Question regarding Hauppauge WinTV-HD

[neo_sapien]

Is there an option to save the audio stream of an HDTV broadcast as it is received and displayed, as sort of a direct stream copy (at the end of the recording, will you have an x minute long AC3 or MPA file?)

Can you also direct stream copy the video stream, for later GKnot encoding, or would that cause massive dropped frames on my dual IBM60GXP RAID 0 setup?

Can anyone enlighten me on the workings of the Hauppauge WinTV-HD when it comes to capturing?

Thanks for your time :)

<rant>
For half a year I've been trying to get good quality on capping Enterprise episodes, and the broadcast Clone War trailer really woke me up to the desparity of the situation. Radio signals just suck when compared to modern tech like DVD's, and even digital cable is only 2Mbps per channel (thanks Comcast)
</rant>

[ParkerV]

The latest release of WinTV-HD drivers/software does support raw "transport stream capture" straight to a file.

I do this occasionally with my WinTV-HD card.

Much like a VOB file on a DVD that can contain both multiple video tracks (like a wide-screen version and a pan-scan version)and mutiple audio tracks (like French and English), a HDTV transport stream contains digital video and audio that can be de-multiplexed out with the appropriate application (Xmuxer, DVTools, TMPG tools, stc.).

HDTV transport streams are just big MPEG-2 files that need to be demuxed in the component streams. If you know how to work with an AC3 stream, you are in business.

If you don't have at least 20GIGs free hard drive space, don't even bother trying to capture the transport stream. You'll need 10 for the capture and another 5 to 10 to work with it.

[neo_sapien]

My NTFS data partition (which i use for divx editing) has a 92.5 gig capacity, so I think I could manage that.

I know about playing and muxing AC3 files, if that's what you mean.

What is the resolution of a common widescreen video stream? May I see a screenshot? Your reply has pretty much gotten me very hyped up for getting an HDTV card. Can you imagine a DivX rip of Enterprise with that beauty? 1 CD/episode, at least 1.7 Mbits for the video stream, dependant upon the audio size.

[ParkerV]

Here is the deal on broadcast resolution... it varies by channel and show.

A 'HDTV' tuner must support 18 types of digital broadcast. All 18 types are not, however, considered 'high-definition'.

A HDTV broadcast is by definition a 16:9 sized picture in either a 1080i (interlaced) or 720p(progressive) resolution.

All other sizes (i.e. 4:3 sized picturees) and other resolutions are frequently referred to as SDTV or Standard Digital TeleVision. Typically, these are 480i or 480p broadcasts. Some letterbox broadcasts are not really 'high-definition'- just SDTV with a 16:9 aspect ration.

To further complicate things,the resolution of the broadcast depends on the show and the channel that broadcasts it. Some shows are HDTV and others are SDTV. Although even SDTV offers picture improvements over analog TV (especially if it is a progressive resolution).

As for buying a WinTV-HD card... be careful. They cards are not exactly mainstream or friendly and they are not well supported.

You have 3 basic choices for a HDTV capture card:
1) Hauppauge WinTV-HD
2) Telemann HiPix
3) AccessDtv

AccessDtv is the newest an best supported of the lot but does not save the stream in raw format. AccessDtv claims the stream is encrypted to prevent illegal copying but in reality it is a simple distortion to the sych byte. A fix has been in the AccessDtv forum on Yahoo since November.

Telemann is a decent card with its own quirks. Poorly supported but with a strong user group.

WinTv-HD is the ugly step child of the Hauppauge family. If you want WinXp support - don't bother asking. I have already tried.

Hope that helps.

[neo_sapien]

AccessDtv is the newest an best supported of the lot but does not save the stream in raw format. AccessDtv claims the stream is encrypted to prevent illegal copying but in reality it is a simple distortion to the sych byte. A fix has been in the AccessDtv forum on Yahoo since November.

So I wouldn't be able to save an original widescreen video track and 1 or 2 original audio tracks?

Telemann is a decent card with its own quirks. Poorly supported but with a strong user group.

Would this card allow me to save an original widescreen video track and 1 or 2 original audio tracks?

WinTv-HD is the ugly step child of the Hauppauge family. If you want WinXp support - don't bother asking. I have already tried.

I have a triple-boot system. Win98, Win2K, WinXP. If one OS doesn't work right the hardware, I could switch to another. I don't mind the hassle so long as I can get DVD-quality tv, especially enterprise.

How hard would it be to enable an HDTV card to do what I want, with regards to transport stream saving, or just saving 3 of the component streams? I have experience with the capabilities of my ATI TV Wonder PCI. I consider myself an intermediate user with regards to that.

BTW, I really appreciate you taking time out of your day to help me out with this info :)

[ParkerV]

All three HDTV cards allow you to capture the raw MPEG2 Transport Streams.

Capturing a HDTV stream is actually simpler than analog capture on a ATI All-in-Wonder board in that you don't have to fool around with any AVI/MPEG capture settings. The transport stream is already in MPEG-2 format. You just start the capture and hope you have enough hard drive space.

The only quirk with the AccessDTV capture is the need to apply a patch from the Yahoo AccessDtv forum that adjusts a synch byte distortion that the AccessDtv software makes to prevent illegal copying. Without that patch you can replay the captured TS file with the AccessDTV card but external software packages can't, however, read the transport stream properly (operations like stream demuxing fail). You have to patch the TS files to be able to demux them into the elemental streams.

As to what is actually contained in that Transport Stream is totally up to your local broadcast/ cable network. If may contain a single program stream (1 audio + 1 video) or can contain multiple programs.

Using 'Enterprise' as an example, Paramount more than likely produces a high-definition version of this program in 1080i resolution. The UPN network that broadcasts that show does not, however, have to broadcast at 1080i resolution. They may choose to broadcast at SDTV resolution. Additionally, your local UPN affiliate may not have the equipment to broadcast HDTV resolution.

The answer is it all depends. But if it is broadcasted in your area at HDTV resolution, you can capture it with any of these three cards.

All three card a little flaky but managable. Yahoo has user groups for both the HiPix card and AccessDtv card. Not sure about WinTV-HD.

[neo_sapien]

Hey ParkerV, it's been 6 months and I thought I'd ask you for an update. Looks like I'll be getting an HDTV capture card if I do well this semester in college, and I wanted to know if AccessDTV is still looking like a good bet, or if a new HDTV card has come out.

BTW, how do people get access to HBO, Cinemax etc HDTV channels? They can't be over the air, because they're premium channels. Do you have to get a DirecTV and become a subscriber to that? I heard somewhere that DirecTV carries HDTV signals. I currently have Comcast digital cable, and I've never heard of Comcast delivering HDTV channels on their lineup.

[ParkerV]

neo_sapien,

DirecTV is the only sure bet.

Your cable provider may or may not carry HDTV. Don't rely on customer service - ask to speak to technical support.

As far as cards go, the new card in town is MyHD and can be found at www.digitalconnection.com . AccessTV is a decent card with weak support.

ParkerV

[neo_sapien]

Thanks for your reply,

Would you recommend the MyHD over the others, then? How manageable is it compared to the other 3 cards?

[ParkerV]

Choosing a HDTV card boils down to long-term support.

MyHD has the most active manufacturer support at the moment. HiPix on the other hand has an active user group doing card development.

AccessTV comes in third with Hauppauge in a distant fourth.

Buy a HiPix or MyHD. Toss a coin as to which will have better long term support.

ParkerV

[neo_sapien]

Hi again,

How is it possible to capture the transport stream from a premium DirecTV HD channel(HBO HD, Showtime HD, HDnet, etc)? It seems to me that in order to receive those channels you have to have a DirecTV HD receiver, and an access card on that receiver, and it could get to your capture card maybe via S-Video/composite from the HD receiver, but by that time the signal is decoded.

[ParkerV]

neo_sapien,

It is not currently possible to capture a HD transport stream with DirectTV. The current crop of decoder boxes only have analog output -not digital.

There was a work-around for DishNet at www.169time.com but there is no solution for direct DirectTV decoders.

Hopefully, some manufacturer will add a firewire port to a DirectTV box some time in the near future.

ParkerV

[neo_sapien]

Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Thanks for the response :)

[neo_sapien]

I've ordered the MyHD card for $338 from digitalconnection, and I'll use the coaxial cable that came with my Inspire 5700 speakers for audio output.

Keep your fingers crossed on my behalf...hopefully in a week or less I'll be getting Enterprise in High-def quality :)

:D

EDIT~(reading up now on what dvd2avi mod I need to use for transport streams)Also, how do I figure out what the PID of the ts is for inputting it into dvd2avi? Will the MyHD software indicate the PID?

[Robstarusa]

How has your experience been with the MyHD card ?

Rob

[neo_sapien]

The package will likely arrive on Friday.

UPDATE~It didn't arrive on Friday, apparently at 7:00am on Friday it left a sorting place in Ohio, which is about 600 miles away. It'll probably be here Monday or Tuesday.