How is doom9 going these days?

[shevegen]

I don't off-hand remember when I first used the forum; I think in the early 2000s.

Back then I still had a lot of DVDs and looked to convert these into .avi files mostly.

Fast forward some 20 years or so. I no longer have any DVDs; all of that was replaced with HDDs. It is just more convenient. But even oldschool recording of TV series I rarely do anymore.

How is the forum doing these days? Are people still visiting it a lot? Has anything changed in this regard?

What happened to the original doom9 guy; I think he was from central europe? Is he still alive?

What about things such as virtual dub - it became inactive some years ago I think. Did everything decay?

[videoh]

How is the forum doing these days? Seems to be doing just fine.

Are people still visiting it a lot? Yes, of course.

What happened to the original doom9 guy; I think he was from central europe? Is he still alive? I think he had to get a real job. Still posts now and again and together with Swede keeps the forum going.

What about things such as virtual dub - it became inactive some years ago I think. It lives on as VirtualDub2.

There's lots of new tech since your old days. This forum remains relevant and vibrant.

[StainlessS]

You joined in Nov 2003; see under your avatar.
Doom9 last posted 5th march.
Vh seems to have answered your other queries.

[FranceBB]

Doom9 is still rocking and Avisynth is now much much better than how it used to be.
Development continued and everything is nice and vibrant.
Doom9 is still the place where people go to know and learn things and it also became much more focused on professional stuff and not only dedicated to people re-encoding DVDs but to broadcasters and studios all over the world. This couldn't be better, honestly and Ferenc Pinter picked up the hard job to keep the Avisynth core and most of its most iconic plugins updated and we're all incredibly thankful for that.
If I had to list all the changes that have been made I would need several pages, but you'll find out bit by bit. You left in a period when Avisynth was pretty much consumer based, yv12, YUY2 only and Windows x86 only. Nowadays YUV 4:4:4 16bit planar or 32bit float are a thing, x64 is a thing, CUDA Accelerated filters are a thing, Linux and Mac OSX cross platform compatibility is a thing and the product is used professionally all over the world just to name a few things. :D
Doom9 rules!
Long live to Avisynth!
Long live to open source software!

[SeeMoreDigital]

There's still a few of us old boys here learning new things ;)

[videoh]

And teaching the new boys old things. ;)

[Liisachan]

Back then, many encoders said, "softsubs are bad. unreliable, too CPU-intensive, etc etc". They were creating AVI, like, VirtualDub + Textsub. OGM was not so popular. Then MKV has come. Nowadays, people say, "hardsubs are bad - softsubs are much better!" Now there's irony... in a way.

Back then, iirc, I got a notification email from the forum when there was a new post. I think this notification service has been disconnected for some reaosn. One could say that's one of the changes.

[GMJCZP]

shevegen, welcome to 2021.

As you seem like a time traveler I can tell you that I still use VirtualDubMod, coincidentally I am experiencing some problems with Virtualdub2. What is all the rage here is working on High Bit Depth, which has led to the remaking of a significant number of plugins, including of course Avisynth +.

Any doubt asks that here there are people of the old guard and new values.

[feisty2]

the core functionality of many programs here (avisynth, vdub, etc.) has definitely evolved over the years. the GUI (if it has one) still looks very 90s tho, I guess no one ever wants to invest time in cosmetic stuff, even if the look of the user interface is a big part of the user experience, especially if you use the program regularly.

[FranceBB]

the GUI (if it has one) still looks very 90s tho

Yep, but I like the way things are and they've always been like this. I mean, if I think about something like Virtual Dub I couldn't imagine it in any way different from the way it is and it has always been. I mean, try to imagine it with modern buttons, rounded corners, lots of animations/effects... brrr.... oh no, please no... xD

[feisty2]

This xmas (too soon?), I want a consistent glassmorphic GUI for every program running on my computer.

[GMJCZP]

In my career, resistance to change is something that should not be underestimated, going to the field of computing, Microsoft, with or without bad intention, introduces changes in its products that on more than one occasion have been a headache for users and even for the same people of Redmon.

There is also a saying that says "don't try to fix what is not broken".

[Hotte]

I`ve been using AVS and now AVS+ for almost 7 years to do all the things that even a professional NLE like Edius is not able to do or at least not able to do at this level of quality.

And the highly competent guys in this forum are very kind and always very helpful. I'd say you meet some creme-de-la-creme video expertise in this forum. And they are always ready to answer an amateur's questions without pointing their fingers on you.

Great forum, really!

AVS+ is a higly professional tool. Complicated to use and understand but extremely powerful. Sometimes I am asking myself how Vapoursynth is to be evaluated against Avisynth. Never worked with Vapoursynth, but people tell, that its architecture is more advanced. Will it become the gravedigger of AVS one day ? Is it used more and more ? Would be interesting if sbdy could give some insight.

[feisty2]

I don't know if vaporsynth will ever completely replace avisynth, but (the windows version of) vaporsynth is compatible with avisynth plugins at the binary level and the other way around is not true. and since vaporsynth scripts are essentially python programs, it is capable of making use of the evergrowing python ecosystem (e.g. using deep learning based models to process videos is a cinch in vaporsynth, because pytorch, tensorflow, etc. all come with a python interface), that's something you can never do in avisynth.

[Jamaika]

I associated Doom9 with piracy in 2003. Hence there was an interest in converting DVD to avi. Well, maybe not necessarily true because in Central Europe I had the largest market of pirate records.
What am I doing here? Hmm ... At the beginning I was scared, I don't know English well but I'm interested in programming. I didn't have a chance to study.
Who needs it for? For me, it is a springboard from reality.
Where have you wandered these 20 years? Which forum did you find better? Maybe you have some achievements.

[FranceBB]

Never worked with Vapoursynth, but people tell, that its architecture is more advanced.

I'm not a fan of Vapoursynth, but I'm afraid it's true.
I used it only once to run a bunch of VMAF tests 'cause there wasn't (and still isn't) a plugin for Avisynth. Anyway, while at the beginning I saw many plugins being ported from Avisynth to VapourSynth, but now it's the other way round, as I've seen plugins like CAS, Cube, etc being ported from VapourSynth to Avisynth. As far as I know, it should also have proper support for XYZ internally, although I have to check that one 'cause I'm not sure, but from the Avisynth point of view, I can definitely tell you that there's no official support and you can only spoof it as RGBPS if you wanna work with it, which is... ok-ish, but not ideal. About the syntax, it is different as it's python based, so it looks "weird" at first glance and it still kinda looks weird to me. I'm sure that if I really wanted to I could learn that, but I don't kinda feel like it. I mean, after several years of Avisynth and its pseudo C++, using a different frameserver with a different language (python) feels like betrayal xD

[feisty2]

python will soon top the TIOBE chart (https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/), I suggest that you learn it even if you don't use vaporsynth.

[Jamaika]

python will soon top the TIOBE chart (https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/), I suggest that you learn it even if you don't use vaporsynth.
Interesting diagram. Unfortunately, in Central Europe you need to know all seven languages to submit a CV. Otherwise only the forum remains or you work on forklift. :D

[Jamaika]

Unfortunately, I get opinions. Don't deal with open source software. Free it means lame. Set up a company in the EU, buy licensed software and create works. What are you interested in google codecs? Camera, new computer, learning software, film editor, client. And here it ends happy. Then there are the questions. Who pays the tax? What's my gray area? How much competition is there at the wedding or printing points? Do you run it yourself or hire someone etc?
What to do with your amateur excursions videos? Hmm ... well, the tax office is chasing Zainzibar on facebook. Especially in the era of pandemic. There remains a drawer for the grandchildren.
The second thing is the advantage of google on the internet market and not only. Free software is nice, but it looks worse to post and download photos. Who has the property rights? Worse, for undesirable activity and opinions on the Internet, you are not getting a visa to the USA. Today the pandemic has made the greats of this world happy.
In my country there is an opinion that there are too many printing points. It is unacceptable for a citizen to copy books and documents passively. The old communism is back.

[wonkey_monkey]

Maybe I'm just old and set in my ways but it never fails to astonish me that Python's insistence on significant whitespace hasn't been more of a hindrance to its adoption. For one thing, it's proscriptive in the extreme - I often find myself breaking the standard conventions, as well as my own, in C++ for various reasons - and it just seems to cause more problems that it solves (which is exactly none, as far as I'm concerned). Someone recently posted a Python script on Reddit asking for help, so I thought I'd give it a go, as it was a general programming question. Reddit didn't display it properly, of course, but that would have been the case with C as well. I managed to copy and paste it, with whitespace, into an online interpreter, but it wouldn't run. I replaced any tabs with spaces - still wouldn't run. I can only assume it had some weird variant of a space in it that wasn't being treated properly, because when I removed all the whitespace and typed it in again, it worked.

So, two programs which look visually identical in an IDE, but one compiles and one doesn't - or worse, they compile but they produce different results. That just seems bonkers to me.

[feisty2]

so you're not aware of linters and code formatters? any modern editor automatically formats your code when you paste stuff into it, have you heard of visual studio code?

[wonkey_monkey]

Not sure what that has to do with my point about whitespace.

[feisty2]

whitespaces are a part of the code format, therefore automatically adjusted by the editor

[wonkey_monkey]

Yes...? Still not clear on your point. Maybe you've misunderstood mine.

[feisty2]

the point is that when you copied someone else's python code and paste it into your editor, the whitespaces in that code will be automatically adjusted by your editor to fit in with the rest of your code. so your moan about whitespaces is not valid unless you write python programs in notepad.

[wonkey_monkey]

The editor didn't reformat the code. I pasted it into a blank textbox in an online interpreter. It wouldn't run. I pasted it again in a new tab, took out all the leading whitespace, retyped spaces until the two files visually matched, and then it worked.

Had it been C++, I could have just copied and pasted the code as displayed on the HTML page (whereas I had to go into the source to get it with whitespaces, broken though they were), and, whether the editor had reformatted it or not, it would have compiled and run as expected.

[feisty2]

The editor didn't reformat the code. I pasted it into a blank textbox in an online interpreter. It wouldn't run.

that's the problem of the online interpreter being a bit shabby, which is basically not a problem because no one writes serious programs in an online interpreter. a legit source code editor like visual studio code or pycharm always automatically formats your pasted code.

[StainlessS]

Indentation:- https://docs.python.org/2/reference/lexical_analysis.html#indentation
:helpful:

EDIT: PsPad can convert TABs to SPACEs
Menu/EDIT/Special Conversion/Convert Tabs to Spaces
[I use this on AVS script to be posted in D9 code block, I use TAB width=4, and D9 uses TAB width=8]

and,
Menu/View/Special Chars
shows invisible formatting characters.

and
Menu/Program Settings/Editor (Part2)/Real Tabs = UNTICKED
uses SPACEs instead of tabs when tabbing
In same form, can set Tab Width, and Indent Width.

[Katie Boundary]

Back then, many encoders said, "softsubs are bad. unreliable, too CPU-intensive, etc etc". They were creating AVI, like, VirtualDub + Textsub. OGM was not so popular. Then MKV has come. Nowadays, people say, "hardsubs are bad - softsubs are much better!" Now there's irony... in a way.

I ALWAYS use hardsubs. Why? Because if you want to do any actual editing at all, hardsubs remain correctly synced with the appropriate audio and video no matter what you do and with zero effort on your part. By contrast, if I wanted to use softsubs in a fan edit of something like Star Wars or X-Men First Class, I wouldn't even know where to begin.

[Liisachan]

I ALWAYS use hardsubs. Why? Because if you want to do any actual editing at all, hardsubs remain correctly synced with the appropriate audio and video no matter what you do and with zero effort on your part. By contrast, if I wanted to use softsubs in a fan edit of something like Star Wars or X-Men First Class, I wouldn't even know where to begin.

Yeah, a valid point. Softsubs are not always frame-accurate, depending on the renderer. Also, due to 2 incompatible coordinate systems (relative-to-frame vs. relative-to-screen), you can't control sub positons reliably in softsubbing. On the other hand, softsubs are higher-quality (if they work)... slightly less reliable, yet more beautiful...

Generaly, hardsubs are safer... you can use whatever, e.g. {\p4\pbo10} and the results are deterministic. Still softsubbing has its forte... like you can do switchable multi-subbing (subs in language A and langauge B).

[FranceBB]

Generaly, hardsubs are safer... you can use whatever, e.g. {\p4\pbo10} and the results are deterministic. Still softsubbing has its forte... like you can do switchable multi-subbing (subs in language A and langauge B).

Yep.
I personally use softsub for anything that it's teletex-style, like for simple dialogues etc.
If something has typesetting or karaoke, though, for me the choice is pretty simple: hardsub all the way. ;)

Oh... this reminds me of 2006 when I was still a young translator fansubbing and enjoying anime...
It seems like a life ago...

[feisty2]

2006? that was the time that I would spend an entire day modifying the system files of winXP using resource hacker, to make it look like vista. I still remember things like true transparency and windowblinds that emulate the glass effect on XP

[kedautinh12]

I used it only once to run a bunch of VMAF tests 'cause there wasn't (and still isn't) a plugin for Avisynth.
I seen Asd-g was ported from vapoursynth to avisynth
https://github.com/Asd-g/AviSynth-VMAF