svcd subtitle not work for DVD2SVCD v1.0.8b1

[teacafe]

I have a standalond SVCD player which is capable to playback and switch SVCD subtitles for those SVCDs created by DVD2SVCD v1.0.7b4.

Few days ago I started to backup TWO dvds using DVD2SVCD v1.0.8b1.
As before, I enabled ripping substitles to use SVCD subtitles. Also, I selected Yellow as Primary Color 1(Font) for the subtitle palette.

Once the conversion is completed. I tried to play these new created SVCDs(4 CDs for 2 movies) using my SVCD player. Susprisely, none of these SVCDs could display the SVCD subtitles on my TV.

I just wonder to know if there are lucky guys who can make SVCDs sucessfully with SVCD subtitles using v1.0.8b1? If you were, did you change the default subtitle palette?

Any advises or suggestions on the above mentioned problem are welcome.

Thanks for help in advance.

[dvd2svcd]

Did you also try using the CVD subtitles. Most players seems to be happier with CVD subs than with SVCD subs.

[Arianos]

IF your player (which is...?) supports SVCD subs, you should be able to see at least some subs. I've seen cases of some "odd" players, which support SVCD subs with a twist: Leave the player running with the movie about 5 minutes, pause, play again, and it shows SVCD subs. Unpractical, aggreed, but it shows them. Originally they support CVD subs, but then again, not always. The mentioned players are a Mustek and a Scott.
Way to "check" whether Submux indeed does the work:
Wait till Submux starts, maximize it's window. If nothing shows, you're OK. If messages appear, it's "Uh-Oh" time.

[teacafe]

I am living in HongKong. The SVCD player AB117R is made in China with the brand name BBK. Because I already had an all-coded Sony DVD player S3000 which was under warranty by HongKong Sony(No need to modify the player and take risk to voliate the services terms). So, I only spent a tight budget for a SVCD capable player. Of course, the compatibility of SVCD is also one of my major concern.

Before DVD2SVCD supported SVCD subtitles, I had tried many times of conversion with CVD subtitles, but all of these trials failed to display sutbtitles on AB117R. At that time, I was forced to use the permanent subtitle option.

I take the advantage of SVCD subtitles until DVD2SVCD supports it. It works fine on the AB117R and It can switch between subtitles without any synchronizing problems. The player takes the first lyrics as the default(I guess the people of China mainland love to sing Karaoke) playback mode. So, it always display the first SVCD subtitle when it starts to play.

I have never tried of CVD subtitles once DVD2SVCD supports SVCD subtitles. All the conersion working files are still saved in my HD. Is it possible to do a recovery starting from the muxing/cutting stage using CVD subtitles instead of the SVCD subtitles? If it was possible, I am willing to try it although the AB117R does not support CDRW.

I just read another post on CVD subtitles. Is my problem also caused by the default X/Y-position vaule -1?


Thanks you for your helpings.

[Arianos]

You said SVCD subs worked for you for v1.0.7b4. The muxing program for them is the same on both versions. To my knowledge (and I'm very sensitive on the SVCD type subs matter) they work exactly the same as in the previous versions, with the added bonus of "sticking" colour palette. However as dvd2svcd is a very complex, although user-friendly program, I wouldn't rule out any option.
You said that the AB117R does not support CVD subs. If I were you I would follow the Author's suggestion and do some further testings on CVD subs, e.g. I-Author ones and VCDXbuild ones, as a Chinese made SVCD player is highly probable to support CVD type subs.
I know that includes the making of at least one coaster (no CDRW support) but if you want to rule out some options, that's the price to pay :( . Try converting a small chapter from scratch EACH time using the different methods and put them on a disc.

Also, on the SVCD-kind front:
I would mess a little with the position of the subs, but I have yet to find a movie where I had to change the default -1.
Also, you don't mention anything on my suggestion for "checking" (which I highly recommend), so I suppose at least your log file in the "critical" matter looks something like this:

.........
--------------------------------------------------------
- 4/28/2002 7:38:34 PM
- Free on drive C: 8442.00 mb
- Multiplexing SVCD Subtitles
--------------------------------------------------------
Muxing English subtitles, CD 1
Executing SubMux. Commandline:
"C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\winsubmux_0[1].0.1.8\WinSubMux.exe" -s0 "C:\SG1_306_POINT_OF_VIEW\bbMPEG_Muxed_File00.mpg" "C:\SG1_306_POINT_OF_VIEW\Subs\en1-1.sub" "C:\SG1_306_POINT_OF_VIEW\bbMPEG_Muxed_File-subbed00.mpg"
Muxing subtitles finished
........
If not, your subs are not there in the first place.
I'm sorry, but I ran out of solutions here. :)
Good Luck! :)

[teacafe]

I tried this checking "Leave the player running with the movie about 5 minutes, pause, play again, and it shows SVCD subs.", It didn't work for the AB117R no matter it has playing 5mins, 10mins, or 20mins.

I upload the subtitle bmp, sub, txt files and you may have a look on them if you like to.
http://site.voila.fr/dvd2svcd/zh100001.bmp
http://site.voila.fr/dvd2svcd/en200001.bmp
http://site.voila.fr/dvd2svcd/zh1_1.sub
http://site.voila.fr/dvd2svcd/zh1_1.txt
http://site.voila.fr/dvd2svcd/dvd2svcd_log.txt

I ran a recovery starting from muxing/cutting. When the SubMux was running, I maximized the SubMux DOS window. There was nothing shown on it except a blinking curson on the most top-left conner. But, the HD LED was flashing for one or two minutes to indicate the SubMux process was accessing the HD heavily.

It is my first time to use the Subtitle palette in the Subtitles Tab. Before that, I selected the output color for each subtitle when DVD2SVCD prompted the subtitles screen.


Beneath is the log of a recovery run starting from muxing/cutting:
--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:14:21
- DVD to SVCD Conversion
- DVD2SVCD ver. 1.0.8 build 1
--------------------------------------------------------
Initializing
Initializing finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:14:37
- Free on drive D: 12267.16 mb
- Crash Recovery
- Restarting from: Muxing and Cutting
--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:14:40
- Free on drive D: 13835.84 mb
- Converting Pictures from ES to PS
--------------------------------------------------------
Saving bbMPEG settings: C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\default.ini
--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:14:42
- Free on drive D: 13835.84 mb
- Converting Pictures from ES to PS
--------------------------------------------------------
Saving bbMPEG settings: C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\default.ini
--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:14:44
- Free on drive D: 13835.84 mb
- Multiplexing and cutting
--------------------------------------------------------
Saving bbMPEG settings: C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\default.ini
Offset in Seconds: 2
Executing bbMPEG.
Variable Settings:
Movie offset: 2 seconds
Cut point: 784 mb

Executing RunbbMPEG. Commandline:
"C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\RunbbMPEG.exe" "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File.mpg"
Length of D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File00.mpg
2857 Seconds
Offset in Seconds: 2859
Executing bbMPEG.
Variable Settings:
Movie offset: 2 seconds
Cut point: 784 mb

Executing RunbbMPEG. Commandline:
"C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\bbMPEG\RunbbMPEG.exe" "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File.mpg"
Multiplexing and cutting finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:28:40
- Free on drive D: 12267.13 mb
- Determining length of audio
--------------------------------------------------------
Analyzing: D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File00.mpg
2859.833 seconds D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File00.mpg
Analyzing: D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File01.mpg
2956.356 seconds D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File01.mpg
Analyzing finished.

Saving Subtitle Timecodes.
SVCD subtitles.
Length of D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File00.mpg
2859
Length of D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File01.mpg
2956
--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:30:37
- Free on drive D: 12267.13 mb
- Multiplexing SVCD Subtitles
--------------------------------------------------------
Muxing Chinese subtitles, CD 1
Executing SubMux. Commandline:
"C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\SubMux\SubMux.exe" -s0 "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File00.mpg" "D:\dvdtemp\zh1-1.sub" "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File-subbed00.mpg"
Muxing English subtitles, CD 1
Executing SubMux. Commandline:
"C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\SubMux\SubMux.exe" -s1 "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File-subbed00_tmp.mpg" "D:\dvdtemp\en2-1.sub" "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File-subbed00.mpg"
Muxing Chinese subtitles, CD 2
Executing SubMux. Commandline:
"C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\SubMux\SubMux.exe" -s0 "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File01.mpg" "D:\dvdtemp\zh1-2.sub" "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File-subbed01.mpg"
Muxing English subtitles, CD 2
Executing SubMux. Commandline:
"C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\SubMux\SubMux.exe" -s1 "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File-subbed01_tmp.mpg" "D:\dvdtemp\en2-2.sub" "D:\dvdtemp\bbMPEG_Muxed_File-subbed01.mpg"
Muxing subtitles finished
--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:38:58
- Free on drive D: 12267.13 mb
- Creating CD-Images using VCDXBuild
--------------------------------------------------------
- No. of chapters to create: 6

CD image #1: CD_Image_File_CD1.bin

Executing VCDXBuild. Commandline:
"C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\VCDImager\VCDXBuild.exe" --cue-file="D:\dvdtemp\CD_Image_File_CD1.cue" --bin-file="D:\dvdtemp\CD_Image_File_CD1.bin" "D:\dvdtemp\VCDXBuild_Script_1.xml"
--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:41:49
- Free on drive D: 12267.13 mb
- Creating CD-Images using VCDXBuild
--------------------------------------------------------
- No. of chapters to create: 6

CD image #2: CD_Image_File_CD2.bin

Executing VCDXBuild. Commandline:
"C:\Program Files\DVD2SVCD\VCDImager\VCDXBuild.exe" --cue-file="D:\dvdtemp\CD_Image_File_CD2.cue" --bin-file="D:\dvdtemp\CD_Image_File_CD2.bin" "D:\dvdtemp\VCDXBuild_Script_2.xml"
CD-Image creation finished.

--------------------------------------------------------
- 2002/5/1 AM 09:44:34
- Free on drive D: 12267.13 mb
- SVCD Creation finished!
--------------------------------------------------------


I will try out other checkings as you suggested and I will post the findings on here once completed.

Thanks you again.

[teacafe]

1st Test:

The following settings is used to do a test on non-permanent subtitle:
- select CVD subtitle for Chinses only
- Std. Y-Pos NTSC/PAL is set to 400
- change the primary color 1 of subtitle palette to yellow at the Subtitles Tab
- use VCDXBuild to create the CD images
- use One pass VBR and disable the Deinterlace to speed up the trial process

Result:
The AB117R still cannot display subtitle on the screen.


2nd Test:
Uninstalled the DVD2SVCD. Then, Re-installed the 1.07b1 and upgraded it to build 4. Test only for a single chapter with Chinese SVCD subtitle using VCDXBuild to create CD image.

Result :
Failed to display subtitle on screen.


3rd Test:
Uninstalled the DVD2SVCD. Then, Re-installed the 1.07b1 and upgraded it to build 3. Test only for a single chapter with Chinese SVCD subtitle using VCDXBuild to create CD image.

Result :
Failed to display subtitle on screen.


CONCULSION:
What is going wrong with me? Please help? S.O.S.

[Arianos]

If you are absolutely, positively, 100% sure that SVCD selectable subs work(ed) on your player with 1.0.7.b4, I would go back to that.
Also as a last resort, I would visit two friends:
One with a confirmed svcd sel. subs DVD player, and one with a CVD capable player, and test the SVCD and CVD test discs.

[teacafe]

Thanks you very much for you still to keep patience to follow up my problem.

I submit a search on the forum to include all the threads I posted. From this thread (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11256) or this one (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11612), I guarantee that my player can play SVCD subtitles starting from v1.0.5 build 1.

But, I am not sure whether the 1.07b4 is the last DVD2SVCD release worked for SVCD subtitles. So, I takes out all the SVCD subtitles enabled SVCD disces I created few weeks before(actually, I have never made any CVD subtitled disces, for those SVCDs can be switched on/off subtitles must be SVCD subtitled disces), I checked the XML file inside the Extra directory, the latest release is v1.06 Build 4

In order to further proof of the disces are SVCD subtitles enabled, I use the De-multiplex option of TMPGenc in the MPEG Tools to browse the mpeg file in the directory MPEG2. If I am not wrong, addtional stream other than audio and video will be added for each of CVD subtitle. If the mpeg file only includes padding_stream, video_stream and audio_strem, it would not be a CVD subtitle SVCD. But, one of the SVCD shows there is a private_stream_1(0x70)???? What is the purpose of this stream?

Then, I do a test on v1.06b4 :
I un-installed the DVD2SVCD and re-installed the v1.06b4.
Test only for a single chapter with Chinese SVCD subtitle using VCDXBuild to create the CD image.

Result :
Still failed to display subtitle on screen.

Surprise to me!!! Why the SVCD created using v1.06b4 still failed to display the SVCD subtitle? Is SVCD subtitles feature not worked in single chapter conversion? If it was, then the testing results on v1.07b3 or v1.07b4 cannot reflect the normal capabilites of DVD2SVCD.

[Arianos]

The logs and the bitmaps you sent as attachments on your previous post, seem OK. And the "restored SubMux window" test shows they are muxed. They SHOULD work.
As a last resort I would test the latest conversions on a friend's DVD player. Maybe it's a player's "strange unwanted feature", and not dvd2svcd's. I'm lost....

I often do one chapter tests, and the subs always work, except when I was really playfull, and tried changing the position. That taught me to always trust the "Default -1". I don't know. I'm equally as baffled as you on the problem.
As for the extra stream, let's hope someone with more knowledge on the subject gets interested on your thread :(

Anyway, I remember both threads you mentioned, as I follow all sub threads :)
In Greek DVDs I often encounter the "greyed third colour" but using Black-Yellow(or white)-Outline(or black)-Black as output gets me results every time. I have never tried Red as the last colour, but apparently it works for Poohy. Also, changing ONLY the second colour from white to yellow didn't help me any. I HAD to change the last colour to Black also.

Last minute flash! Can you try a chapter test using a regular, made in the USA, NTSC dvd? I remember when I once tried converting a Chinese DVD (Monsters inc) that I encountered all kinds of weird problems. Maybe it's a problem of the actual source DVD. Just a shot in the dark here...

[teacafe]

Just do another test on both of v1.06b4 and v1.08b1 as you suggested.

Testing on a single chapter of USA NTSC DVD. Now My player can switch on/off the SVCD subtitle of the SVCDs created by v1.06b4 and v1.08b1. Bingo!!

Then, what is wrong with the questioned chinese movie? Any suggestions or comments? I had converted five to six chinese movies into SVCD format which is working fine on SVCD subtitles.

Is Monster Inc a Chinese movie? When I say Chinese movie, I mean the movie is speaking in Chinese Languages or it has Chinese subtitles. I am worrying you misunderstand my meanings.

Thanks you.

[Arianos]

:)
Well, finding the source of the problem is one thing, solving it is quite another :(
I would be (and am) quite happy though, that it's not dvd2svcd's problem.
If I had plenty of space, I would keep the VOBs on my Hard Disc till something new came along, but till then, I would encode (or keep the encoded movie) without subs.
Also I would try a Chapter-test-encode with the new version of dvd2svcd, with the new WinSubMux. But I wouldn't hold my breath...

As for Monsters Inc, it's a DVD made in China. It is cartoon, English speaking and has English, Chinese, Malay and Thai subtitles. In my case, I had chosen the English subtitles only, without a problem.
Apparently, made-in-China DVDs are somehow out of specifications, so that may be why these particular subtitles fail. Same things sometimes happen with locally made (E.G. Greek only, or French only) DVDs, usually from small companies, who try to cut corners on cost.
I would be thankful that nothing is wrong with dvd2svcd, my PC and my player and move on to the next happy encoding :)

[teacafe]

Thanks you very much for your detail explanation and helpful suggestions.

[teacafe]

Just tried a test on 1.09b2pre2.
Testing on a single chapter for both of the chinese and English SVCD subtitles with default palette.

Result:
Cannot display subtitle on the screen.


As you guess the subtitle problem may be caused by the DVD manufacture producing out of specification's DVDs. IMHO, these DVDs can play on my Sony S3000 DVD player and subtitles can be selected to display as usual. I think these DVDs are still conformed to the DVD standard. More than that, the subtitle ripping process is capable to fetch out both of the BMPs and xx#-#.txt(eg. zh1-1.txt) correctly. That means the DVD subtitle specification is OK, too.

The problem turns to the the sumbmux/WinSubMux process. It uses the non-subtitle-mpeg and based on the xx#-#.txt information to create the bbMPEG_Muxed_File-subbed##.mpg.


I don't want to blame the said problem caused by DVD2SVCD or the orignal DVD. But, just want to collect adequated informations for all of the great guys here to solve this problem may be met next time.

If you still have any suggestions, please let me know.