Encoding vob files

[robo731]

I've seen several different posts about how to encode vob files, but in specific ways, like with autogk, etc... I'm wondering what a good way to go about encoding vob files from a dvd would be. What's a good method if the files need to be merged? Will there be any other necessary steps to take? I saw someone mention making adjustments for the resolution and aspect ratio, will this be necessary? Should the ifo or bup files be used at all?

[HWK]

It depends what you want final output. Based on that you may have to change parameters or program you plan to use.

[robo731]

Ultimately, I'm planning to encode the video to 10-bit h.264 using x264.

[HWK]

You do know going to 10 bit would not improve quality, especially if it is DVD and will also prove challenge during playback. 10 bit require specialized decoders in order to work and most player don't support it.

[robo731]

I understand that there is not native support for it in many players, but both my mpc-hc setup and mx player (android) are caple of 10-bit playback. Is there a reason that it won't be effective, especially due to it being a DVD? It is animation, just so you know.

[HWK]

I understand that there is not native support for it in many players, but both my mpc-hc setup and mx player (android) are caple of 10-bit playback. Is there a reason that it won't be effective, especially due to it being a DVD? It is animation, just so you know.

Animation can be easily compressed in comparison to movie. You can do 10 bit, but I recommended stick to 8 bit which is DVD standard as well. Even blu-ray disk which has quality 6x time higher than dvd is not 10 bit.

Also going from 8 bit to 10 bit will not improve quality but will make file size larger for sure for no gain in quality.

[robo731]

Okay, thanks for the suggestion, I'll just go with 8-bit when I encode. As for a method to do this, what do you suggest?

[HWK]

Okay, thanks for the suggestion, I'll just go with 8-bit when I encode. As for the best method to do this, what do you suggest?

Handbrake would be good candidate for your requirement, it also provide lot of flexibility as well to tweak quality of output.

[robo731]

What about DGIndex? I saw that recommended in a few threads.

[Guest]

What about DGIndex? I saw that recommended in a few threads. It's a low-level tool. Therefore, you have to know what you are doing, or be willing to read and follow available documents and guides. It's very widely used both directly and as component of third-party toolsets.

[robo731]

I see, Well, I could demux the streams from the vob file and then encode from the d2v right?

[HWK]

What about DGIndex? I saw that recommended in a few threads.

It's a low-level tool. Therefore, you have to know what you are doing, or be willing to read and follow available documents and guides. It's very widely used both directly and as component of third-party toolsets.

Robo731, based on our conversation I suggested a tool which can do job without making it complex than it needs to be. One of the thing I do when posting on forum is to assess understanding and level of knowledge of a person regarding question which is asked and then make recommendation based on finding.

[Guest]

I see, Well, I could demux the streams from the vob file and then encode from the d2v right? You wouldn't need to demux the video.

Just read and follow the Quick Start guide that comes with the tools. Make a project, make a script, and then serve the script into x264.

http://neuron2.net/dgmpgdec/QuickStart.html

And BTW, if you load all the VOBs at once into DGIndex, that is all you need to do to have them merged.

[robo731]

Robo731, based on our conversation I suggested a tool which can do job without making it complex than it needs to be. One of the thing I do when posting on forum is to assess understanding and level of knowledge of a person regarding question which is asked and then make recommendation based on finding.

I can understand that HWK, but I'm also trying to expand my own knowledge, explore new options, and achieve the highest quality I can. I will try handbrake as you've suggested and also, DGIndex as I've seen suggested in other threads.

You wouldn't need to demux the video.

Just read and follow the Quick Start guide that comes with the tools. Make a project, make a script, and then serve the script into x264.

And BTW, if you load all the VOBs at once that is all you need to do to have them merged.

Okay, I'll read up on the documentation and post back here or start a new thread.

Thanks for the help guys.

[Guest]

Carry on here in this thread. I'll do my "best" to help you. :)

[HWK]

I can understand that HWK, but I'm also trying to expand my own knowledge, explore new options, and achieve the highest quality I can. I will try handbrake as you've suggested and also, DGIndex as I've seen suggested in other threads.

Thanks for the help guys.
All of us learn in same manner. Feel free to post if you need further help.

[robo731]

Thanks, I will.

[sneaker_ger]

Also going from 8 bit to 10 bit will not improve quality but will make file size larger for sure for no gain in quality.

That is completely wrong. 10 Bit encoding is more efficient than 8 Bit encoding, i.e. you can have the same quality with a lower file size or better quality at the same size.

[Ghitulescu]

This may or may not help you.
There is no method to convert VOBs to anything else.
You may want to say convert DVDs to something else.
Because VOBs are simply containers, whose content are indicated by the associated IFO files. Surely, for simple movies, probably a lot of methods would work, but for many it won't work any, as the same VOB may contain promos and stills and a lot of things along with the main movie, let alone the case of interleaved content or multiangles.

[HWK]

That is completely wrong. 10 Bit encoding is more efficient than 8 Bit encoding, i.e. you can have the same quality with a lower file size or better quality at the same size.

You cannot create something out of nothing. If source was not 10bit to begin with, it is not worth it to encode in 10 bit.

[sneaker_ger]

I'm not talking about creating something out of thin air but about reducing the quality loss thanks to the higher precision used by the encoder for its calculations.
http://mirror01.x264.nl/x264/10bit_02-ateme-why_does_10bit_save_bandwidth.pdf

[detmek]

Animation can be easily compressed in comparison to movie. You can do 10 bit, but I recommended stick to 8 bit which is DVD standard as well. Even blu-ray disk which has quality 6x time higher than dvd is not 10 bit.

Also going from 8 bit to 10 bit will not improve quality but will make file size larger for sure for no gain in quality.

Not true. 10-bit is usefull for animation because it does not introduce banding like 8-bit encoders. In order to avoid banding with 8-bit encoder you would need higher bitrate compared to 10-bit encoding.
Also, 10-bit encoding, even from 8-bit sources is more efficient. You can reduce up to 20% of bitrate to preserve same quality. As sneaker_ger said, its all about higher internal precision.

About first post (main topic of this thread). If you have IFO files alongside with VOB files you can use any GUI application like MeGUI, StaxRip, Handbrake, ... for encoding and those GUIs should merge VOB files automaticaly during encoding. Most of those use DGIndex for that job. You can also merge VOB files with mkvmerge (part of MKVToolnix, mmg is GUI) and add VOB files there (additional parts button, I think). You will get one MKV file which can be encoded with applications I mentioned before.

[HWK]

Not true. 10-bit is usefull for animation because it does not introduce banding like 8-bit encoders. In order to avoid banding with 8-bit encoder you would need higher bitrate compared to 10-bit encoding.
Also, 10-bit encoding, even from 8-bit sources is more efficient. You can reduce up to 20% of bitrate to preserve same quality. As sneaker_ger said, its all about higher internal precision.


Ahhh I see what you are saying. In that case for animation it would be helpful, my bad for sending wrong info.

[robo731]

Okay, thanks for the info guys, I will go back to my original plan to encode to 10-bit. Is there a way for me to open the IFO files to view the information stored within them? Would it be helpful to do so? Should I implement these files in some way?

[Guest]

Just go ahead with the VOBs in DGIndex etc. and stop overthinking it.

[HWK]

stop overthinking it.

Also don't kill brain cells robo731 :)

[robo731]

Ok, just wanted to make sure I don't leave anything out. I used IfoEdit to check the files out, they have some interesting information.

[Blue_MiSfit]

Look all you want, but to actually do any transcoding you'll need to first decode that MPEG-2 into uncompressed video ;)

DGDecode can do this, and feed the results into AviSynth (among other things) for subsequent processing. You could also directly process the VOBs with ffmpeg / libav, or x264 itself (although you'll need to be clever enough to handle the audio separately in that case).

[Ghitulescu]

Okay, thanks for the info guys, I will go back to my original plan to encode to 10-bit. Is there a way for me to open the IFO files to view the information stored within them? Would it be helpful to do so? Should I implement these files in some way?

Sure, like IFOedit (probably the first hit in google :) ) or PGCedit.

[robo731]

Thanks, now I'm just trying to figure out how I should process it. I started a relevant thread about it under the DVD2AVI / DGIndex section if you're interested.

[Seedmanc]

No, seriously, it is 2013 A.D. and people actually advise to not use 10bit? Here, on Doom9? Any mods to deal with misinformation? How about that PDF link explaining that 10bit is superior anyway? How about inbuild debander that converts 8 bit to 10 inside of x264?

[sneaker_ger]

How about that PDF link explaining that 10bit is superior anyway?
Was posted above.

How about inbuild debander that converts 8 bit to 10 inside of x264?
Vanilla x264 does not have such a feature. It converts 8 Bit to 10 Bit but it does not deband.

[hello_hello]

No, seriously, it is 2013 A.D. and people actually advise to not use 10bit? Here, on Doom9? Any mods to deal with misinformation?

The ability to play 10bit encodes is the main issue for me. I mainly use a PC myself, but I'd still prefer to be able to play my encodes using common media players.
Even if 10bit h265 support becomes a standard thing for future media players, I'm not sure it necessarily follows they'll also support 10bit h264, so the ability to play current 10bit encodes with future devices is something to consider.