Clarrification.

[Neo Neko]

I was thuroghly pissed with DivxNetworks handling of the opendivix thing. I posted so over at divx.com and people made lots of lame attempts to flame me back then. Recently alot of people had made accusation of DivxNetworks stealing the work of other people on the opendivx project. I have seen Nic for one post on this. I am not aware of any solid or concrete data to this effect. If this is indeed the case and can be proven it would be pretty damming. It would also reduce my desire to persue Divx further. Xvid is quite good at this point and i do not feal that I would be missing anything major if I encoded solely in it.

Please post any solid evidence. Many other people have been chiming in on this. AKA one post wonders. But I have yet to see any proof.

[-h]

Re: use of opendivx code.

I haven't seen any proof of DXN using OpenDivX, or XviD code:

DivX4/5 are based on Sparky's encore2 engine - encore2's source was publically posted (indeed, it's what XviD was based on) and was a total rewrite of "encore1", which people had been contributing to. Encore2 was only moderately refined before the closed source DivX4 release. All that really happened was prediction fixes and assembly optimisation by the looks of things.

Very little has actually changed from DivX4 to DivX5 - the core (encore2) is almost completely unchanged, with the same quantization, macroblock writing, motion search, prediction, etc. code (from first perceptions). All they really did was optimise the asm a bit more, and add new features on top of encore2 (B-frames, quarterpel, REAL interlacing, etc.). If they'd actually grabbed some of XviD's code, I can guarantee you that DivX5 would be even faster, while producing smaller bitstreams ;)

However, if someone would like to post disassembly showing otherwise, I'd be interested in seeing it :)

-h

[Neo Neko]

I had never heard anyone accuse them of stealing from Xvid. Frankly though they do need some major help. LOL I post it here seeing that Xvid is very close related to opendivx. And that some here might have a better feal for the reality of the situation. I was well aware of the short lived fluke posting of encore2 as well. :p There was a time I visited the projectmayo forums daily. Have not been there in months though.

Anyway I am glad to see that if I am mistaken I am not alone. As always I will pursue knowledge and to preach knowledge.

[DSPguru]

Originally posted by -h
However, if someone would like to post disassembly showing otherwise, I'd be interested in seeing it :)could be very interesting indeed :).

[MaTTeR]

Neo,

This is the first I've heard of DN supposedly using code directly from Xvid. However, my understanding is that code, ideas, etc was and is used from what we now know as Open Divx. The people who I hear this from have much closer ties to DN than I do, I wont make there names public you know them just as good as I do.

Is it true? I have no idea. I just looked at it like...why would they say something like this when they have nothing to gain. It's late so sorry if I'm rambling:eek:

[Nic]

To be fair, from what I can see DivX was just taken from OpenDivX source, but then again they did write most of it. Still I think calling something OpenDivX & then closing it....is not really on.

BetaBoy sent me a really big PM recently, which he said I cant repeat....If only I could, you'd see why I was so anti-divxnetworks right now.......

(also flicking through the DivX.DLL you can see that it is referred to as DivX4.5)

(Also, the encryption they've used on the DLL, is very good really, I might have to shout y0da or r!sc to do this...might be out of my league :( )

-Nic

[-h]

(Also, the encryption they've used on the DLL, is very good really, I might have to shout y0da or r!sc to do this...might be out of my league :( )

But not that we endorse any of this ;)

I used to hack/edit super nintendo games for fun (good old 65c816), I wouldn't know where to start when it comes to IA32.

-h

[Neo Neko]

@MaTTeR
I neaver meant to imply they had stolen from Xvid. I simply post here because I thought some of the visitors might be able to clear this up and since Xvid and Opendivx have a common root or genisis.

@Nic
If DivxNetworks is really that dastardly I would like to know. There must be something you or an anonymous Beta could post. I think I trust you enough to take you at your word, but when I argue a point I want to be better armed than just saying Nic says so. Is it all really that much insider info? I understand if it could put Dan's upcomming job change in jeapordy. But this is something that everyone needs to know at one point or another. Rats scurry and change their ways when exposed to light. Accept when they are Microsoft. That company is so dim that the suck up all light long before it reaches them.

I ain't gonna argue on rumors no matter who they come from. But I do not want to support someone who could have done us wrong.

[MaTTeR]

@Neo

I'm sorry my message came off like that, it wasn't meant to. I was just trying to let you know I hadn't heard of this with Xvid. Now the comments about code coming from openDivx is another story, those seem to be widespread:)

[Neo Neko]

I have noticed the same thing Matter. That is why I came here to see if I could seek clarrification or that someone here might be able to provide me with something more substantial than rumors.

[Nic]

Sorry I can't be more specific, I know Dan wouldn't mind you knowing...But he did say not to say anything.

But heres one thing, what did BetaBoy have in the beginning, what did that turn into, and what has he got now....
(but theres more to it)

Im glad to hear you trust me :) I hope you know that I've never said a bad word about DivXNetworks until very recently, & that isn't a coincidence.

Take Care,
-Nic

[trbarry]

Correct me if I'm wrong but ...

Isn't it both one of both the strengths and weakness of open source code that you are allowed to steal the ideas out of it for whatever purpose? I thought it was only when you start cut & pasting the code that it becomes a problem.

And yet except in obvious cases, how would you tell which someone did?

- Tom

[Neo Neko]

Originally posted by trbarry
Correct me if I'm wrong but ...

Isn't it both one of both the strengths and weakness of open source code that you are allowed to steal the ideas out of it for whatever purpose? I thought it was only when you start cut & pasting the code that it becomes a problem.

And yet except in obvious cases, how would you tell which someone did?

- Tom

Don't let any opensource developer hear you say that. Avery and Marty had a pretty good little battle both legal and otherwise over Marty cutting and pasting some Virtualdub code for Vidomi here a while back I believe. Opensource is not some buffet that comercial developers can just paruse through and pick to pieces getting the choice parts. Do some do it. Quite possibly yes. I do not think DivxNetworks is guilty of this. But it does happen. They can on the other hand be inspired by the code and write their own implimentation of it from scratch. That is legal and right. Then again depending upon the type of opensource they might contact the author for llcensing of his code. Never heard of that happening though.