MadVR (+LAVfilters) hardware requirements

[Thunderbolt8]

What is the current CPU & GPU/graphic card you would need to play native 1080p stuff flawlessly with madvr (+lavfilters), with jinc or nnedi3 (128 tabs) for chroma upsampling (also for 1080p59/60 content. no scaling or image doubling involved though) AND have a rather silent system at the same time?

basically what cpu+gpu power is needed for that, but also doesnt create too much noise (fans etc.)?

so achieving Jinc 4 taps is rather easy, but NNEDI3 128 tabs really hard? anyone able to tell how much the difference of picture quality is?

[Asmodian]

NNEDI3 (128 tabs): it isn't "tabs". I suspect you are thinking of "taps" which is what other scalars like Jinc use. NNEDI3 is a neural net and uses 16 to 256 neurons.

I understand what you mean though. Sorry I just had to put that there.

Jinc3 is much easier than NNEDI3 128, why Jinc or NNEDI3 128? Why not NNEDI3 32 or 64?

If you want silent you cannot do NNEDI3 128, but NNEDI3 128 is overkill for chroma scaling anyway. Stick to NNEDI3 32.

I know a 750Ti is good for Jinc3 chroma + luma for 1080p30 scaled to 4K so that is much more than you need for Jinc3 but probably close to what you would need for high neuron NNEDI3.

[michkrol]

What is the current CPU & GPU/graphic card you would need to play native 1080p stuff flawlessly with madvr (+lavfilters), with jinc or nnedi3 (128 tabs) for chroma upsampling (also for 1080p59/60 content. no scaling or image doubling involved though) AND have a rather silent system at the same time?

basically what cpu+gpu power is needed for that, but also doesnt create too much noise (fans etc.)?

so achieving Jinc 4 taps is rather easy, but NNEDI3 128 tabs really hard? anyone able to tell how much the difference of picture quality is?
I personally can't see much of a difference between bicubic75, jinc3 and NNEDI chroma upscaling with 1080p sources played at 1080p.

My Geforce GTX750Ti overclocked to ~1,4GHz can do Jinc3AR chroma + debanding + error diffusion without problem in under 7ms, so even without OC you're good with a GTX750Ti for 1080p60 content.
On the other hand it can barely manage NNEDI 16 for chroma upscaling under 16ms, but without error diffusion and debanding, so it won't manage NNEDI 16 chroma upsaling for 1080p60 without overclock.
I have a dual fan Geforce 750Ti from Gigabyte which is rather quiet and overclocks nicely, but some passively-cooled variants are on the way, so if you want absolute silence you might want to wait.

As for the CPU, I don't know what to recommend. It highly depends on using or not using NNEDI for scaling.
On a quick test 1080p60 with jinc3 chroma scaling uses ~13% CPU, while NNEDI 16 chroma scaling uses ~45% CPU on my Intel Core i5 3570K (4 cores @ 4GHz), but take this results with a grain of salt, since it was a really quick test.

To sum up I think you should check if you can see any advantage from using NNEDI for chroma scaling.
I myself am not using NNEDI for chroma, but I am using luma image doubling for SD sources (DVD) and Geforce 750Ti is a nice compromise between performance and noise for me.

One thing that's occurred to me is that for 1080p on 1080p screen playback you could even get away with using integrated GPU if you could live without jinc for chroma upscaling.
If it's a build for movies only, getting a mini-ITX motherboard with soldered, passively cooled Celeron 1037U or similar might just do the trick. Paired with an SSD and pico-PSU (or any other passively cooled PSU) you get absolute silence and just enough performance for movies (at least until HEVC becomes widely used).

[pie1394]

The Tonga-core (R9 285 ?) GPU might be a good choice to run NNEDI3 up to 60 fps contents since it has the similar performance to Tahiti-core (HD79x0, R9 280x) -- but with TDP around 100w (also 2x power efficiency with the same TSMC 28nm HPM process just like Kepler --> Maxwell)... If these numbers are true, it is really impressive.

My HD7970 is a 3-slot-sized-fan design. But the fans still spin like crazy under >= 70~80% GPU loading with default GPU core clock (925MHz). Under max clock 550 MHz and -20% power consumption, some GPU-stressful settings like Debanding_Angle_Detection / Chroma NNEDI3_16 / SD Luma NNEDI3_64 / HD Luma NNEDI3_32 / Upscaling Lanczos4AR / Downscaling Spline36_AR_LL still work with most contents up to 1080i60 to 1080p output.

[feelingblue]

with Ati 6850 OC and 1080p@23.976 i can use:

1) dithering error diffusion 1 or 2
2) Chroma Nnedi3 32 neurons

With zero dropped frames and rendering 37ms on esclusive mode.

The GPU is at 80/90% and fans are a little loud.

the CPU is free to decode and process postprocessing scripts on avisynth and so the PQ is very very high.

But onestly, in a film, the human eye cannot see a real difference between Nnedi3 and even lanczos AR.

Only in some dedicated patterns is possible.

For what i think to upgrade a GPU only to use Nnedi is a waste of money.

[Thunderbolt8]

One thing that's occurred to me is that for 1080p on 1080p screen playback you could even get away with using integrated GPU if you could live without jinc for chroma upscaling.nah, whats the point of madvr then? then I can use other renderers if I didnt care for quality that much ;)

thanks for all the testing!

I thought about NNEDI3 128 neurons, because theres still some more shaprness compared to only 16 neuros and aliasing seems to be almost eliminated at that stage. that is all on theoretical grounds only though, just based on these diagrams presented in the settings tab!

[feelingblue]

nah, whats the point of madvr then? then I can use other renderers if I didnt care for quality that much ;)


For me the real advantages of madvr are 3dlut and scaler SD to FHD


I thought about NNEDI3 128 neurons, because theres still some more shaprness compared to only 16 neuros and aliasing seems to be almost eliminated at that stage. that is all on theoretical grounds only though, just based on these diagrams presented in the settings tab!

I think there are two worlds, technical aspect and practical aspect
Technically you are right, nnedi3 128 is the best and probabily you must buy a top card.

Practically I challenge everybody to find differences between an intel NUC (low / middle settings) and a super PC (high / extreme settings) during a real BD vision, excluding heavy postprocessing obviously.

I say this because I have done alot of comparative tests on my 120" screen.
I guarantee that on a so big screen you can see even the most subtle differences.

The only differences are on dedicated test pattern.

[Bulldogger]

What is the current CPU & GPU/graphic card you would need to play native 1080p stuff flawlessly with madvr (+lavfilters), with jinc or nnedi3 (128 tabs) for chroma upsampling (also for 1080p59/60 content. no scaling or image doubling involved though) AND have a rather silent system at the same time?

basically what cpu+gpu power is needed for that, but also doesnt create too much noise (fans etc.)?

so achieving Jinc 4 taps is rather easy, but NNEDI3 128 tabs really hard? anyone able to tell how much the difference of picture quality is? I am running a Asus Hero VII, i7 4790k not overclocked, 16gb Kingston 2400mhz ram, Plextor M.2 SSD and the Asus R9 290x Directcu ii in a Silverstone CW02 case. It can do chroma upsamling nnedi3 with 128 neurons with 1080p material and error diffusion option 1. I can't hear the fans on the Asus unless I put my ear to the case. I just switched from a Sapphire R 290x with Prolimatech MK-26 cooler and Prolimatech USV14 fans. I could not hear the fans at all with that set-up. It was just huge. Temps with the Asus R9 290x Directcu II are running about 65 degrees and the fans are spinning at about 1000rmp.

I just ordered a water block and am going to try that next. I didn't like the Prolimatech solution because it was so big and I don't think I could use the last slot, really on my mother board. Water cooling is actually going to add more stuff to the case but leave as much room on the mother board and be quieter, I hope than the Asus directcu cooler.

[Bulldogger]

For me the real advantages of madvr are 3dlut and scaler SD to FHD



I think there are two worlds, technical aspect and practical aspect
Technically you are right, nnedi3 128 is the best and probabily you must buy a top card.

Practically I challenge everybody to find differences between an intel NUC (low / middle settings) and a super PC (high / extreme settings) during a real BD vision, excluding heavy postprocessing obviously.

I say this because I have done alot of comparative tests on my 120" screen.
I guarantee that on a so big screen you can see even the most subtle differences.

The only differences are on dedicated test pattern. I would disagree. The difference are subtle with 1080p. But after very careful viewing, the images are more "three dimensional" with nnedi3 128 than Jinc 3. When I look at the actors, there bodies seem to be more defined from the back ground. It almost like the effect I see when contrast is improved. I remember when projectors had low contrast and the image seemed very 2 dimensional My vision is 20/15 if that matters. The difference is small but I am certain I see it. It is that same effect I see with lower resolution material but A LOT more subtle. I would call it a 5% improvement.

[feelingblue]

Then it means that every VPR or TV are differents and every video chain is different.

During a BD vision (or in a stopped image) if i change on the fly various best chroma upsampling aplgoritms with Keyboard shortcuts i don't see any differences.
I see differences only from bilinear/NN/softcubic100 and others.

A very intersting topic (but impossible to do) would be ... what is a TV/VPR that allows us to appreciate Madvr with extreme settings?

[Asmodian]

VPR?

I assume your 120" is doing processing in 4:2:2? It would be much harder to notice differences in chroma scaling, of course any differences are also extremely subtle to start with. ;)

[feelingblue]

No.

My vpr is native ycbcr 444.