Nvidia scandal with Async Compute support (DX12)

[aufkrawall]

Really funny to see how you first wholeheartedly defended Nvidia for their 970 fraud over at 3DCenter for almost years, and now suddenly change all your opinions by 180°.
Srsly?

[CruNcher]

I didn't defend their fraud at all but the economic decision for it product wise it gave users a cheap solution compared to the upper lineup, i absolutely did not agree with keeping it secret not one second.
And i still stand behind the Balance of the GTX 970 as i stand behind the Balance of the GTX 1060 (updated 970 with 2.5 GB more) though the Balance of the RX 480 is overall much better (not because of the 8GB) and i compare it more in direction to the 1070 which is partly amazing ;)

[NikosD]

It seems that Nvidia hasn't implemented yet in driver another very basic feature of DX12 which is multi-GPU

For RX 480 the scaling works just fine.

Read here:
https://www.pcper.com/news/Graphics-Cards/DX12-Multi-GPU-scaling-and-running-Deus-Ex-Mankind-Divided

[huhn]

it is known to work even with a GPU mix of AMD and NVIDIA.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/10067/ashes-of-the-singularity-revisited-beta/4

[NikosD]

No.

Don't mix different things.

AoS is just a benchmark.

Now we are talking about a real world AAA game title that it wasn't at all known that MULTI-GPU of even a Pascal card 1060 doesn't work.

AMD excels in this feature:
http://radeon.com/en-us/deus-ex-directx-12-mgpu/

[CruNcher]

Ah very nice Vega Sinle GPU 1070 contender Prediciton also

https://www.pcper.com/files/imagecache/article_max_width/news/2016-11-01/mankind1080-avg.png

Vega will be most likely 2x as fast as current RX 480 ;)

lets predict a little less overhead and you would be exactly at 100 FPS in this test with Vega ;)

Though this Engine is really the perfect result using its Deferred+ Render Core


if you do +40 FPS addition to the GTX 1060 + 2*20 FPS you should be at GTX 1080 result ;)

and that is exactly MultiGPU RX 480 result ;)

[huhn]

AoS is a game you can play it...

Deus Ex is more known to be broken in DX 12 than anything else.

[nevcairiel]

Its one single game, which is clearly sponsored by AMD. Considering multi-gpu modes in DX12 are largely controlled by the game, I wouldn't trust a single result to conclusively point to anything.
Its really one of the big problems with DX12 - its all on the game developers. And most DX12 games so far have had serious implementation issues one way or another - which is no big surprise, developers also have to learn, but alas its where we are.

In any case multi-gpu has always been nothing but a small niche, so I couldn't care less (because once you hit a game that doesn't support any of it, half of your performance is gone - rather go fast single card).
It may even be that it only doesn't work on a 1060, because its also sold as a card without SLI capabilities - but of course the website didn't test anything else.

Additionally there is 3 different multi-gpu modes that developers can use in DX12. At least one of those is known to work on NVIDIA since thats what AoS uses, but presumably DXMD uses another mode.

PS:
Found another one testing the same thing on different hardware, where it works just fine (1070/1080)
http://www.pcgamesn.com/deus-ex-mankind-divided/deus-ex-mankind-divided-dx12-performance

So its either just the 1060, or the other site screwed up somewhere, who knows.

[NikosD]

But that's even more embarrassing and irritating for Nvidia's 1060 card owners.

SLI has nothing to do with multi-GPU of DX12, Vulkan, OpenCL.

You can sell a card with SLI disabled/ not supported but why on earth you decide to cut it from MULTI-GPU functionality in general ?

The 300€ of 1060 card are not enough to have multi-GPU on recent and future DX12/Vulkan games ?

Nvidia...same tricks as always.

[huhn]

i give you simple reasons why multi GPU support on the 1060 is not that important.

~1.5 years ago i brought a GTX 960 for around 230. today i replaced it with a RX 480 which cost again ~230. i didn't even think for sec to go SLI because buying a new card is obviously the better choice.

the next problem are proper SLI/crossfire boards x8/x8. you have to pay an extra for such a board that is money you can better spend on the GPU in the first place.

and it is still not known if the 1060 doesn't support multi GPU it is just a theory.

[NikosD]

Multi-GPU is not SLI.

Also, the world is not spinning around your preferences.

mGPU is there for 1070/1080 cards.

Multi-GPU should be a functionality of 1060 cards, it's a high middle class card around ~300€

[huhn]

sli/crossfire boards are needed for the 8x/8x PCIe.
do you really want to run a multi GPU config with a 4x PCIe slot?
it doesn't matter what type of multi GPU you are running you still need to feed it data.

and i can easily get a 1060 3Gb for ~210 and a 6 gb for ~260 euro.

[Atak_Snajpera]

why would you buy 1060 3GB for 210 euro when you can have xfx 470 rs 4GB for less than 200?

In games like titanfall 2 and in latest cod 470 =1060.

[CruNcher]

But that's even more embarrassing and irritating for Nvidia's 1060 card owners.

SLI has nothing to do with multi-GPU of DX12, Vulkan, OpenCL.

You can sell a card with SLI disabled/ not supported but why on earth you decide to cut it from MULTI-GPU functionality in general ?

The 300€ of 1060 card are not enough to have multi-GPU on recent and future DX12/Vulkan games ?

Nvidia...same tricks as always.

It looks like it could be another clever Nvidia Software/Hardware lock i hope not :D

But as you said it would be typical Nvidia to enforce Artificial restrictions to not hurt their Product Range and for them SLI = Multi-GPU just with another Name and their Copyright on it ;)


Most probably that's also what they gonna answer to it ("But we said the 1060 has no SLI support and we said in our presentation its a equal function to Multi-GPU, so logically we meant with that both isn't supported,touche" ;) )

But you shouldn't argue about it it would be absolutely their right to decide this for self protecting and investor protection.


why would you buy 1060 3GB for 210 euro when you can have xfx 470 rs 4GB for less than 200?

In games like titanfall 2 and in latest cod 470 =1060.


Which is perfectly logic hardware wise it equals it :)

The RX 480 is raw power higher then the 1060 and the 1060 equals almost exactly the 970 + 2.5 GB and some updated properties Nvidia pushed again most of the improvements into the Power Efficiency like they do since Maxwell and of course we see that they could update VPX over the whole range as well up to 8k additionally with the same update that Tegra X1 and GM206 got way beforehand in the last cycle ;)

And the 1070 reaches +20 fps with the same power draw :)

Btw im only calculating from UHD ;) not 1080p on 1080p the win is higher of course

And there is a reason why i use UHD it yields more stable render results between reviewers, there are way less render fluctuations to account for, it's way more reliable and it becomes the ultimate goal on the PS4 Pro to reach at best without checkerboard rendering ;)

Unfortunately the Trend at reviewers goes into the Direction to rather not test UHD on underpowered Hardware a big failure.

[Atak_Snajpera]

RX470 is really great GPU for 200 euro
https://i.imgsafe.org/1f94e786c4.png https://i.imgsafe.org/1fa45c1f79.png

[huhn]

than buy one...

[Atak_Snajpera]

than buy one...

You meant "then" or "than" ?

[CruNcher]

It is but the headroom for 4K is pretty darn small with that 4GB you gonna running into problems somewhere, even with good streaming and pretty good texture compression

RX 480 is more future proof and Vega will be blasting, it will be really interesting to see if UVD gonna get a update as well or if the throughput just will get better with the enhanced DCE :)

Infinite Warfare though lacks some excellent Workflow work Sledgehammer Games did on Advanced Warfare previously to Infinity Ward :(

i really have the feeling playing infinite Warfare nobody really cared about Spatial Render Quality Results so much in Advanced Warfare it's the direct opposite


If Sleedgehammer is going to combine both next with some of treyarchs results that will be rocking i miss that ultra clean render output Results

http://i1.sendpic.org/t/n7/n7s0O4LFp75MhqpsxEj0MahrxRg.jpg (http://sendpic.org/view/1/i/gpwHvNk9IkbmPNat5XK6vc9C432.png)

even if many other stuff was excellently improved :)

[huhn]

UHD doesn't matter for a card like the RX 470/480 or 1060 they are simply to slow for modern games at UHD.

i can't get stable 30 FPS at UHD in dark souls 3 with my RX 480 the card is simply way to slow for that.

[CruNcher]

yeah there every frame counts 22-25 though should be possible like in the witcher 3 but From Softwares Engine is known to be not very performant at all ;)


Motionblur=Medium
Shadows= Medium
Effects= Medium

and 30 fps should be though doable or even better turn Motionblur completely off

youtube results speak other words also 33.3 ms 30 fps is doable on the 470 even with that Crap Engine in 4K :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOLRj7v8Or0

[CruNcher]

I tried to understand why im so fascinated by this rather old output results by Sleedgehammer Games IWE Engine Branch of the characters and all the smooth surfaces especially for the Render Performance in 4K

http://www.graphics.stanford.edu/~niessner/brainerd2016efficient.html

. Our approach achieves performance up to three times that of state-of-the-art methods for typical tessellation factors.
We have integrated our approach into a production game engine (Figure 19), and hope that by demonstrating a streamlined approach
for rendering full-featured subdivision surface models, we can spur further interest in, and adoption of, subdivision surfaces in game rendering.
With further improvements in hardware, subdivision surfaces may soon be as easy to render as triangle meshes.