Set Top Playback Problems

[Scrapps]

Hi people,

It is entirely possible that I am being fairly dumb here and missing something but I have been through all the guides here and at Derrow's and Robshot's sites and can't seem to solve my problem.

I have succesfully ripped a number of dvd titles now and followed the reauthoring approach using CCE and Scenarist then burning with Prassi to my Pioneer A03 to produce a disc that plays fine on my Sony DVP-S7700 set top dvd player.

My problems concern the use of IfoEdit to achieve the same result, I followed the various guides and tried a number of IfoEdit revisions including the latest version 0.9 and always with the same result. Prassi refuses to burn the IfoEdit projects so I used Nero 5.5.7 which burns them without complaint. The resulting disc plays fine on my PC using PowerDVD or my Hollywood plus but fails on my set top with an error code c.13

I then tried the approach of making a disk image from IfoEdit which Prassi was quite happy to burn but again would not play on my set top.

I assume that this is a sector address issue since I understand that the PC doesn't care about sector addressing so much.

While reading through this forum I came across a thread where someone suggested that Gear Pro DVD was the best package to use for burning, I installed Gear Pro DVD 6.0 and get an error whenever I try to burn a project that has been processed through IfoEdit.

The error is always the same and says something like "Load error on file VTS_01_0.IFO. File cannot be loaded at the required address (640) because the address is already occupied. First available load address is 659." This error seems to corelate with the problems i'm having with playback on my set top player.

I tried ripping a dvd that I knew was small enough to burn without modification and loaded it into Gear Pro DVD with no problems, I then used IfoEdit to remove a soundtrack, made sure to hit "Get VTS sectors" as a final step and then tried to load it into Gear Pro again. It failed with the same error message as above.

If what Gear Pro is telling me is correct then it seems I am completely unable to do any processing in IfoEdit without ending up with a project that once burned to DVD-R will not play back on my set top.

All suggestions would be greatly appreciated since i'm sure there must be an explanation but at this stage it completely eludes me.

[Kanector]

Scrapps:

Add a VIDEO_TS.VOB file to the folder, do 'Get VTS Sectors', and then try Gear again. Should work fine this time.

BTW any VIDEO_TS.VOB file will work so if you get a very small one it's worth saving and using it every time.

[Scrapps]

Thanks for the reply Kanector,

I have tried many different titles and made sure that each one has had a VIDEO_TS.VOB, IFO and BUP file along with the necessary VTS_01_XX files before doing "Get VTS sectors" as a final step before attempting to burn. However, on every occassion I have got an error in Gear similar to the one documented above, in fact the only variation in the error is the address that is quoted. Also the address quoted always relates to the actual title set that has been stripped using IfoEdit.

[ralphc]

I am also having the same problem not being able to produce any DVD-R discs when using ifoedit (0.9) with Gear Pro. Any DVD-R I have produced with Gear Pro will play on my APEX DVD player and my Sony Playstation-2. But nothing I create with ifoedit (except Atlantis) can be burned with Gear Pro. All movies, with or without extras, will play with PowerDVD 4 from the hard disk. Finally, I got a DVD-RW disk so I will stop making DVD-R coasters when trying other burning programs besides Gear Pro.

My latest attempt was to make an image file with ifoedit and the image tool. Gear Pro would burn the image file, but that wouldn't play past the menu in the APEX player.

Also, Gear Pro makes perfect copies of DVD-R's produced by my Panasonic standalone DVD recorder from S video input, so I don't think there is a problem with Gear Pro. It can also make a perfect copy of the one movie (Atlantis) that I got to work with ifoedit.

I really like the 2 DVD-R approach if it could work. I am not interested in rempeg or anything that takes that much time. I have tried several times with Chocolat (main movie in VOB-5). The first 9 chapters in one VIDEO_TS directory play fine from the hard disk with PowerDVD. The remaining 14 chapters work fine as well in a different VIDEO_TS directory. But alas, I can't burn each of these to a DVD-R with Gear Pro to produce a split movie on 2 DVD-R discs.

[Pauly]

Just for the record I too own a Sony 7700 player which is happy to play DVD-Rs authored with Maestro but shows error C-13 when trying to play anything processed with IfoEdit.
Not realising this was the problem at the time, I bought a new Pioneer 545 which is happy to play the IfoEdit DVD-Rs. So I guess the Sony is much more fussy about the structure of the DVD than the Pioneer.

[JeffreyLiou]

Hi, Scrapps
Your situation was rather similar with my,please see http://rilanparty.com/vbb/showthread.php?threadid=18644

My little conclusion after stripping several DVDs
1.Nero did not produce fully compatible DVD-R/RW,my Pioneer S9 did read it though,my friend's Sony S345 not!
2.Gear DVD and Primo did not accept the Video_ts files modified by Ifoedit due to some unknown reasons, may be Derrow could give us a hint.
3.Gear DVD did produce compatible DVD-R/RW by burning Ifoedit created image file, this time Sony read it but still not very smoothly
4.My Pioneer S9 although could not play miniDVD/SVCD and being stay in refrigerator for more than one year, got a big fight back after A03 at home, it could even play some DVD-Rs that could not be read by my pioneer-116 DVD ROM
5.For 2 DVD-R method, I'd rather buy that title
:p

[Scrapps]

Thanks JeffreyLiou,

Glad i'm not the only one to have this problem.

I have used the method outlined in your thread and i'm pleased to report that it worked:)

I'm still puzzled why it doesn't work by burning from the files rather than an image but hey since i'm not making expensive coasters anymore I guess i'm happy.

Pauly - check out JeffreyLiou's thread and you should be able to make discs that work on your Sony too.

Thanks again guys, i'm off to rent some more dvds *snigger*

[Scrapps]

Update...

I have now produced several discs using the method suggested, i.e. rip using SmartRipper, edit with IfoEdit, create image from IfoEdit and burn image using Gear DVD Pro.

I have produced a dvd with just the movie, one with movie and menus and one with movie menus and selected extra's.

They all play fine in my Sony 7700 apart from the chapter points, in all 3 cases (all different films too) the film plays fine but selecting "next" or trying to use the "scene selections" menu results in a C-13 error.

Conclusion is that there is something wrong with the changes made by IfoEdit, this problem is detected by Gear Pro DVD, Prassi and certain (it seems not all) set top players. In all cases everything produced using IfoEdit works great on the PC.

This is by no means a criticism and I would like to thank Derrow very much for his efforts in producing IfoEdit and Doom9 for his excellent web site. Clearly without the efforts of people like them we wouldn't be in a position to have this discussion in the first place :-)

Rather, the above is in the nature of a bug report and hopefully helps to refine this tremendous software still further.

[JeffreyLiou]

Hi, Scrapps

The playback problem may be not the fault of Ifoedit !
What is the medium you fed the Sony, DVD-RW or DVD-R ?. In my limited experience from my friend's Sony S345,the Sony did not play the DVD-RW very well,my Pioneer S9 play both DVD-R/RW very well with the method of Ifoedit image burn by Gear and this was not very convinient though.

[taso]

I had this problem with DVD PRO when I first started using it. It took a while to figure out that DVD PRO places a 640 offset at the beginning of the recording process - I can't tell you why. The way that I got around it is to follow all the guides as you've described, do the "get vts sectors" in IFOEdit and as a last step without leaving IFOEdit, click on the VIDEO_TS.IFO file, you will see the sub-files underneath the main VIDEO_TS.IFO file. From the sub files, click on -VMG_PTT_SRPT. On the bottom screen you will have all the variables / parameters associated with that file. Look at the very last line which is the Title set starting sector. It almost always has a sector 6 value. Double click on this line and change the value from 6 to 19 ( which is the 640 offset that DVD PRO inserts). Save the file(s) but DO NOT do another get vts sectors because IFOEdit will change the start sector address back to 6. Exit IFOEdit after saving and load your movie into DVD Pro. It should work. Good Luck.

[JeffreyLiou]

Good news! I'll try this one next time
Thanks!

[ralphc]

I guess I didn't try every option in Gear Pro. The movies created by Ifoedit can be burned and playback fine when using Gear Project New DVD-ROM (ISO/UDF) but can not be burned when using Gear Project New DVD-Video (ISO/UDF). Gee, I thought I wanted DVD-Video, so I hadn't tried DVD-ROM. So use DVD-ROM (ISO/UDF) in Gear Pro and you should have no problems playing back your burned DVD in any DVD-R set top.:D

[Scrapps]

I'm by no means an expert on Gear Pro DVD but I imagine that using the ISO/UDF preset results in a DVD that has not been compliance checked and therefore wouldn't produce any errors under any circumstances. Discs produced using this method would play on some set-tops but not others.

The problems I have been having may at first glance appear to be related to my particular player rather than an inherent problem in IfoEdit. However, this picture changes when you consider that my set top will play DVD-R media without any problems and only has trouble with titles processed through IfoEdit. Likewise Gear Pro DVD has no problems burning discs using the DVD-Video preset until you try to burn files processed by IfoEdit.

I haven't tried the method suggested by Taso yet but if you consider that a title like 'The Body' rips to the HD at around 4.2Gb, and can therefore be burned to DVD-R with no stripping or processing required, loads into Gear Pro DVD without any error messages and burns to a DVD-R that will play back 100% perfectly in my set top. Yet if I use IfoEdit to strip even a single element of this title it then will produce errors when loaded into Gear Pro DVD and can only be burned by producing an image from within IfoEdit (again images are not compliance checked). The DVD-R produced from this image will play in my set-top but trying to skip through chapters or selecting a specific chapter from the scene selection menu now produces an error C-13 on the player.

The above strongly implies that IfoEdit is changing the information in a way that makes it differ from the dvd-video specification, though quite why this problem should only manifest itself on certain players is more of a mystery.

It could be that aso has identified and solved the problem believing it to be caused by Gear Pro, but my experience suggests that it is IfoEdit that is causing the problem and maybe that is what is causing the 640 offset that Taso talks about :/

[ralphc]

Yes, I haven't tested all uses of ifoedit. I was using the split-DVD option, then copy all files other than the VOB and IFO files containing the movie to the destination directory, then copy the zero VOB that contains the movie, do GetVTS, and then everything works OK. So I guess ifoedit only splits the movie and only does main corrections to the movie IFO file. Otherwise, it does modify the other IFO files for starting sectors, etc when doing GetVTS. When used this way with Gear Pro as a DVD-ROM (UDF/ISO) project, I am having success. This way I have all the original menu and stuff, but the movie is split in half to get below 4.2 or 4.3 GB.

[bluespot]

When burning the IFOEdit created image with Gear Pro DVD 6, there are several options you have to set.

I'm assuming that you want to use Mode 1, with a 2048 sector size? Also, there's a check box labeled 'Pregap/Pause Included' (what, does this mean that the pregap/pause is already included in the image, or does it mean that you want one to be included in the final disc???) Right beneath that box is where you can enter the pregap/pause size in frames. How should these options be set, or does it not even matter?

[ralphc]

I haven't had success with the Ifoedit disc image, and now I realize that my split movies using Gear Pro with the DVD-ROM (ISO/UDF) project only play on my Apex player, but not on my Playstation 2. Yep, there is still something that doesn't quite meet the strictest DVD video specs when files are modified with Ifoedit. Also, I just noticed that I can't play the 2nd half of the first chapter in Chocolat when the movie is split with Ifoedit. Didn't have this problem when I split Crazy Beautiful.

[Scrapps]

Here is an interesting observation, if I rip a dvd to my hard disk that is small enough to fit onto a dvd-r without stripping. Then create a new video dvd in gear pro and import the ripped files, everything works fine. Gear pro doesn't report any errors and burns the files to dvd-r.

If I open one of the ifo's in IfoEdit and then quit IfoEdit without doing anything to the ifo at all, and then try to burn the files using gear pro I get the error message "address is already occupied".

Anyone got any ideas why this happens?

[Scrapps]

Update:

Ok I know think the Gear Pro thing, though odd, is somewhat of a red herring. I have produced three dvd titles using the CCE/IfoEdit method and all produce errors if loaded into Gear Pro as files but burn fine as .img's and more importantly play perfectly on my Sony 7700 set top.

The upshot of all this is that any titles created using IfoEdit to strip streams and/or vob id's from the main movie will not play back properly on my Sony 7700, the movie will play but the player will display C:13 if I try to use the chapter menu to jump to a chapter or use the next/previous button to skip through chapters. If I use the CCE method and use Ifoedit to get rid of copyright screens, remove unwanted extra's etc.. then get vts sectors and create disc image, the resulting disc works perfectly in my Sony. Chapter menu's, skip chapters, extra's the lot.

I therefore think that the problem stems from the vob stripping and correction of vob navigation rather than the vts sector changes.

What you think Derrow, does this sound possible? I realise that this problem only manifests itself on some set top players but it would be nice to produce a backup that will play on any player capable of reading the dvd-r media.

[smoof]

I did some analysis of the Gear sector problem and came up with the following:

It appears that Gear reads the VMG_PTT_SRPT from the video_ts.ifo file and then assumes that title_1 will correspond to VTS_01_xx.

You can see this by looking at the start sector column in Gear when your trying to import video_ts files into a DVD video project.

I was using Star Wars as my test case. This example is from the original .ifo files (before any stripping).

In this DVD, VTS_06 corresponds to title_1 in the VMG_PTT_SRPT. The start sector for title 1 is 76753. Now add the 640 offset the Gear uses and the start sector is now 76753 + 640 = 77393. This is the value that Gear will place in the start sector column. The problem is that Gear associates this start sector with VTS_01 instead of VTS_06. Of course this is going to cause problems because now the start sector for title_2 (which corresponds to VTS_05) is set to 72750. Gear will try to use 72750 + 640 = 73390. This is going to fail because VTS_01 ended at sector 77644 and Gear can't put VTS_02 before VTS_01. It's a little confusing but if you work through it using Gear and IfoEdit you should see what's going on.

I believe this is actually a bug in Gear because it should also look at the title set number when parsing the VMG_PTT_SRPT and associate with the proper VTS_xx files.

So now there are two possible solutions:
1. Use IfoEdit DiscImage to make the image and then burn with whatever you want.

2. You can manually go into the VMG_PTT_SRPT and resequence the start sectors and then go and rename the VTS_xx files. For example on star wars since title_1 corresponds to VTS_06, you could rename all VTS_06 files to VTS_01 and then in VMG_PTT_SRPT title_1 entry you would set the starting sector to 818 (the original starting sector for VTS_01). Computing the start sectors for the other VTS_xx files is a little more tricky. You have to figure out what order the VTS files are referenced in the VMG_PTT_SRPT, rename them, compute their size in sectors and then adjust the title_x entries accordingly. As you can see, option 1 is the way to go!

[smoof]

I sent the analysis of the problem to tech support at Gear and they acknowledged that they were already aware of the problem and are currently working on fixing it. Hopefully, the next version of Gear DVD Pro will be usable for burning compliant DVD's.

I wonder if this is the problem with Prassi when using it to make a DVD from the individual files (works great for images). Unfortunately, the log file is Prassi is worthless in determining what it's choking on.