Converting a PAL DVD to NTSC

[Rich86]

I am a fan of Eva Cassidy's music. She was terrific and it is a crime that she was taken from us at such a young age.
I ordered "Nightbird" (CDs + DVD) from Amazon UK because I wanted the complete live performance from Blues Alley (especially her awesome performance of "Over The Rainbow"). Unfortunately, this CD/DVD set is not available in the US for some reason & the DVD is PAL.
I need some help. I simply want to convert the "NightBird" DVD in its entirety from PAL to NTSC so I can play and enjoy it on my home theater system. I can play it on my computer system, but I would much prefer to convert it to NTSC & burn it to a DVD+R to watch wherever I would like. Any help and suggestions are welcome. Many thanks!

[Sharc]

^^^^
Do you really have to convert? Most HW players play both standards. That's the first thing I would check.
You can google for guides about PAL to NTSC conversion.
Example:
http://www.digitalfaq.com/guides/video/convert-pal-ntsc.htm
or
http://www.afterdawn.com/guides/archive/convert_pal_to_ntsc_page_4.cfm

The procedure also depends on the source. Is the source clean PAL interlaced video? Or already converted from NTSC to PAL and messed up? Can you upload a sample?
You may also want to google for "telecine".

[Ch3vr0n]

sharc, about the "most play both". That's true if you're located in the EU/PAL area. Over here that's usually the case, but going by Rich86's location under his avatar, thats very rare to happen. Players in the US usually only play NTSC.

Rich, i don't think dvdrb can do that. You can try a conversion suite like VSO's ConvertXtoDVD but you'll lose the original menu. There also seems to be a possible method by editing the ifo&bup files but that's a complicated method and no guarantee to work.

[Rich86]

Yes - I had tested numerous playback devices to no avail. Converting this DVD to NTSC is a more complicated process than I anticipated.
However . . Sharc's post/question made me do a mental review of what I had tried.
blu-ray players - check, HD-DVD players - check, DVD players - check, DVD recording player - check
. . hey - what about that old combo LD/DVD player - the Pioneer DVL-919?
Well, you guessed it - the Pioneer DVL-919 loaded up the PAL DVD just fine & it looks & sounds just fine processed via my Yamaha receiver to the Sony HDTV.
If the DVL-919 can handle PAL, why on earth couldn't PAL be supported in my much newer, sophisticated & powerful optical media devices? :rolleyes:

[Ghitulescu]

Many threads have been discussed here about format conversions, some referring to DVD others not. But it's the same. There is no magic method, but a list of cases, and for each case there are several other factors influencing the conversion.

US is not a PAL-friendly country, so you may indeed need to convert.

However, most computers can output HDMI signals to a big screen or monitor, and they definitely can play 25Fps, one way or the other.

I am sure that even in the US, companies like Oppo (BTW, much cheaper then in EU), can play both.


Format compatibility is a matter of licence costs and fees. Not of technical impossibility.

[Rich86]

I am sure that even in the US, companies like Oppo (BTW, much cheaper then in EU), can play both.

Yes - it looks like a USA Oppo player can handle PAL optical media as long as the media is encoded as acceptable for region A & 1. I surely would not part with the cost of an Oppo just for that purpose however (this Eva Cassidy disc is the only PAL disc I have), and I haven't any need or interest in the other added features of an Oppo player.

[Sharc]

@Rich86
Is playback via a standard Blu-ray player an option for you?
If so, you could import the PAL DVD in BD-Rebuilder an let it automatically produce a Blu-ray compatible disc. Frame rate conversion is not required because Blu-ray accepts 720x576 25fps interlaced. You could even add a simple menu with BD-Rebuilder.

[Rich86]

@Rich86
Is playback via a standard Blu-ray player an option for you?
If so, you could import the PAL DVD in BD-Rebuilder an let it automatically produce a Blu-ray compatible disc. Frame rate conversion is not required because Blu-ray accepts 720x576 25fps interlaced. You could even add a simple menu with BD-Rebuilder.

Sounds like a viable alternative to fussing with a DVD conversion. Once that is done, I could actually then create a NTSC DVD from the blu-ray in BDRB also for playback in a non-BD player. Thanks.

Update: well . . BDRB ignores the main movie (the actual 55 minute main feature on the dvd) but imports the extras ok . .

[Sharc]

Strange. Maybe you should check the import threshold settings.....

[Rich86]

Strange. Maybe you should check the import threshold settings.....

Well . . the only strange thing is the guy at the keyboard . . me.
I misunderstood what I was seeing - BDRB imported the DVD just fine!

Update: I have been playing around with this using the config to have a "play all" option and selecting a menu background. Got it working (although entering the titles of the tracks every time is a pain).
BUT - I seem to have an audio out of sync problem with the resulting playback BD. Does BD-RB determine it is importing a PAL DVD, or is there somewhere I need to tell it so it correctly syncs audio with video?

[Ch3vr0n]

Think it defaults to NTSC or tries to guess what it is, but you can tell it in settings to assume pal. Just don't remember if it applies to importing or exporting. Not behind the computer atm.

[Rich86]

Think it defaults to NTSC or tries to guess what it is, but you can tell it in settings to assume pal. Just don't remember if it applies to importing or exporting. Not behind the computer atm.

Yes - I saw that setting - but figured it would give me a PAL output. But I will give it a try tomorrow and see what happens. Thanks.
Update - the PAL setting in the config did nothing to alleviate the audio out of sync issue.

[Sharc]

There could be a couple of reasons. (When outputting to BD format the "Assume PAL for DVD Output" should actually not matter.)
Is the sync error a fix offset, or does the desync gradually increase over time?

What does MediaInfo report about your encoded .m2ts files ? Is the framerate 25fps or did it change? Can you upload a few seconds sample of your encoded .m2ts (and perhaps also a sample of your .vob source). Posting the .log may also help
Did you force IVTC or select some special settings for deinterlacing? Did you put IMPORT_PAL_TO_FILM=n in your .ini? Which frame server (DSS, LAV, DGDecNV...) did you select?

If all settings appear to be correct, re-installing avisynth and LAV may also help.

[Rich86]

IMPORT_PAL_TO_FILM=1 in my config ini.
MultiAVCHD can't process the audio at all (2 channel lpcm).
AVStoDVD processes & keeps the audio in sync, but treats each .vob file off the DVD as a separate title, resulting in brief gaps in the audio (at least with computer playback). The resulting DVD IS NTSC & plays fine on a DVD player except for the pauses between the titles/files on the disc.
What a pain - probably easier to just watch the bloody DVD via my Pioneer DVL-919 or computer and forget about it.

[Sharc]

Set IMPORT_PAL_TO_FILM=0 to leave the framerate untouched.
Otherwise the frame rate conversion may possibly desync the Audio.

[GMJCZP]

It's not neccesary recodificate the entire DVD. Firstly, you have rip the DVD with DvdShrink, then elaborate a 3:2 pulldown (25->29.97) with DGPulldown, theteby the audio remains synchronous with the video.

[Sharc]

It's not neccesary recodificate the entire DVD. Firstly, you have rip the DVD with DvdShrink, then elaborate a 3:2 pulldown (25->29.97) with DGPulldown, theteby the audio remains synchronous with the video.
That's another possibility. It may however not be so straightforward and simple, and still require re-encoding:
- The source must be progressive for DGPulldown to work, means it has to be deinterlaced. (We still don't know the source format)
- It has to be resized from 720x576 (PAL) to 720*480 (NTSC)
All this involves demuxing, deinterlacing, resizing and mpeg-2 re-encoding, before DGPulldown can be applied to the new video mpeg-2 stream for 25->29.97 soft-telecining, IMO.

[Ghitulescu]

If the BD players sold in the US (and the TV-sets, too) accept SDTV/50 (PAL) into BD format, then there are two alternatives
- one, rip the DVD normally with any ripper, like DVDShrink (no compression, main movies) - the choice of the ripper depends on the heaviness of copy protections, of course - then the main movie being remuxed into a BD structure with tsMuxer (maybe with the GUI of your choice).
- the second one, which I did and I can recommend, is to use the DVDlogic DVD2BD (there is a free version :) "Express"). It will transform the DVD into a BD with menus and everything. One still has to rip and remove all copy protection issues (including the region coding) before.

Of course, they will work under the prerequisites that the playing chain supports these frame size and rate.

[Rich86]

We watched the entire Eva Cassidy "Nightbird" DVD this evening (12 tunes from her live performance @ the Blues Alley jazz club in Washington DC on 1/3/96). She lost her battle with cancer on 11/2/96. This is a 3 disc set from the UK - 2 CDs + the PAL DVD. The CDs add up to 33 tracks. We are up in the mountains by Lake Tahoe, & enjoying her music this evening on a good home theater system looking out the front slider at a sunset over the lake was everything I had hoped for. I am very thankful for this old Pioneer DVL-909 combo LD/DVD player sitting in the system rack here. When we get back home, I may take up the battle once again to coax BD-RB into creating a BD with the audio properly synchronized so I can enjoy it in a BD player. And the CDs from this set will get a workout in the SUV over the next week.

[Ghitulescu]

And the CDs from this set will get a workout in the SUV over the next week.
Do not use originals in a car.

[jdobbs]

We watched the entire Eva Cassidy "Nightbird" DVD this evening (12 tunes from her live performance @ the Blues Alley jazz club in Washington DC on 1/3/96). She lost her battle with cancer on 11/2/96. This is a 3 disc set from the UK - 2 CDs + the PAL DVD. The CDs add up to 33 tracks. We are up in the mountains by Lake Tahoe, & enjoying her music this evening on a good home theater system looking out the front slider at a sunset over the lake was everything I had hoped for. I am very thankful for this old Pioneer DVL-909 combo LD/DVD player sitting in the system rack here. When we get back home, I may take up the battle once again to coax BD-RB into creating a BD with the audio properly synchronized so I can enjoy it in a BD player. And the CDs from this set will get a workout in the SUV over the next week.I may need to find that set. I'm a big Eva Cassidy fan.

[Rich86]

I may need to find that set. I'm a big Eva Cassidy fan.

I am also a big fan and have a number of her CDs. I got my "Nightbird" set from Amazon - seller was zoverstocks - $13.50 total shipped. There is a single disc version also called "Nightbird", but I am glad to have the full 2 cd set + DVD multi-disc version.
I should also say that my enthusiasm for the PAL DVD in the set has to do with the music and Eva's performance. This is a 20 year old amateur made video recording most likely from the 2nd row of seats - 4:3 aspect ratio & black & white. It is perfectly watchable and enjoyable but will not blow anyone away. The music, however, is terrific.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rd8VktT8xY