Upscaling 4:3 letterboxed DVDs to 16:9 anamorphic

[FlimsyFeet]

Back in 2003 (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=67273), the recommended method for this conversion was to use AviSynth with LanczosResize.

It's now 2011, and although most early DVDs have since been replaced with newer anamorphic releases (Titanic, Scream) I still have a couple of non-anamorhpic titles (Condorman, Star Wars theatrical versions) that are unlikely to ever get better relases and might be improved by upscaling in software.

What would be the recommended script these days? Would you want to use one of the eedi flavours?

[henryho_hk]

If it is interlaced, I would do something like:

1. crop off black borders (in even vertical steps)
2. bob the source by QTGMC() (at noise-bypass levels)
3. enlarge it by spline36resize()
4. re-interlace it

[FlimsyFeet]

I'm thinking more for progressive video from films.

[Ghitulescu]

It's now 2011, and although most early DVDs have since been replaced with newer anamorphic releases (Titanic, Scream) I still have a couple of non-anamorhpic titles (Condorman, Star Wars theatrical versions) that are unlikely to ever get better relases and might be improved by upscaling in software.

I would suggest to wait, Lucas promised to provide the Blurays for Star Wars Hexalogy.

[FlimsyFeet]

The specs for the Blu-ray set are out now, and the theatrical versions are not included. Which is not surprising, really. But this is drfting a littel off topic now.

[Ghitulescu]

The specs for the Blu-ray set are out now, and the theatrical versions are not included. Which is not surprising, really. But this is drfting a littel off topic now.

So was the first edition of the trilogies, the second one contained however double DVDs.

I was trying to save you time.

Secondly, as I said before, I prefer the real time scaling my BD player (and my TV) has. I think only people with cheaper HW and lots of time should use the SW solution, unless, of course, other reasons (image enhancements, usually) primate. Both HW and SW scalers evolve, though, and it happened to people I know that their new player (3D) had a better upscaling than their last encode ...

If you still want to do this, remember that the DVDs are interlaced (even if they contain progressive footage) so either a deinterlacing or an IVTC is needed before upscaling (interlaced upscaling is tricky). Good luck.

[FlimsyFeet]

remember that the DVDs are interlaced (even if they contain progressive footage)This is incorrect. There's a sticky post in the DGIndex forum that explains this.

What I was really after is how the recommendations for an AviSyth upscale algorithm have changed since I last asked this question 8 years ago.

henryho_hk: would you still recommend spline36resize() for upscaling progressive video?

[Ghitulescu]

This is incorrect. There's a sticky post in the DGIndex forum that explains this.

I don't think Donald contradicted the DVD-Video Book, so I assume you haven't read that sticky correctly. Every DVD is interlaced, because that's the way the standard was created. Except for the legacy part (VCD) which may be progressive. The content itself may be progressive (both fields contain the whole image, for instance the film frame) or interlaced (cameras and camcorders, each field is an individual image).
And due to MPEG-2 particularities, especially with chroma-subsampling, it's always better to correctly deinterlace/IVTC the content before doing any scaling.

PS: I might have a lapsus now, but I don't recall any source of pure progressively encoded MPEG-2.
PS2: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=147695

[manono]

Every DVD is interlaced, because that's the way the standard was created.
Every DVD outputs interlaced video. For NTSC it's 59.94 fields per second.
I might have a lapsus now, but I don't recall any source of pure progressively encoded MPEG-2.
The vast majority of film-sourced NTSC DVDs are encoded as progressive 23.976fps. Pulldown is applied to output interlaced 29.97fps (really 59.94 fields per second). Even some PAL DVDs are encoded as progressive 25fps, but not all that many.

[Sharc]

Progressive DVD footage, encoded as interlaced (like most movie PAL DVDs), would always have to be deinterlaced before resizing?

[Groucho2004]

Even some PAL DVDs are encoded as progressive 25fps, but not all that many.

Most of my PAL DVDs are encoded progressive, although DGIndex tells me that they are interlaced which is probably just a flag.

[manono]

Most of my PAL DVDs are encoded progressive, although DGIndex tells me that they are interlaced which is probably just a flag.
If DGIndex tells you the Frame Type is Interlaced, then they've been encoded as Interlaced. The fact that both fields in a frame come from the same point in time means nothing in this context.

[Groucho2004]

If DGIndex tells you the Frame Type is Interlaced, then they've been encoded as Interlaced. The fact that both fields in a frame come from the same point in time means nothing in this context.

OK, but I can nevertheless treat these as progressive when re-encoding to a progressive format, right?

[manono]

OK, but I can nevertheless treat these as progressive when re-encoding to a progressive format, right?
Yes. You can discuss with Ghitulescu whether the very minor chroma problems are worse than the damage caused by deinterlacing unnecessarily. Me, there's no way I'd ever deinterlace a PAL DVD with progressive content that was encoded as interlaced.

[henryho_hk]

henryho_hk: would you still recommend spline36resize() for upscaling progressive video?

I thought he is upsizing from letterboxed DVD to anamorphic DVD. and such a small upsize won't gain much from NNEDI upsizing.

[Ghitulescu]

Every DVD outputs interlaced video. For NTSC it's 59.94 fields per second.

The vast majority of film-sourced NTSC DVDs are encoded as progressive 23.976fps. Pulldown is applied to output interlaced 29.97fps (really 59.94 fields per second). Even some PAL DVDs are encoded as progressive 25fps, but not all that many.
Since for some time PAL issues of the movie appear before their NTSC pendants, I must confess I don't have too many new NTSC DVDs (unlike 10 years ago when PAL versions of the movies were issued months after). Since then progressive players also appeared on the market to match the (finally affordable :)) projectors and the new flatscreen TVs, so I safely assume you're right, and pure progressive encoded PAL/NTSC of progressive material (with pulldown at play time) do exist to take advantage of this.

Yes. You can discuss with Ghitulescu whether the very minor chroma problems are worse than the damage caused by deinterlacing unnecessarily. Me, there's no way I'd ever deinterlace a PAL DVD with progressive content that was encoded as interlaced.

I don't deinterlace and I always advised people against deinterlacing "for the sake of deinterlacing". Not only that a bad deinterlacing causes to the quality but also that newer/improved generations of HW as well as new/better algorithms may render your previous work futile.