TFM usage with 720p 2:3 pulldown video

[MrVideo]

Something tells me that TFM can't be used with 720p 59.94 fps 2:3 pulldown source. I am using the command "TFM(y0=400, y1=719)", but those lines do not appear to be excluded, as the moving logo and snipe crap within those lines are affecting the resulting video as the "TDecimate(cycle=5,cycleR=3)" right after the TFM is not being IVTC'd correctly when the logo is moving (at the start of the video after the commercial break) and any snipe that appears on the screen, especially a moving snipe..

What is supposed to be used with progressive source to have it ignore the crap on the screen?

Thanks for any pointers.

[Guest]

Post a source sample that shows the problem.

If it's 720p with frame pulldown you shouldn't need TFM! You should only need to decimate. Post a sample so we can see if something else is going on.

[MrVideo]

While I agree that TDecimate is all that should be needed, the problem (as I understand it) is that Tdecimate doesn't have any options in which to tell it not to use an area of the video in which to determine the 2:3 pulldown pattern, i.e., snipes and moving bugs that are moving on screen at the 59.94 fps rate, screwing up the 2:3 pulldown pattern.

I'll put something together this afternoon and test that it shows the problem. If you have some options for me to try, I'll do that at the same time.

[Didée]

You can create a 2nd video with the problematic area blanked out, call TDecimate on that clip, and use the "clip2" parameter to make it using the original clip for output.

[Guest]

You might get away with a fixed decimation phase as well, that you could implement with SelectEvery. As long as it doesn't change phase too often, it would be manageable.

[MrVideo]

@ Didée:

You lost me. TDecimate doesn't have a "clip2" parameter.

Reminder: I'm an AVIsynth novice.

[MrVideo]

@ neuron2:

Unfortunately it does change phase, a result of what appears to be a speedup. While stepping through the video I can see some blended frames at times (not all the time) and the 2:3 pulldown cadence is lost. TDecimate seems to manage OK during the program, except when it gets to those frames right after the commercial break where the 59.94 fps moving bug is brought in and when the stupid moving snipe is brought in and out. The fade out of the bug right before the break is relatively fast and doesn't seem to affect TDecimate as much. Obviously finding a way around the main issue would fix the fade out at well.

I expect issues where there are blended speedup frames, but bug/snipe frames really makes the resulting output jerk.

Too bad TDecimate doesn't have y0/y1 parameters like TFM does for interlaced video.

[Didée]

TDecimate does have a clip2 parameter. If yours doesn't, then it's too old. Current version is v.1.0.4 of TIVTC package.

Simple example: decimate by ignoring 64 pixels at the bottom border:

dgsource("720p.mkv")
v1=last
v2=v1.crop(0,0,-0,-64)
v2.tdecimate(clip2=v1)

You could prepare "v2" also in other ways, for example, overlay() a black square over a station logo, or something.

[Guest]

Please post a sample so we're not just guessing. You say you're a noob so you shouldn't expect us to trust your analysis.

[MrVideo]

TDecimate does have a clip2 parameter. If yours doesn't, then it's too old. Current version is v.1.0.4 of TIVTC package.

I was going by the online docs: http://avisynth.org.ru/docs/english/externalfilters/tivtc_tdecimate.htm

Looks the package has been updated, but the docs haven't. I don't know which version is in the AVIsynth that I have, so I'll get the latest and install.

Simple example: decimate by ignoring 64 pixels at the bottom border:

dgsource("720p.mkv")
v1=last
v2=v1.crop(0,0,-0,-64)
v2.tdecimate(clip2=v1)

You could prepare "v2" also in other ways, for example, overlay() a black square over a station logo, or something.

Cropping from the bottom would cover all of the area from the left of the screen to the end on the right, since moving crap covers the bottom, left to right.

I'll run your script and see if it craps out from tdecimate not knowing the clip2 parameter.

[MrVideo]

Please post a sample so we're not just guessing. You say you're a noob so you shouldn't expect us to trust your analysis.

Done. while the two of you were posting, I was extracting a couple of clps and testing that the issue is there.

[sample removed]

The above clip is at the start of the scene. The 2:3 cadence is kept until the scene changes to inside the building. But the bug shows up beforehand and the resulting output stutters. Stuttering then results when the snipe shows up.

[sample removed]

The above clip has no moving bug/snipe, but like the first clip, has speedup blended frames, which tdecimate handles without any problem, keeping a smooth playback with no stuttering (in both clips)

While I may be an AVIsynth novice, I'm certainly not a novice when dealing with video. :D

Off to test Didée's script.

[MrVideo]

No need to download. Didée's script did the trick. Guess my AVIsynth install had a latest enough version.

Interesting that the rating bug in the upper-left didn't cause an issue when it was faded in and out. I think it was because it was relatively small, compared to a lot of channel rating bugs.

Thanks Didée. I'm off to modify my personally built AVS templates for 720p source.