and pay about 0,60 Euro for them (60 cents). That is the same price per GB that I would have to pay for DVD.
HOWEVER, I remember clearly the advantage of getting a CD Player in 1983, when they were still as expensive as hell. I am not stuck with a huge record collection, whose playback is hardly supported or desireable by todays standart. I was listening to top quality from then on. All the money invested in Media is still usefull today, which can't be said about the records bought then. And people with huge record collections now have to invest much time in transfering or seeking as CD those old albums. For a moderate premium in initial cost, you can get settled for good (at least for long). All the tricks we learn about SVCD conversion now are soon to be obsolete due to death of format. So I would rather invest my time and curiosity into a field, where the advancement of ability will be usefull for a much longer time.

As a side note, the CD exists for 20 years now, and it doesn't seem to grow obsolete. Given the ability of DVD, I suspect that this format will be around for quite some time too.

[LeonMcNichol]

Actually, because technology is advancing so fast. DVDs are going to be obsolete pretty fast. They are already coming out with this new type CD, which is based on blue light. It can hold a lot more than a DVD. Pretty soon, that will be the replacement.

[UltimateDBZ]

DVDs will _NOT_ even begin to phase out for at least the next 3/4 decade or so. There are always new products being developed, tested, etc. Most fail or are simply discarded for lack of interest. DVDs are booming, and will continue to do so for quite some time.

[ux-3]

I've just done a forum-wide search of the robshot method. Pandora's Box comes to mind... Since it already popped open, it seems that a transition to DVD would at least be faciliated by understanding that method or at least being able to do it properly. The sad thing is, that all articles I looked up, somehow assume you know about these "grey areas", "red lines" and "green lines", which I have to confess to know nothing about. Bach's frequented sticky in the advanced forum seems like 4th year stuff to me. I tried reading but remained clueless due to lack of basic knowledge.

If someone can put a link in here, where one could _start_ reading about this method, this would probably help many, not just me.

I will try to open another _basic_ thread about the method, but for suggested readings, one or more links would make sense.

[markrb]

Sorry, but I just have to chime in on this one.
I agree that right now is NOT a good time to buy DVD recorders, especially for those who have only limited uses for it. The Pioneer unit mentioned is cheap, but very limited in it's recoding capabilities. The new Sony unit looks to help with the Beta/VHS type war that is happening with the DVD-R, DVD-RW, DVD-RAM, DVD+RW, etc...
I am going to wait for this to either flesh out or get so cheap it doesn't matter. Within a year something big will change. Too many like me are standing on the sidelines waiting with money to spend on the winner.

On the Blue Laser CD's. Yes they are working on that for the next generation movie format, but here again we are getting into a VHS/Beta type war. On the one hand several companies have thrown their weight behind this blue technology while others are throwing there weight behind a new higher capacity DVD format(still red). Both will offer about 25GB per side or about 15GB's greater size then the largest DVD. In both cases we are still years away from seeing any actual product based on either of the technologies. Either Home Theater Mag or Sound and Vision had a really good piece on this a couple of months ago. In the not to far off future something with higher space is needed for the Hi-Def videos that are sure to be coming out after 2007, if not before.

In the end I do believe that SVCD's will be out of favor in the not to distant future and DVD's as we know them today will be obsolete a few years further down the line, but such is the fate of any technology.

Mark

[rinkel]

Well.. ok, i'll also say something.

The reason for me to buy a dvdburner is that i don't like the (s)vcd quality. And i like to expand my dvd-collection.
IMHO the prices of the hardware and media are cheap enough for me to make that step. In my country the DVD-movies are about 30 euro, so compared to the 2 euro... it's a nice deal.
And yes the prices are coming down rapidly, so if the + standard will win the race (i have - ), at that time the prices of + will be so low that i can buy another burner again.

AND.... IT'S JUST A LOT OF FUN
And that IMO the most important reason to buy one. Some people buy an expensive video-card of the same price... i bought a DVD-burner

About that blue laser thingie.. that will NOT replace the DVD in the next few years.. DVD is becoming mainstream now. At this time a lot of people bought an expensive home-cinema-system in the expectation that it will last the next 5-10 years and they will not replace that for another one. Afterall: the success of a new product ALWAYS depends on the demand of the customer. Manufactorers can come up with all kinds of new stuff, but if only a few customers will buy it, and not the mainstream, because they already have a home-cinema-system...
This also means that all video-shops will have to replace their expensive collection too... don't think so

[markrb]

rinkel you miss a couple of things on the new higher capicity formats that will be coming out.

First there is backward compatibility. Nobody in their right mind would put out a new higher capicity format that can't read the older format. It would create a nightmare.

Second there really isn't a choice here. Higher capicity is needed. When the US market goes completely Hi-Def the screams for a high Def DVD type video will be enormous and the current DVD format does not have nearly enough space.

Lastly there is the bleeding edge people. The ones that have already adopted Hi-Def Tv's will grab anything that will give them better quality. There is already a willing market for such a device.

This will take time though. Blue laser and the competing higher capicity DVD format are still vaporware for the most part. Although a blue laser has actually been made that works.

The current DVD format will be rather short lived compared to VHS. However you will still be able to watch your current DVD's on whatever wins.

For you DVD burner. Fun is good. I am actually thinking of picking up the new Sony DVD burner that does it all if I can find it at a good price.

Mark

[UltimateDBZ]

Originally posted by markrb
I am actually thinking of picking up the new Sony DVD burner that does it all if I can find it at a good price.I'm planning on the same. One thing that has been irking me since the beginning is the senseless standards battle. I personally think that + will win, have since day 1. But then - is more compatible. I don't understand why there can't be 1 standard that combines the best traits of all others :confused: ... but until that day of utopia arrives, I think I'll pick up the +, - combination drive to get the best of both worlds :)

[dvd2svcd]

IIRC + is the most compatible since it can be used in ordinar standalone DVD players.

[rinkel]

- can also be played in standalone players and in slightly more players.

But somehow i also think that + will winn eventhough i own a - writer