Best time to uprade to Windows 10?

[stax76]

I've a full Windows 7 Home Premium retail license and want to upgrade to Windows 10 at the end of the month. Is it right that once I've upgraded to Windows 10 I can still replace my hardware without loosing the free license? I'm asking because I want to buy Intel Skylake hardware at the end of the year because it features a H265 encoder. All I found on this topic is described in the following article:

http://www.techrepublic.com/article/windows-10-will-microsoft-charge-you-if-you-need-to-reinstall

[LoRd_MuldeR]

According to this (http://business.chip.de/news/Windows-10-Versionen-und-Preise-So-teuer-ist-das-neue-Windows_79132519.html) source, a retail license of Windows 7 or 8.1 will be "upgraded" to a retail license of Windows 10, which is not bound to the hardware (in contrast to OEM licenses).

It also says your old Windows 7 or 8.1 will be lost once you "upgrade" to Windows 10 - unless you "downgrade" again within 30 days.

[Atak_Snajpera]

and you are ok with forced updates? In pro version you can only delay updates for few months. This means that m$ can inject accidently broken update. BTW Are you a gamer that you intend to upgrade from well designed and better looking win7?

[stax76]

and you are ok with forced updates? In pro version you can only delay updates for few months. This means that m$ can inject accidently broken update. BTW Are you a gamer that you intend to upgrade from well designed and better looking win7?

I see no problem with forced updates. I migrated today, so far everything is fine. You are right that a couple of things like the old design will be missed but then there are a lot good new things. I'm looking forward to learn everything new both as windows user and windows programmer.

[nevcairiel]

and you are ok with forced updates? In pro version you can only delay updates for few months.

i've never had to delay an update for that long. If one was broken, it was usually only for a couple days until it was fixed.

In any case, MS also released a tool just recently to block specific updates entirely. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3073930

[Atak_Snajpera]

The problem is that broken update can kill your windows installation. This has happened few times to win7 and win8. I'm also really shocked that you germans accept that m$ has full control over your pc. This is just perfect gift for nsa guys. Btw that tool should've been integrated in windows like we used to have in past. Win10 is just a dx12 with ugly icons, ugly flat design and less shizophremic ui. Keep in mind that win10 is still in beta phase. Major update is planned for october already.

[Groucho2004]

Windows 7 is as far as I will go. I bought a license last week and I'll probably make the transition from XP soon.

My wife has a new laptop with Win8.1, every time I (have to) do something on it I feel nauseated. This is not a desktop OS any more. Way too much bloat and idiotic bells and whistles.

Reading the posts about Win10 over at MSFN confirm that it is even worse. MS, go f*ck yourself.

[huhn]

you can change most behavior of windows 10.

the difference between my windows 10 and windows 7 is very minimal i just have a way better working desktop composition which isn't totally broken like the windows 7 one.

in general it is just running like a bug fixed windows 7. the major update are feature update so windows 10 can still do up to date things even in 5 years.

and you "don't" have to install update. go to service and stop it isn't that hard.

MS has full control over my PC? it's not like MS has to go through some other security than windows it self didn't they?

[Atak_Snajpera]

and you "don't" have to install update. go to service and stop it isn't that hard.
Good idea. Fix problem with hammer instead of screw driver. Looks like great improvement and step in right direction indeed!
Does win10 have this ? As you can see I'm in charge here. I install what I want. Win10 is basically treating you like idiot. "NOPE! WE KNOW BETTER WHAT IS GOOD FOR YOU!". Do not forget that Cortana is always ON and listening! NSA is in heaven right now ;) No wonder that this crap is given away for free!
http://i.cubeupload.com/hwBllw.png
http://i.cubeupload.com/IohhmP.png

[huhn]

Good idea. Fix problem with hammer instead of screw driver. Looks like great improvement and step in right direction indeed!
Does win10 have this ? As you can see I'm in charge here. I install what I want. Win10 is basically treating you like idiot. "NOPE! WE KNOW BETTER WHAT IS GOOD FOR YOU!". Do not forget that Cortana is always ON and listening! NSA is in heaven right now ;) No wonder that this crap is given away for free!
http://i.cubeupload.com/hwBllw.png
http://i.cubeupload.com/IohhmP.png

yes you can choice what you want to install and what not (german):

http://www.chip.de/news/Windows-10-Autoupdate-deaktivieren-Microsoft-Tool-schaltet-Zwangs-Patch-ab_81468507.html

and cortana can be disabled. i disabled it in the installation.

and yes windows is treating his user as an idiot and that's not even enough for 99% of all windows user because they don't know what they are doing and are kind of idiots if it comes to PCs and the internet.

the major issue i have with windows 10 is that the real administrator user is no longer 100% usable.
it was risky to use but i still did this with no issue in my windows 7 times what so ever.

[Keiyakusha]

I'm using win7 and plan to keep doing so in the future. Unless you are a gamer and want to take advantage of directx12 (which you probably won't for at least a year or so anyway) I see absolutely zero reasons to switch to win10. As far as interface goes, it is absolutely possible to make win7 look identical to win8 or win10 without help of 3rd party software (of course minus metro apps). Just need to hack the theme a bit to import new resources. Engine-wise, win8/10 ui is a subset of the one in win7 anyway.

What are the benefits for non-gamers though? Flac+Mkv support? Even if we'll assume that they aren't slow and buggy, like pretty much all of the M$ filters, this is probably only a good news for hardcore WMP users.

As for windows updates, personally I have a list of updates that I simply do not want to have on my pc at all. On win7, simply hiding them does the job. Also why windows update is allowed to restart my PC without confirmation if it thinks I am not using PC at this moment.

Btw, what about all these privacy issues? Was all of this removed (https://i.4cdn.org/g/1437844301526.png)? I don't want to invest my time to check it. If at least some of this crap remains, i'll never install it.
Edit: and I don't mean "i want to have a proper way to disable it". I want all the underlying code to be totally and absolutely removed from the windows before I'll consider switching to it. With all this windows update bullshit, there's no telling when something like this will be re-enabled or new things added without me knowing it.

[Kurtnoise]

Good idea. Fix problem with hammer instead of screw driver. Looks like great improvement and step in right direction indeed!
Does win10 have this ? As you can see I'm in charge here. I install what I want. Win10 is basically treating you like idiot. "NOPE! WE KNOW BETTER WHAT IS GOOD FOR YOU!". Do not forget that Cortana is always ON and listening! NSA is in heaven right now ;) No wonder that this crap is given away for free!
NSA doesn't need that you have a Windows OS to spy you...

[Atak_Snajpera]

huhn that tool works more like post-cure not like vaccine.

[huhn]

huhn that tool works more like post-cure not like vaccine.

you can run it before windows update and stop update before you have to install them.

just use defer updates and run the tool when you want to update windows first.

I'm using win7 and plan to keep doing so in the future. Unless you are a gamer and want to take advantage of directx12 (which you probably won't for at least a year or so anyway) I see absolutely zero reasons to switch to win10. As far as interface goes, it is absolutely possible to make win7 look identical to win8 or win10 without help of 3rd party software (of course minus metro apps). Just need to hack the theme a bit to import new resources. Engine-wise, win8/10 ui is a subset of the one in win7 anyway.

you may let it look like windows 10 but you don't get the performance boost from WDDM 2.0/DX12.

and i wouldn't be shocked if the first DX12 games come out next month. microsoft own so many game studios it should be easy to force a game to DX12 for them.

What are the benefits for non-gamers though? Flac+Mkv support? Even if we'll assume that they aren't slow and buggy, like pretty much all of the M$ filters, this is probably only a good news for hardcore WMP users.

MS MF HEVC decoder is main8 and main10 and is still the fastest HEVC software decoder. lavfilter is using some MS MF decoder too just as a side note.

As for windows updates, personally I have a list of updates that I simply do not want to have on my pc at all. On win7, simply hiding them does the job. Also why windows update is allowed to restart my PC without confirmation if it thinks I am not using PC at this moment.

it is allowed to restart your PC windows 10 ?

i'm using windows 10 since October and this didn't happen even once:

http://abload.de/img/update8mxgw.png

Btw, what about all these privacy issues? Was all of this removed (https://i.4cdn.org/g/1437844301526.png)? I don't want to invest my time to check it. If at least some of this crap remains, i'll never install it.
Edit: and I don't mean "i want to have a proper way to disable it". I want all the underlying code to be totally and absolutely removed from the windows before I'll consider switching to it. With all this windows update bullshit, there's no telling when something like this will be re-enabled or new things added without me knowing it.


this is not going to happen which anti virus tool doesn't do the same? if i'm not mistaken the privy thing can be disabled in the installer. it should still be possible to replace windows defender which another antivirus tool and yes the forced anti virus is a bad think in windows but makes sense for the AVG PC user.


and isn't windows 7 doing most of this too?

[foxyshadis]

Geez, guys, if you want to upgrade, upgrade, if you want to skip it, skip it. You don't need to convince everyone else to do the same. The proof will be in the pudding, when the sky doesn't fall.

I feel like every single time a new OS comes out, the same camps line up to defend and tear down the new one, over the exact same issues that the now old OS was attacked for back in its day.

[huhn]

aren't we still pretty civilized?

[Keiyakusha]

foxyshadis
well, none of the previous OSes had this much of "useful" stuff.

you may let it look like windows 10 but you don't get the performance boost from WDDM 2.0/DX12.

and i wouldn't be shocked if the first DX12 games come out next month. microsoft own so many game studios it should be easy to force a game to DX12 for them.
That's fine. Gamers most likely will be forced to use win10, there's no way around it. Other than for games, you hardly need anything but DX9


MS MF HEVC decoder is main8 and main10 and is still the fastest HEVC software decoder. lavfilter is using some MS MF decoder too just as a side note.
I can believe that. but MS will likely never improve it beyond its current level. By the time people will start to make HEVC backups on a constant basis, hopefully FFMPEG's decoder will be improved. Also I remember that LAV is using some MS decoder, forgot which one. But that's likely because no one really uses this format and never bothered to make a proper OS alternative. What was it, interlaced VC1? Nah, can't remember.

it is allowed to restart your PC windows 10 ?
Looks like they changed this


this is not going to happen which anti virus tool doesn't do the same? if i'm not mistaken the privy thing can be disabled in the installer. it should still be possible to replace windows defender which another antivirus tool and yes the forced anti virus is a bad think in windows but makes sense for the AVG PC user.

I don't count antivirus as a privacy issue. For this one ability to permanently disable it will be okay. As for win7, aside from windows defender it doesn't have any of that. If it can be disabled during install, that's great. I'll do a research about it at some point.

[huhn]

I can believe that. but MS will likely never improve it beyond its current level. By the time people will start to make HEVC backups on a constant basis, hopefully FFMPEG's decoder will be improved. Also I remember that LAV is using some MS decoder, forgot which one. But that's likely because no one really uses this format and never bothered to make a proper OS alternative. What was it, interlaced VC1? Nah, can't remember.

dvd playback should be one of it too. the rest should mircosoft codecs.

I don't count antivirus as a privacy issue. For this one ability to permanently disable it will be okay. As for win7, aside from windows defender it doesn't have any of that. If it can be disabled during install, that's great. I'll do a research about it at some point.

the windows 10 defender cna be stopped with this forever:

http://winaero.com/blog/disable-or-enable-windows-defender-in-windows-10/

Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00

;Turn off Windows Defender

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows Defender]
"DisableAntiSpyware"=dword:00000001

I guess this whole privacy stuff is needed thank to this, in my eyes, useless cloud stuff.

the major issue with windows 7 is the totally broken desktop composition. if you need to change the refresh rate to match it with your source file for smooth playback you are kind of doomed with this OS.

i don't even want to start talking about the general issue with 2 monitors with different refreshrates... dooms day...

[Keiyakusha]

huhn

I don't really see why you are giving so much attention to the windows defender, which is probably the least important thing. Still I don't find registry hacks to be an acceptable solution.


the major issue with windows 7 is the totally broken desktop composition. if you need to change the refresh rate to match it with your source file for smooth playback you are kind of doomed with this OS.

i don't even want to start talking about the general issue with 2 monitors with different refreshrates... dooms day...
I can argue about both of these statements, but within the current thread this is likely a bad idea and will make foxyshadis angry ^^ Anyway, I am here not to convince you that win10 is bad. If you already have it installed, you likely concluded that it is good enough for you. Also you won't be able to convince me that it is good as I already concluded that it is not good enough for me (or brings no benefits, at best). My main reasoning for even posting here was to make people who are still undecided to reconsider switching to win10.

[Atak_Snajpera]

Besides DX12 will have alternative called Vulkan. Unlike DX12 it will work on Linux,Vista,Win7,Win8,Win10. Hmm. Guess what API will guarantee higher revenue for game developers. Vulkan has strong support from Valve. After all they also need low level api for their Steam OS. Support for Vulkan is already announced in Unreal Engine 4. Probably the most popular game engine right now due to good licensing terms and high flexibility.

[nevcairiel]

Besides DX12 will have alternative called Vulkan. Unlike DX12 it will work on Linux,Vista,Win7,Win8,Win10. Hmm. Guess what API will guarantee higher revenue for game developers. Vulkan has strong support from Valve. After all they also need low level api for their Steam OS. Support for Vulkan is already announced in Unreal Engine 4. Probably the most popular game engine right now due to good licensing terms and high flexibility.

You could have argued the same thing for OpenGL vs DX9/10/11 for the last 10 years, yet DX was still the more commonly used graphics API, so I don't expect this to actually be any different.

[Atak_Snajpera]

DX12 is like CUDA. Vulkan will be like OpenCL. End of story. Besides times have changed. Valve is in business right now. They really need low level api.

[huhn]

the xbox one and most likely the ps4 will use dx12 so it is really clear what will win here.

[Atak_Snajpera]

PS4? Are you joking? Sony WILL NEVER USE Microsoft's API! NEVER! They have already own low level api. If they ever switch api (which is not very likely) it will be Vulkan and not DX12.

http://gamingbolt.com/ps4-should-support-vulkan-ps4s-api-not-completely-native-for-current-gen-yet-brad-wardell

DX12 is a dead end like CUDA from NVidia. Besides porting from/to DX12 <-> Vulkan is a lot less painful than DX11 <-> OpenGL.

[huhn]

the GNM and GNMX have a API which is very close to DX 11.2 and openGL 4.4 that is no wonder the build in jaguar in both consoles is DX11.2.

so yes they don't use dx 11. but most important you have to do extra work for the PS4 any way and using DX for the rest is making less effort.

[Reel.Deel]

Windows 7 is as far as I will go... MS, go f*ck yourself.

My sentiments exactly.

[raffriff42]

Regarding staying with Win7 vs Win 8 or 10 - I went with Windows 8.1 on my new machine this year, even though I knew I would hate it at first. I did so because I also knew I would be supporting Windows 8 more and more, for work, friends and family, so I preferred to get used to it at home, at my leisure. It took me a month and a lot of Googling, but I have been able to work around, or live with, the changes from WinXP. There have been a few positives (File Copy is one), but some things never change (Troubleshooting Wizards still utterly useless).

Regarding any new OS, I would wait as long as possible. Let the early adopters find the problems and their solutions.

[Groucho2004]

It took me a month and a lot of Googling, but I have been able to work around, or live with, the changes from WinXP.
That's the whole point. You spent a whole month looking for these workarounds. It's insane.
For WinXP, I need maybe 2 hours of tweaking after installation to get it to my liking (and I'm really fussy).

In my opinion, a OS should not need workarounds for bullshit that the designers try to shove down people's throats. An OS should be an interface between the hardware and the programs and nothing else. It should be for the most part invisible.

[NikosD]

Win 10 can give life to old hardware used for Web browsing, a very common process of the average user.

Microsoft Edge clearly lacks stability and features, but its speed is insane.

My 9 year old laptop can play 1080p YouTube videos for the first time with that HW, using Edge of course.

Win 10 is a light and very fast OS not fully cleansed of bugs right now, but it is the future as an ongoing process and not a solid version.

According to MS there will be no Win 11, 12 etc.

Win 10 is the last old type OS and the first new type OS.

Microsoft updates from now on will not include security updates or minor patches/ feature additions only, but even the next OS will be "just" a Microsoft update.

And to reply to the initial poster, if you change your motherboard, you can't use the already activated Win 10.

You can change your configuration and install Win 10 only when you buy the license.

Free upgrade or clean install after the activation is allowed for one motherboard.

Upgrade your hardware first, install after.

[sneaker_ger]

And to reply to the initial poster, if you change your motherboard, you can't use the already activated Win 10.

You can change your configuration and install Win 10 only when you buy the license.
Current reports and answers from Microsoft are very confusing. It's not really clear and may even depend on your Region. Microsoft has in the past already failed to enforce their ideas of licensing in specific countries.

[NikosD]

That's what I read here, in poor Greece which unfortunately is still in Eurozone, BTW.

[sneaker_ger]

In Germany (where I think stax is from) licenses are not bound to hardware. But it seems Germany is the only country in the world where Microsoft acknowledges this exception.

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/OEM/Windows/10/UseTerms_OEM_Windows_10_English.htm
4. Transfer. The provisions of this section do not apply if you acquired the software as a consumer in Germany or in any of the countries listed on this site (aka.ms/transfer), in which case any transfer of the software to a third party, and the right to use it, must comply with applicable law.

But we'll see how it plays out. I think in the past Microsoft wasn't very strict in enforcing their rules anyways.

[Atak_Snajpera]

LOL! Free2pay ideas even in solitaire? What will be next? Free2Use and micro transactions for build in calculator? Win10 smells like trap. Remember. In real life nothing is for free. We have saying here that "for free you can be only punched in face"
http://www.benchmark.pl/uploads/backend_img/b/windows-10-pasjans.jpg

Btw. Remember that after 30 days your old installation will be deleted and old key will be invalidated.

[foxyshadis]

LOL! Free2pay ideas even in solitaire? What will be next? Free2Use and micro transactions for build in calculator? Win10 smells like trap. Remember. In real life nothing is for free. We have saying here that "for free you can be only punched in face"[/IMG]

Btw. Remember that after 30 days your old installation will be deleted and old key will be invalidated.

Your key stays functional for as long as Microsoft's activation servers stay alive. 30 days is the length of time the 8.1 backup is kept, after that it gets cleaned to free up space; obviously you can do it sooner if you like. I don't know why anyone would wait more than 30 days to revert a backup, you can usually tell if you're going to be able to live with something in 24 hours or less.

Turning built-in games into shareware is a disappointing trend, though. At least the rest of the components are fully functional.

[stax76]

I've a full Windows 7 Home Premium retail license and want to upgrade to Windows 10 at the end of the month. Is it right that once I've upgraded to Windows 10 I can still replace my hardware without loosing the free license? I'm asking because I want to buy Intel Skylake hardware at the end of the year because it features a H265 encoder. All I found on this topic is described in the following article:

http://www.techrepublic.com/article/windows-10-will-microsoft-charge-you-if-you-need-to-reinstall

I failed to make a clean Win10 install and use my upgraded Win10 Home license on my new Z170 board, the key extracted by a tool was accepted by the setup but the activation was denied and MS support told me on new hardware I have to upgrade again on new hardware installing Win7 first. In my case this was not possible because Win7 was asking for a SATA driver (maybe because my boot drive is a M.2 SSD) but the SATA driver from Gigabyte was denied from Windows. I tried to download the driver from Intel directly but it was denied as well.

Furthermore it's somehow tricky to upgrade Win7 because the Win10 upgrade process aborts on a standard Win7 install because the 100 MB system-reserved partition is too small. This can be fixed by changing the boot drive with EasyBCD from system-reserved to C and deleting the system-reserved partition, without system-reserved partition the upgrade process works but then the Win10 system won't have a system-reserved partition meaning it don't has recovery options. It's probably possible to resize the system-reserved partition but not easy.

Because there wasn't a way around the driver issue I simply bought a Win8.1 Pro key for 18€, this has the SATA drivers included and the 350MB system-reserved partition is big enough for the Win10 upgrade process. Another advantage is I have now the Pro edition instead of the Home edition.

On one site I was reading that MS wants to make the upgrade process easier providing a new tool, on another site I was reading the support will active the clean install on new hardware. I use my old license now on the old PC which I keep.

[smok3]

omg, after reading some of this thread the El captain does look kinda cute.

[raffriff42]

Best time to upgrade to Windows 10? Consider the following:
* Forced updates (http://tech.slashdot.org/story/15/07/17/1226229/windows-10-home-updates-to-be-automatic-and-mandatory). You don't know what they will do (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/08/17/microsoft_replaces_windows_10_patch_update_wont_say_why/).
* Privacy issues. (http://yro.slashdot.org/story/15/08/26/225239/how-to-keep-microsofts-nose-out-of-your-personal-data-in-windows-10)
* Will inevitably (IMHO) morph into payware (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/31/rising_and_ongoing_cost_of_windows/), no matter what Microsoft says.

[hello_hello]

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/OEM/Windows/10/UseTerms_OEM_Windows_10_English.htm
13 c. Malware protection. Microsoft cares about protecting your device from malware. The software will turn on malware protection if other protection is not installed or has expired. To do so, other antimalware software will be disabled or may have to be removed.

Is running anti-malware software compulsory? I'd certainly hope not, given I've run XP for years without anti-malware or anti-virus and it'd seem like a backward step to be forced to run it on an OS that we're supposed to believe is more secure.

[foxyshadis]

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/OEM/Windows/10/UseTerms_OEM_Windows_10_English.htm
13 c. Malware protection. Microsoft cares about protecting your device from malware. The software will turn on malware protection if other protection is not installed or has expired. To do so, other antimalware software will be disabled or may have to be removed.

Is running anti-malware software compulsory? I'd certainly hope not, given I've run XP for years without anti-malware or anti-virus and it'd seem like a backward step to be forced to run it on an OS that we're supposed to believe is more secure.

No, it's not compulsory, but it's less convenient to disable than it used to be. You have to use local policy to disable it, now. (http://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/5918-windows-defender-turn-off-windows-10-a.html)

[burfadel]

If you want to classify a 'best time' to upgrade, it would most probably be after the TH2 release, so later in the year.

'Forced' automatic updates are because people would turn off automatic updates then not update. This was either by people thinking they know what they're doing, or by people who follow the advice of the people who think they knew what they were doing. Windows 10 will constantly be evolving, it's basically based on the service model that a lot of other software companies have switched to... you pay for the software license not the actual software.

[amayra]

the best time when nsa shutting down or MS make OS open source .

[Asmodian]

the best time when nsa shutting down or MS make OS open source .

I don't think running Windows 7 instead of 10 will do a lot to protect you from the NSA. :rolleyes:

[CWR03]

http://imageshack.com/a/img673/7025/TSPvPD.jpg