cant get the blockiness out

[vthev1]

Hello,

My pc:
Motherboard: Tyan-Trinity 450(Via Apollo Pro 133a Chipset)
DMA set properly due to the Q&A
Processor: PIII 1.0 Ghz
Memmory: 512 mg PC133
Harddrive: Maxtor 60GB
Video: ATI Radeon 7500
Audio: Creative X-Gamer Live
OS: 98 SE
I use DVD2SVCD 1.0.8 build 1

I seem to be having a problem with blockiness with the movie Knights Tale ntsc widescreen anamorphic 1.85:1. I am not going to post a log for the simple fact there are way to many. I am trying to resolve my issue with one chapter before converting the whole movie. The movie is blocky then it clear's and then comes back. These are all the methods I have been trying: all three of the aspect ratio's, also trying simple, bilinear, bicubic resize(everything from 0.33,0.33 to 0.00, 0.85 using bicubic), I have tried messing with temporal smoother(2,1 & 3,1), I have tried both encoder's. CCE- I adjusted image quality to the lower 20's and adjusted anti-noise into the lower teen's. I also ran the vob in bitrate viewer, which I'll post at the end of my spill. I shut off progressive frames and zigzag scanning because it is (dctype field) but I went ahead and tried it with them checked also. At the time I was using 1.0.8 and I read the issue on the sharpen filter and I installed the proper version of avisynth and tried the sharpen filter from (.4 to .9). Still no resolve. I am not even going to discuss TMPGenc, but I tried it to. But I am curious about the padding that DVD2SVCD put in the latest build, for CQ file sizes. Thanks. Last thing I tried today was pushing the bitrate into the error zone and ran it anyway, and it look's better, but still not right and it won't play on my player. Man, I sound like I am starting to wine. Anyway, basically I am saying that I have tried everything that I know how to try. If you guy's can help I would apreciate it. By the way I view my files on Power DVD and viewing the script in media player always looks perfect. Here's what the bitrateviewer shows:Aspect ratio:16:9 Generic
Framerate: 29.97
Nom. bitrate: 9800000 Bit/Sec
VBV buffer size: 112
Constrained param. flag: No
Chroma format: 4:2:0
DCT precision: 10
Pic. structure: Frame
Field topfirst: Yes
DCT type: Field
Quantscale: Nonlinear
Scan type: Alternate
Frame type: Interlaced
Notes:
If you guy's need more info, I'll be more than happy to send it to you. I can even run that one chapter however, and post the log for you. Thanks again:) VV

[mrbass]

you doing CBR in CCE? If so do TS and get your bitrate above 2200. Otherwise do a 3 or 4 pass VBR bicubic IMO gives the best looking results. Keep your Image quality at 17. Anti noise in the lower teens. By default it is off now as of 1.0.9 b1. I personally never use it for DVD since the source is clean to begin with.

[vthev1]

mrbass,

thanks for the reply. I do cbr for testing then a 4 pass for the whole movie. Here's a log I just ran, I know it's not your recommendations, but I would like your opinion. If it's o.k. to ask that here. I know you can't see what I'm facing. Anyway, I am getting the same results even with this conversion. If you can imagine looking at a anything through 1000 flies flying around, that's basically what the image look's. But what's weird is it goes away then comes back. This movie is kicking my butt. Heres the log: thanks again :)--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 8:49:52 PM
- DVD to SVCD Conversion
- DVD2SVCD ver. 1.0.9 build 1
--------------------------------------------------------
Initializing
Initializing finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 8:49:54 PM
- Free on drive D: 41222.72 mb
- Internal rip
--------------------------------------------------------
Preparing vobfiles to be ripped:
- D:\Movies\Knights Tale\Vts_03_1.vob
- D:\Movies\Knights Tale\Vts_03_2.vob
- D:\Movies\Knights Tale\Vts_03_3.vob
- D:\Movies\Knights Tale\Vts_03_4.vob
- D:\Movies\Knights Tale\Vts_03_5.vob

Ripping: D:\Movies\Knights Tale\Vts_03_1.vob
Ripping finished. Speed: 3246

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 8:50:27 PM
- DVD2AVI
--------------------------------------------------------
Creating DVD2AVI INI file:
- D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\DVD2AVI\DVD2AVI.INI

Variable settings:
iDCT_Algorithm: 32-bit SSE MMX

Executing DVD2AVI.
Executing DVD2AVI. Commandline:
"D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\DVD2AVI\DVD2AVI.exe" -CS=2 -YR=1 -EXIT -OF=[D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\DVD2AVI_Project_file] -IF=[D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\Vts_03_1.vob]
Analyzing DVD2AVI Project file
Force Film activated!
Framerate: 23976
DVD2AVI processing done.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 8:51:06 PM
- Free on drive D: 41108.34 mb
- AUDIO Extraction
--------------------------------------------------------
Found AC3 stream id: 0x80
Filename: D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\Extracted_audio_1.ac3
Audio1 delay: -35 ms
Audio extraction finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 8:51:44 PM
- Free on drive D: 40964.47 mb
- AUDIO conversion
--------------------------------------------------------

Converting Audio to MP2. Filename: D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\Extracted_audio_1.ac3
Executing BeSweet. Commandline:
"D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\BeSweet\BeSweet.exe" -core( -input "D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\Extracted_audio_1.ac3" -output "D:\MOVIES\DVD2SV~1\Encoded_audio_1.mp2" -logfile "D:\MOVIES\DVD2SV~1\Encoded_audio_1.log" ) -azid( -L -3db -c normal -g max ) -ota( -d -35 ) -2lame( -e -b 192 -m s )
Audio conversion of D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\Extracted_audio_1.ac3 finished.

Audio conversion finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 8:52:29 PM
- Free on drive D: 40961.00 mb
- Converting Pictures
--------------------------------------------------------
Converting: D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\DefaultChangeCD.bmp
Finished converting pictures
--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 8:52:36 PM
- Free on drive D: 40960.16 mb
- Video Encoding using Cinema Craft
--------------------------------------------------------

Executing Cinema Craft Encoder.
StreamSectors: 771189188
AudioSectors: 3748612
VideoPAPO: 11888064
ScanOffsetBytes: 4231
SeqAligningBytes: 268916
DVDBytes: 0
VideoEndHeader: 4
SubtitleSectors: 0
EmptySectors: 238.00
PictureSectors: 0.00
PureMPEGStream: 755279360.53
Seconds: 154.06
CalcMPEGStream: 755279360.53
Frames: 3526
CDSize: 740.00
Cut point 735.00
Variable Settings:
Frames: 3526
Anti Noise Filter: 12
Passes: 4
Image Quality: 22
VAF file creation: On
Video Encoding Mode: CBR
Avg. Bitrate: 2500
Aspect Ratio: 16:9 (borders added, encoded as 4:3)

---AVS Begin---
LoadPlugin("D:\VCDTOO~1\DVD2SV~1.9B1\DVD2SVCD\MPEG2DEC\MPEG2DEC.DLL")
mpeg2source("D:\MOVIES\DVD2SV~1\DVD2AV~1.D2V")
Sharpen(.7)
TemporalSmoother(3,1)
BicubicResize(480,360,0.00,0.75)
AddBorders(0,60,0,60)
----AVS End----

Closing program
CCE Max Speed: 0.310
Video Encoding finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 9:00:52 PM
- Free on drive D: 40767.19 mb
- Video Pulldown
--------------------------------------------------------
Executing Pulldown. Commandline:
"D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\pulldown\pulldown.exe" "D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\Encoded_Video_CCE_NTSC.mpv" "D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\Pulldown_Encoded_Video_NTSC.mpv"
Video pulldown finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 9:01:07 PM
- Free on drive D: 40723.31 mb
- Converting Pictures from ES to PS
--------------------------------------------------------
Saving bbMPEG settings: D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\default.ini
--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 9:01:09 PM
- Free on drive D: 40723.28 mb
- Converting Pictures from ES to PS
--------------------------------------------------------
Saving bbMPEG settings: D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\default.ini

Executing RunbbMPEG. Commandline:
"D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\RunbbMPEG.exe" "D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\ChangeCDPicture.bmp.mpg"
--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 9:01:13 PM
- Free on drive D: 40723.19 mb
- Multiplexing and cutting
--------------------------------------------------------
Saving bbMPEG settings: D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\default.ini
Offset in Seconds: 0
Executing bbMPEG.
Variable Settings:
Movie offset: 0 seconds
Cut point: 735 mb

Executing RunbbMPEG. Commandline:
"D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\RunbbMPEG.exe" "D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\bbMPEG_Muxed_File.mpg"
Multiplexing and cutting finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 9:01:25 PM
- Free on drive D: 40674.94 mb
- Determining length of audio
--------------------------------------------------------
Analyzing: D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\bbMPEG_Muxed_File00.mpg
147.120 seconds D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\bbMPEG_Muxed_File00.mpg
Analyzing finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 9:01:32 PM
- Free on drive D: 40674.91 mb
- Creating CD-Images using VCDXBuild
--------------------------------------------------------
- No. of chapters to create: 1

CD image #1: CD_Image_File_CD1.bin

Executing VCDXBuild. Commandline:
"D:\VCD Tools\dvd2svcd 1.0.9b1\DVD2SVCD\VCDImager\VCDXBuild.exe" --verbose --cue-file="D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\CD_Image_File_CD1.cue" --bin-file="D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\CD_Image_File_CD1.bin" "D:\Movies\Dvd2svcd Movies\VCDXBuild_Script_1.xml"
CD-Image creation finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 5/8/02 9:01:41 PM
- Free on drive D: 40624.66 mb
- SVCD Creation finished!
--------------------------------------------------------

[chainsaw135]

I must of missed it in your few messages i read but are you getting blockyness when viewing it on your tv?

[vthev1]

chainsaw135,
thanks for the reply. Yes, it shows up in my tv. After testing a bunch's of cd's, I have found that the image I am viewing in Power DVD as a bin/cue, is pretty true to what I will see on my t.v.

[markrb]

A recent poster was having just about the same issue. It turned out to be a hardware issue on the computer. Grab a copy of Prime95 and Mem86 that are linked in the Q + A. Run the Prime95 torture test and the memory tester of Mem86. Even if you don't think this is it all do it anyway. You would be surprised how many computers that seem 100% stable actually have some minor memory issues.

I see nothing wrong with the log at all. At these settings you should be getting a decent quality SVCD.

This is the thread that is very close to what is happening to you. In the end changing the bios settings to less agressive settings fixed it. If you are overclocking I also strongly suggest you try it at a slower speed.

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23876&highlight=block

So a quick recap:

Get and test your machine with Prime95's torture test and mem86.
Change bios memory settings to a less agressive setting.
Reduce any overclocking.

These programs are very, very sensitve to even the most minor of problems.


Mark

[mrbass]

don't do cbr..do vbr 4 pass one chapter... turn off that anti-noise completely..uncheck it. Where you buying those 74min cds? I can't find them for the life of me only 80min exists.

also do what markrb said btw it's memtest86 search on google not mem86.


Image quality priority default 17
This setting decides priority among image areas which the encoder assigns to allocate the bit amount. 0 to 100 can be specified. The initial value is 25. As the value becomes closer to 0, a higher bit amount is allocated to complicated images areas. As the value becomes closer to 100, a higher bit amount is allocated to flat image areas. When the value is close to 0, the mosquito noise at the edges (noise causing hazy part along the edges, looking like flying mosquitoes) is less outstanding, but the contouring noise (noise which looks like contour line patterns, which appear in flat and wide areas, such as a dark background) is more outstanding. The opposite occurs when the value is closer to 100.

[vthev1]

markrb and mrbass,
Thanks a bunch for the replies. I would be a lost puppy without you guy's and this forum. I am gonna to go after those testing programs right away Mark. Thanks. I'll post back with the results. Mrbass, sorry to be misleading on the cd size I clicked default settings before raising the bitrate. I use 80 min. verbatin datalife plus for the moviies. And thanks for the settings tip, I'll use those on my next try, and post back results. Thanks again guy's! :)

[Holomatrix]

I noticed that Force Film was activated with a framerate of 29.97. I did a movie like what biterate viewer is describing and used ForceFilm off, 'Telecine' deinterlace make sure you uncheck progressive and zigzag in CCE and try again. Turned out great for me.
Good luck

[vthev1]

Markrb,

Hope you haven't given up on me yet! I was delayed a day starting the test you prescribed, and Prime 95 is still currently running. Memtest 86 v.2.9 ran for a couple of days but did not come up with any error's. I have often wondered if I actually ever got this pc set up properly. When I started tinckering with DVD's, I had a Compaq AMD K-6 533 and it was terribly slow. So I got with a local computer guy, and we ordered a case, motherboard, power supply, processor, fan etc... He helpled me mount the motherboard, processor and processor fan and basically wire power/reset switches, power led's you know stuff like that. Then I brought it home, did the rest. Formatting the hard drive, setting up motherboard bios , all that stuff. The reason why I'm sharing this with you is because more than likely I have made a mistake. This system is supposed to have a turbo mode, and for the life of me I could never get it to take properly. So it's running in standard. Also I have wondered about my OS for the simple fact that I ran across a tid bit of information that 98 se does not recognize memory sizes above 128mg. True or false I don't know. I can shut down basically eveything on this pc and my resources will be at 74%. With one stick of 512mg, I wouldn't even think you could scratch the surface.

As far as changing memory settings in the bios, do you mean in windows or in the motherboard. I've got a full manual on my motherboard, but I'm still not sure what I need to change

Overclocking is a very foreign term to me. From reading about it, if this is happening, it's not because I am trying to do it. I'll tweak on stuff but I kinda like to know what I'm doing and what the end result is going to be.

Anyway, I don't want this to be a thorn in your side, but I am very interested in both the movie making process and computer's. Thanks for all the help :)


Holomatrix,
Thanks for the tip and setting, but I am going to make sure my computer is good before trying again:)

[markrb]

First it's false that Win98 SE doesn't use any more then 128mb. The actual amount is closer to 512mb. It still uses over 512 mb, but not very good.

The bios settings are the ones in the Bios in the motherboard. Most specifically the ones dealing with memory.
What motherboard do you have? Specific make and model. I will look it up and suggest a couple of settings.

Do you have anti-virus or other software that runs all the time. Most times it will be on the bottom bar on the right side next to the clock. Even these things eat up resources. Close everything there you can including anti-virus software.
74% sounds a bit low, but it depends on what loads on startup.
Have a friend look at it and see what loads up.

Mark

[vthev1]

Markrb,

I don't have any virur software on this computer. When Windows loads, everything in the world comes up, but I shut them down one at a time. Basically what I have running right know is: Systray,Atiptaxx, Loadqm,Point32, Stimon, Desk98,viewport. I can't shut down the ATI in the taskbar, which is my video card, but it has 64 mg DDR onboard. I thought that would help me, but I don't know. System resources shows 73%. I am networked through a router to my wifes computer, but we share a internet connection and printer thats all. And I definitely know when she is trying to print. I just shut down that other computer and my resources didn't change, so I don't think that's it.

My motherboard is a S2507S Trinity 450 (Tyan Computers). Everything is basically set from the factory. I am going to try and scan some images and paste them for you to see what's in the book.

Thanks Mark

[chainsaw135]

@vthev1 hey have you checked how low you are running on resources after a cold boot? Reason why i ask is for myself i preferred atleast 90% free after a cold boot so 74% Seems a bit low try doing this

goto start run and type msconfig
when the menu pops up take out some of those items in the startup tab that you dont need, try to get up near 90 or above ..

[vthev1]

Markrb,
See what you think about this:



3.2-0. Memory
You cannot change any values in the Memory fields, as they are shown only for your information. The fields show the total installed random access memory (RAM) and amounts allocated to base, extended, and other memory. RAM is the computer's working memory, where the computer stores programs and data currently being used, so that they are accessible to the CPU. RAM is counted in kilobytes (KB. approximately one thousand bytes) and megabytes (MB: approximately one million bytes). Modern per- sonal computers may contain up to 128, 256 MB, or more.

Base Memory:

Typically 640KB. Also called conventional memory. The DOS operating system and conventional applications use this area.


Extended Memory:

Above the 1MB boundary. Early IBM personal computers could not use memory above 1 MB, but current PCs and their software can use extended memory.

Other Memory:

Between 640KB and 1 MB; often called high memory. DOS may load terminate-and-stay (TSR) programs in this area, such as device drivers, to free as much conventional memory as possi- ble for applications. Lines in your config.sys file that start with loadhigh, load programs into high memory, for example.

Other sections consist of:
Advanced BIOS features: to alter settings of how the computer boots.
Advanced Chipset features: describes settings for the chipset.
Intergrated Peripherals
Power management Setup
PnP/PCI Configuration and
PC Health

I hope this information will help, thanks a bunch!

[vthev1]

Thanks chainsaw135,

That got it up to 86%. I'm gonna try again for 90%.

[markrb]

That is software DOS's use of memory. It has nothing to do with Bios settings. I am talking about memory timings. Look at the motherboard manual for Bios settings like, 1T or 2T, CAS, Interleave, etc... You do not change these settings from with windows. You must hit the DEL key during the first part of booting. You will get a blue Bios screen. For me to know what settings you have I need to know the exact motherboard you are using (example, Asus, TU-SLC).

To learn about PC's go to these sites and read up. www.anandtech.com www.tomshardware.com www.amdmb.com

Mark

[vthev1]

chainsaw135,

I've only got two items checked: System Tray and Run=, and I was scared to death to uncheck those. Resouces at 92%. Thanks a whole bunch. I'm going to run a couple of chapters and see what happens.

Thanks again!!

[vthev1]

markrb,

Sorry, I thought I was helping. I have been in and out of those bios
all day. I saw these settings but I thought they were for the chipset only. I'll try again:

I have four banks, this is what the bios are showing:

Bank 0/1 DRAM TIMING [sdram 8/10 ns], the other threee banks are set the same. I have four other choices Normal,Medium, Fast and Turbo.
Is 8/10 ns to agressive?

There is also SDRAM Cycle Length [3], Bank Interleave [Disabled], Memory Hole [Disabled], System Bios Cacheable [Diabled].

Hope this will help, and sorry I am a rookie computer user.

[chainsaw135]

@vthev1 i myself have always enabled System Bios, also i would change the 8/10ns back to normal.


Also if you can come back and let us know if anything has improved.

[vthev1]

chainsaw135,

Thanks, I appreciate it. I'll change it over, and try to run a chapter.

Thanks alot!

[markrb]

Change it to normal the other things look Ok.


Mark

[vthev1]

Markrb,

You not going to believe this, after all this work today, my pc won't even try to boot after saving the change to normal. It's set at Medium right know. Thanks for your patience.