Highest quality, cheapest, simplest ways to capture copy-protected VHS?

[Nerva]

There's an old PBS documentary that was made in the 80's and released only on VHS that I would like to get a digital version of, but it was never released on DVD, and after contacting both PBS and the company that produced it, I've been told it will never be released on DVD, rebroadcast, or streamed online, because the original rights have expired -- it is truly "dead" and both PBS and the company that produced it say it is never going to be seen again by anyone. I have searched for it online for years but found nothing, and there are no copies for sale on eBay or anywhere else, so it looks like the only way I will ever see it again is to check it out from a library (I found one nearby that says it has it) and digitize it myself. I've never done that, so I'm wondering what the best, cheapest, and simplest methods are. I do have access to a VHS player.

I looked at some reviews of video-to-USB devices on NewEgg and saw people are having all sorts of problems with Macrovision copyright protection being detected by the capture device (even on unprotected tapes). Since the documentary likely uses some sort of copyright protection, I'm wondering how do I work around it?

Any help is greatly appreciated -- obviously I'm not simply trying to avoid paying the rightful copyright owners... I just want to be able to show this documentary to my children when they're the right age.

[Asmodian]

One of the cheaper solutions is an AVT-8710, it thinks macrovision is an error in the signal and corrects it. It works quite well but they are not that cheap.

edit: Please edit your title to remove "Best". There is unlikely to be a true "best" and we have Forum Rule #12 (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=156618). :)

[filler56789]

Another reason to edit the title of this topic:

there is a difference between 'copyrights' and 'anti-copy technology'.

[Ghitulescu]

And a third reason - copyrighted or not, anti-copy protected or not, there are more than one method to do this.

Like better way to heal sick people.

IIRC older capturing cards are insensible to MV - they started to be sensible with ATI all-in-one around the turn of the century. Their quality isn't stellar on the other hand.

Unfortunately, only the experience will tell you for good what works and what doesn't work. For instance, my Sima is in one place credited to be able to cut through MV, in another one as not able. It appeared lately that there are 2 models of it (probably to comply with whatever legal threat). I haven't yet used it against MV as my ED TBC-enhancer cuts through al the tapes I needed for. And I do not need VHS for 15 years now, except special cases.

Bottom-line - there are a few devices that can remove MV or other CP (copy protected) VHS, but most of them have been forced out of the market. It's difficult to get one, even as 2nd hand, and if you find one, it may be expensive. Expensive because it's a quasi monopoly, in terms of transfer VHS to computer or DVD. Then there is the issue of "loosing the teeth" via legal actions, so some devices work other do not.

[Nerva]

To be clear, I wasn't asking if there is a single solution that is highest-quality, cheapest, and simplest -- I was asking for advice for solutions that have higher-quality, solutions that are cheaper, and solutions that are simpler than other options.

[ChiDragon]

A PBS documentary probably didn't include Macrovision, especially if it was only released as a "pledge reward" or for educational purposes and not in stores. It wouldn't make sense to pay the license fees for such a release. Warner Bros. didn't even use Macrovision on big VHS titles like The Matrix.

Lots of USB capture devices, even an Easycap that's $5 on eBay, can technically capture a Macrovision'd tape when using a DirectShow capture program like VirtualDub.

The trouble is that they seem to detect MV (http://forum.videohelp.com/threads/355352-Need-suggestions-for-new-capture-card-to-record-composite-video?p=2241197&viewfull=1#post2241197) and intentionally raise the contrast to the point of clipping. I suppose I should have included the original DVD frame in that post to make it clearer that the text isn't really supposed to look quite like that.

But the biggest problem with capture of any VHS is wiggling lines caused by timebase instability (IMO).

[Ghitulescu]

To be clear, I wasn't asking if there is a single solution that is highest-quality, cheapest, and simplest -- I was asking for advice for solutions that have higher-quality, solutions that are cheaper, and solutions that are simpler than other options.

How about 3 separate threads :) for each topic.

[raffriff42]

I'm sorry to have to say this, but how is talking about defeating copy protection not Rule 6, no matter what your benign intentions? How do you know some copyright holder you've never heard of before will not "object" to this discussion, with unpleasant consequences for everyone?

[Nerva]

I apologize if I broke a forum rule, although since I haven't named the documentary in question, there's no chance anyone is going to come out of the woodwork to object.

A PBS documentary probably didn't include Macrovision, especially if it was only released as a "pledge reward" or for educational purposes and not in stores. It wouldn't make sense to pay the license fees for such a release. Warner Bros. didn't even use Macrovision on big VHS titles like The Matrix.
That would make sense in this case, actually, because I recently discovered that two far-away universities have DVD sets of the documentary, that PBS allowed them digitize from their VHS set, for educational purposes only (i.e. classroom instruction), and that means I can't get access to them. So unless the libraries had equipment that can defeat Macrovision, that implies there was no Macrovision to defeat.

[Nerva]

Assuming there's no Macrovision, are there any devices people recommend for recording off of VHS?

[Ghitulescu]

A TBC is highly recommended.

[Nerva]

I see the Elgato Video Converter is a top seller on Amazon -- is it a good option? I'd like something that rips to H.265 or at least H.264 at very high quality. I have no plans to burn this to DVD -- I just want to rip to MKV or MP4 format and keep it on my home media server.

[ChiDragon]

You'll get higher quality by capturing with a lossless codec and then converting to your "delivery format" after the fact.

I'll repeat what I said earlier: IMO, the biggest problem with capture of any VHS is wiggling lines caused by timebase instability. The other differences between capture devices for VHS are minor in comparison.

[Nerva]

So, given the timebase instability issue, are there capture devices that fix that, or is it a matter of putting a correction-device in-line between the VHS player and the capture device? Yes, I'm fine with starting with lossless and then doing a high-quality encode of a lossy version for storage.

[ChiDragon]

Well, what's your budget? There are exotic capture devices that fix it, at least partially. Some DVD recorders are useful for the "passthrough" purpose with normal capture devices, and they should be easier to obtain.

[Asmodian]

So, given the timebase instability issue, are there capture devices that fix that, or is it a matter of putting a correction-device in-line between the VHS player and the capture device? Yes, I'm fine with starting with lossless and then doing a high-quality encode of a lossy version for storage.

The true purpose of the AVT-8710 is as a Time Base Corrector, it also works reasonable well for that. ;)

I think it is one of the cheaper options that does it well. Research TBC if you want to look for others, there are a few decent ones. VHS is a difficult format to capture today.

[zerowalker]

A guess, but maybe a DVD Recorder as Passthrough might work, usually used for Line-TBC, but not sure if they perhaps kill the Macrovision signal or not.

[Ghitulescu]

A DVD recorder intentionally observe MV.