directshow Bluray disc navigator filter base on libbluray

[dukey]

Commercial players will have to handle the license problem of decryption.

[madshi]

If you really are rendering even in stop mode. Supporting multiple pins would be great. Don't need anything fancy for the overlays, just RGBA/AYUV support with a bilinear resize would suffice. This would make integration trivial.

The custom mixer composites at 60fps or the refresh rate, which makes menus nice and responsive. But, worst case at 24, it's still quite usable.
I can take a look at madVR support with the current interfaces.
Rendering is done at the refresh rate.

Adding support for multiple pins would be possible, but quite a bit of work. If you could use one of the current interfaces that would save me a lot of time. But if that's really problematic for you, I guess I can look into adding support for multiple pins.

Note that for commercial players there is also a question of legality and licensing. Open-Source often doesn't care, but someone that is making good money on the sales of a player probably should.
Multimedia is a patent license minefield. Someone who doesn't make money is often not a target worth going after, but someone that does ...
Isn't the same true for decoders? Yet everybody is using ffmpeg/libav and there don't seem to be any problems. I'm not sure if Blu-Ray menu support would be much different?

Maybe it would. But then, if media players just add support for this libbluray DirectShow filter, but don't distribute it, I see no grounds for legal action against them. If users have to manually add this libbluray DirectShow filter, all problems should be solved, no?

Commercial players will have to handle the license problem of decryption.
I don't think it's a big problem if we only support un-encrypted content. After all there's Slysoft.

[Manni]

I would love to see this supported by MadVR/LAV and a player like MPC-BE.

I can't do much except say that these efforts would be much appreciated :)

[madshi]

@dukey,

you can check out the "madVR\developers\interfaces\mvrInterfaces.h" interfaces. Alternatively the XySubFilter-style subtitle interface might also be a good choice:

http://madshi.net/SubRenderIntf.h

The LAV Video Decoder also uses the XySubFilter-stype sub interface to transport DVD subtitles to madVR. One additional benefit of the XySubFilter-style subtitle interface is that MPC-HC's EVR-Custom renderer also supports it, IIRC. FWIW, you wouldn't have to support the complicated reposition logic. LAV doesn't support it, either.

[Stereodude]

For me, most of the reasons posted here are not really things were menus are "required", if you want to switch from Directors Cut to Theatrical, you can just switch to the next playlist with the slightly shorter movie. Or switch the playlists for individual episodes.
Sure, there is no fancy menu to select them, but since you are using a desktop-focused player like MPC-HC or BE already, using a mouse to switch between playlists is still much faster than sitting through commercials and trailers.

The only thing which are truely painful without menus are extras and specials, but then again I really never watch those, ever. So thats where my personal motivation ends - not that I'm involved with the development of either of these players.
Even the movie only crowd should want menu support. Without menu support you can't play back the movie with the correct audio and subtitle tracks properly & automatically selected. LAV automatically watches the first subtitle track it sees for forced subtitles. Often that's not the right one to monitor. The hearing impaired subtitle track is generally the first one. That track won't have the flagged forced subtitles. Additionally, there are a variety of discs where the "forced" subtitles aren't flagged as forced, but are in a separate subtitle stream that is automatically selected by VM commands when the disc playback is started from the menu.

BTW, on a multi episode TV series blu-ray how is someone supposed to know what playlist is which episode? They're not always in numerical order. A disc with 5 episodes doesn't necessarily have only 5 playlists to pick from with E01 being playlist 801, E02, being playlist 802, etc, etc... Some don't even have separate playlists for each episode, but one playlist.

Unless the only thing everyone plays is remuxed mkv's or ISOs where they've already gone through the process of fixing the subtitle situation I can't see how everyone doesn't see the current method as at least somewhat broken.

[nijiko]

For some series on bluray, episodes are split on multiple playlist, so the longest playlist is just one episode... For such case also, menu are required.

I have the problem too. In my some BD, bonus is longer than movie, so MPC-HC play bonus video (such as making video) by default...
I think this logic was wrong.

[nevcairiel]

I have the problem too. In my some BD, bonus is longer than movie, so MPC-HC play bonus video (such as making video) by default...
I think this logic was wrong.

Just switch the track using the title menu in MPC-HC.

[Fullmetal Encoder]

But what, then, is the difference? To me, it's a larger frustration to have to right-click and navigate through multiple pop-up menus and then to have to discern which item to select among an enormous list of generically named Chapter entries than it is to click a couple of graphical menu items. I guess playlists and chapter files can fix this but that seems like a lot of extra work to solve a problem that already has a full-fledged solution in the menus that come on disc (a solution that we've already paid for) complete with human readable chapter names/descriptions. I understand that not everyone sees it the same way and I respect any developers decision to not work on this either out of personal preference or a lack of available time (the latter would apply to me) but personally, as a user and as a would-be developer myself, it's very frustrating that all we have available is a half-assed implementation (DVD menus, but no BD menus) in a media player that can't, uh, play the media.

As for finding developers, that's why this whole subject keeps coming back around. It's in the hopes that someone would be willing to create it. But amazingly (magically), we are surrounded only by developers that want nothing to do with it; filter developers, renderer developers, player developers, library developers and not a single taker :D

[ddjmagic]

It's definitely a shame to see no real interest from developers who would probably make a huge difference, though I understand the reasoning.

I'm a big fan of this project, a proper 'full' BD player is the only thing missing from my HTPC, the licensed players are just too slow and bloated for my liking.
I like just playing the main movie as much as anyone, but it would be nice to have the option to play the 'full' disc too, especially in a nice lightweight player like MPC.

[Stereodude]

There's a reason why I recently bought several 3D capable stand alone Blu-ray players without Cinavia. I wish we had a viable PC solution, but we don't and I suspect we never will. For whatever reason the people with the know-how to do it can't see any value in other people's use cases or that there is a compelling reason to do this.

I'd suggest putting together some sort of crowdfunded bounty to pay someone to do it, but a bounty has been completely ineffective at getting MVC support added to FFMPEG/libavcodec.

[Nullack]

The problem is the licensed commercial players just dont work properly. For example in PowerDVD 15, deinterlacing has not worked properly since I reported it to Cyberlink in version 10 of powerdvd. This is for both top field first and bottom field first interlaced content. Powerdvd 15 has major problems with UHD 4K resolutions on Windows 10, especially involving 3D bluray discs. Cyberlink has an awful track record in terms of software quality and robust testing processes. They claim they are windows 10 platform ready, when in fact they have developed kernel mode processes that fail Microsofts tests for platform readiness - the bloat goes down to include kernel mode device drivers, and those systems components from Cyberlink dont even pass Microsofts device driver verifier tests. They cannot actually claim they are windows 10 platform ready, because they fail the readiness tests. All they do is say they are sorry on their forums, and their customer support is next to useless where they often just give irrelevant boilerplate responses or ask for things already provided in the original support ticket. They fail to engage their community in any meaningful way - like they do these so called "betas" on their forums, but they lock the beta thread forum topic so no user can actually report beta bugs and help contribute to bug fixing. I ended up having to start other threads on basic beta stuff like how does Cyberlink want beta people to engage them on bug reports.....And then they promptly chose to ignore the majority of real and repeatable bugs that I reported. Honestly, I cant imagine a worse software company than Cyberlink and I've been around for a long long time in the industry.

Thankfully with FFMPEG, Lav Filters, the various MPC forks, its a very different situation where high quality, robust and feature useful software is provided. Ironically for free!

I honestly feel the challenge for open source video players is to build on what they do well now, to plug the feature gaps that exist to commercial software. Like bluray menu support, like easy methods for 3D MVC bluray disc playback including auto fullscreen changes to 3D mode etcetc.

I think part of the problem is the level of piracy in video. If piracy didnt exist, there'd be allot more interest in supporting real physical bluray disc stuff, like full bluray menus.

[dukey]

I tested powerdvd a bit when working on dslibbluray, to check discs were drawing correctly. I really didn't think the player was that bad or bloated.

3d is a difficult problem because there are so many ways of doing it, and so many potential output modes. The decoding is probably the easiest part, there are no standard methods to pass 3d to a renderer. And up until dx11? there was no standard way of even outputting stereo. OpenGL has supported quad buffer since the 90's, but only high end hardware ever supported it.

[nijiko]

Just switch the track using the title menu in MPC-HC.

For some BD, that maybe preventing pirates(?), it must use BD Menu/Nav to play, there is no .mpls, or standalone .bdmv, the movie was splitted to a lot of randomly .bdmv files, which order was disrupted.

[Nullack]

I really didn't think the player was that bad

* Deinterlacing does not work and has not worked since I first reported it in PowerDVD10, both in TFF and BFF formats
* The bloat includes kernel mode ring 0 processes that fails to meet Microsofts platform readiness tests. They falsely claim in marketing support for certain MS OS's, yet they have defective software in kernel mode processes that both prevents them form being eligible for the windows platform readiness, and worse, means that for users the Cyberlink kernel mode processes are unreliable and the cause of much of the BSOD's and general lack of robustness that comes from Powerdvd.
* Subtitles are horrendously broken for high DPI situations say with 4K
* 3D bluray playback for Windows 10 doesnt work, despite what they claim in marketing. Generally their marketing is deceptive and untrue against the reality of what the software actually provides. Theyve done this before when there was a scandal with DVD audio support being pulled from the software yet they continued to market it as a feature in multiple versions of the product. A fundamental tenant of trade practices law and spirit, is that in good faith products and services do what is claimed they can do.
* Serious security problems with the java bluray implementation in PowerDVD has resulted in users running compromised machines that are weak to cyber attack
* I could go on, but suffice to say there is a litany of issues with PowerDVD

[Blight]

I'm looking into integrating support for this filter into Zoom Player, sadly it doesn't have a translation of the API to Delphi which adds some work load on my side.
If anyone is volunteering to translate IBDNav.h (http://sourceforge.net/p/dslibbluray/code/HEAD/tree/branch/NextPVR/dslibbluray/IBDNav.h) to pascal, it would help speed things along.

I'd also like to see it work with MadVR, so any progress on that front would certainly add motivation.

[dukey]

How about something like this?
http://rvelthuis.de/programs/convertpack.html

The key input function might be enough to get you going. But how do you manage with the rest of the directshow filters? Do they all have pascal APIs ?

[Blight]

dukey:
Some (like MadVR) have pascal header files, some I had to translate myself, but I'm not an expert in these conversions and may introduce errors.
The DirectShow headers themselves are translated, so only custom interfaces require a translation.

I looked at that program, it doesn't support my old version of delphi i'm afraid.

[jmone]

Most of the time not having a Menu is great as the main title just plays. Alt Endings are not to bad as I can Identify and tag them in JRiver Media Center easy enough post ripping. Where I would really love to have a BD Menu however is for TV Eps disks as there is no easy way on some of these disks to work out what playlist = what eps as many seem to deliberatly no keep any order in the mpls naming. To make it harder they now seem to have multiple playlists for the same eps (one with a "in the last eps" into and one without).

I'd love to have an option in a player like JRiver to bring up a BD Menu when required.

[Nullack]

Adding to the list of use cases expressed here, I've recently learnt that forced bluray subtitles wont work reliably for all discs without bluray full menu support. It seems to me there is a whole bunch of use cases as to why full bluray menus is an important user feature. Its just a shame VLC is the only project pushing it in their version 3 nightly builds. I look forward to what might happen with Zoom player, I have not to date experimented with it.

[Stereodude]

Adding to the list of use cases expressed here, I've recently learnt that forced bluray subtitles wont work reliably for all discs without bluray full menu support.
I already hit on that in post #455.

[Nullack]

Thanks Stereodude.

Sitting down with the family to watch the bluray disc "Wall-e" I realised yet another frustration with the lack of bluray menu support with open source players. There is visual content in wall-e that changes according to selections in the menus. Without it, the viewer misses out in important dramatic/story aspects of the film. Like there is a scene early on where wall-e travels over an old newspaper, which by default using mpc-be, lav filters results in the newspaper footage being in some sort of Russian like language rather than english which is what the audio track defaults too. That particular scene is setting the story context for why humans arent on planet earth anymore.

I can accept when open source Devs say they dont want to personally work on it. However, for any open source devs to claim that it is a viable substitute to have what is implemented now where we dont have full menus and we just get the longest title played by default, well thats an ignorant position to take that dismisses some very real use cases. By any measure, whats implemented now is sorely lacking. And I deeply suspect that if it werent for rampant piracy far more people would be interested in this feature.

[v0lt]

Hi.
"EVR Custom Mixer" can be used as an external renderer?
I registered it on my system, but it does not appear in the list of DirectShow filters.

[Orf]

@v0lt
EVR Custom Mixer is not standalone DS filter. It is one of the interfaces implemented by EVR itself. You need to create EVR instance at first, Custom Mixer instance at second and then substitute EVR standard mixer with custom using the IMFVideoRenderer::InitializeRenderer (https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ms704667(v=vs.85).aspx) method

[Aman87]

Hey Guys,
any updates? I just tried VLC 3.0 nightly and it did a good job of displaying the blu-ray menu (Game of Thrones S6 and Breaking Bad S3 tested)

It would be great to have that in MPC-HC and preferably with madvr. Its just a pain to watch Tv series and bonus features without it.

[fairchild]

Hey Guys,
any updates? I just tried VLC 3.0 nightly and it did a good job of displaying the blu-ray menu (Game of Thrones S6 and Breaking Bad S3 tested)

It would be great to have that in MPC-HC and preferably with madvr. Its just a pain to watch Tv series and bonus features without it.

I've never been able to get VLC to work with blurays, even when doing all the AACS key file copying. The only thing that works is either decrypting it with some other software like AnyDVD or using a blu-ray player that has built in decrypting. This is on Windows7 64-bit. And yes, I tried the latest VLC nightly (the 64-bit) and copied the necessary AACS decryption files around. :(

[hubblec4]

Thanks for this info. It looks good but work not perfect yet.(Tested with Star Trek TNG)

[hubblec4]

I've never been able to get VLC to work with blurays, even when doing all the AACS key file copying. The only thing that works is either decrypting it with some other software like AnyDVD or using a blu-ray player that has built in decrypting. This is on Windows7 64-bit. And yes, I tried the latest VLC nightly (the 64-bit) and copied the necessary AACS decryption files around. :(

Im not sure but makemkv has a dll for this and you can copy this to vlc.