Playing DVD-Audio on a PC. Will it read the correct layer?

[kurkosdr]

Hi there,

Say I have a DVD-Audio that consists of two layers, the DVD layer and the standard AudioCD layer. If I insert the disc in a pc's DVD drive, which layer is the drive going to read?

Will it give priority to the DVD layer or the CD layer? Or it depends on the particular drive the pc has?

I need to know that before I go and buy a DVD-Audio. I don't intend to buy a standalone DVD-Audio player, so I need to be sure it is going to play on my pc.

[setarip_old]

Hi!

I believe you'd be EXTREMELY hard-pressed to find a DVD-A playback-capable DVD-ROM or burner. If such a thing does exist, it should have both the standard "DVD" logo and the "DVD-A" logo on its faceplate...

[kurkosdr]

Hi!

I believe you'd be EXTREMELY hard-pressed to find a DVD-A playback-capable DVD-ROM or burner. If such a thing does exist, it should have both the standard "DVD" logo and the "DVD-A" logo on its faceplate...
Why? From what I 've read, DVD-Audio makes use of the same physical disc as DVD-Video. So the "DVD" logo on the faceplate of the dvd drive means it can read both. The only thing that changes between DVD-Video and DVD-Audio are the files inside the disc (.VOB vs .AOB). The reason some standalones can't read DVD-Audio is because they can't open .AOB files (only .VOB) and that's why standlones capable of reading .AOB files also carry the DVD-Audio logo in order to distinguish them from the rest.

In order to play DVD-Audio discs on a pc, all you need is a plain DVD drive and a software player like DVD-Audio Explorer (freeware) or WinDVD (shareware). I 've seen people playing DVD-Audio discs in their ordinary DVD-drives using these tools with no problems.

Resuming into my question:
The problem is that recently some record companies have starting selling the so called "backwards compatible" DVD-Audio discs. These discs contain two layers: one AudioCD layer that is identical to the one used on AudioCD discs, and on top of it there is the DVD-Audio layer which is a regular DVD layer with DVD-Audio data on it.

If you insert this disc in a DVD-Audio standalone player, it give priority to the DVD-Audio layer by default. If you insert it in a CD player, it will read through the DVD layer and focus on the AudioCD layer.

But on computer drives, on which layer will the drive focus? :confused: If a DVD drive comes across with a disc with a CD layer and a DVD layer, is there a rule or something that helps it determine which layer to give priority to?

[setarip_old]

Perhaps the postings in the following thread support my contention:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1063612


These discs contain two layers: one AudioCD layer that is identical to the one used on AudioCD discs, and on top of it there is the DVD-Audio layer which is a regular DVD layer with DVD-Audio data on it.

If you insert this disc in a DVD-Audio standalone player, it give priority to the DVD-Audio layer by default. If you insert it in a CD player, it will read through the DVD layer and focus on the AudioCD layer. And I believe the audio contained in the DVD layer/folder is of lower quality than the true DVD-A audio (16 bit versus 96 bit, IIRC)...

[Ghitulescu]

Well, I also thought that any DVD drive can read DVD-Audio the very same way it reads DVD-Video.

The thread posted above is concerning how to make the DVD Audiofiles (AOBs, like the video VOBs ;)) go through the PC, like using PowerDVD on PC for movies. The reason being the watermarking and not the compatibility reader-disk. Should the finding of a DVD-A capable drive be so difficult, then why the "underground" is filled up with DVD-A rips? Just run a query in google (which is nevertheless "filtered"), like I did few seconds ago, for academic purposes, and see the results.

SInce I do not have any DVD-A gear, this subject is not familiar to me. Any case, using something like ISOBuster may allow the OP to select whatever file system (like UDF for DVD-A or ISO9660 for CD-DA etc.).

[kurkosdr]

For the third time: Any pc DVD drive can read DVD-Audio discs (the ones without a cd layer).

Sure, in some cases the .AOB files may be encrypted/watermarked using a copy protection called CPPM (much like .VOB files uses a copy protection called CSS), but there are tools that can decrypt the copy protection (namely DVD-Audio Explorer and WinDVD) much like we have VLC and PowerDVD for DVD-Video.

So, if you have a DVD-Audio disc, all you have to do is enter the disc in your drive and use one of the above tools. No special equipment required. Period. I 've seen it been done.

Also, DVD-Audio discs do not have any 16bit data in them, because they don't have a cd layer. So you are always getting 96bit data.


The problem is that some record companies put a cd layer below the DVD layer in order to make the so called "backwards compatible" or "hybrid" discs. The idea is that if you insert the disc in the CD player you have in your kitchen, it will be able to read past the DVD layer (96bit data) and play the cd layer (16bit data).
The DVD-Audio player you may have in your living room will focus on the DVD layer by default.

But what about pc DVD drives? People in other forums say DVD drives focus on the DVD layer by default, but I would like to hear some opinion from the people of this forum too.

[utenteanonimo64]

The problem is that recently some record companies have starting selling the so called "backwards compatible" DVD-Audio discs. These discs contain two layers: one AudioCD layer that is identical to the one used on AudioCD discs, and on top of it there is the DVD-Audio layer which is a regular DVD layer with DVD-Audio data on it.


Can you list a few titles that contain both DVD-A and CD layers? I know about HybridSACDs but this is the first time I hear about Hybrid DVD-As.

[kurkosdr]

Can you list a few titles that contain both DVD-A and CD layers? I know about HybridSACDs but this is the first time I hear about Hybrid DVD-As.
I remember reading somewhere that DVD forum has approved something called the "dual disc" and the "hybrid disc", but on a second read it seems more like a dual sided disc with a DVD layer on one side and a CD layer on the other side.
It's been 10 years since I last walked into a music store, so I've never seen a DVD-Audio in person.

Anyway, since there seems to be no titles that contain both DVD-A and CD layer on one side, I 'll I probably go and buy some DVD-A titles that are missing from isohunt's collection....

And since you 've brought it up, what will happen if i insert a SACD disc inside a pc DVD drive? Since SACD appears to be using a physical disc similar to DVD, will the drive read the SACD layer or the CD layer?

[Ghitulescu]

The PC drives (the normal ones) cannot read SACD. There is a thread on this issue also in this forum. The drive of the oldest PS3 could read them ;)

[utenteanonimo64]

The PC drives (the normal ones) cannot read SACD. There is a thread on this issue also in this forum. The drive of the oldest PS3 could read them ;)

Unless it's a hybrid SACD of course. In that case the PC drive can read the CD layer.

[Midzuki]

kurkosdr wrote:

a software player like DVD-Audio Explorer

DVDAExplorer is not a player, it is an extractor.
But ShaPLAY.exe and foo_input_dvda.dll,
both based on the source-code of DVDAExplorer,
surely can be called "DVD-A players".

kurkosdr wrote:

Also, DVD-Audio discs do not have any 16bit data in them, because they don't have a cd layer.

Well, I can only say that "44.1kHz+16-bit" audio does comply with the DVD-A specs (you can easily transform your Audio CDs into "low-standard" DVD-A discs with the help from dvda-author --- or discWelder, if you have the money to :D ).

But what about pc DVD drives? People in other forums say DVD drives focus on the DVD layer by default

Probably that's correct. In the case of Audio VCDs, Windows Explorer "sees" only the *filesystem* track (the first one) and ignores the RedBook audio tracks, so I presume, in the case of the hybrid DVD-As, that it will "prefer" the DVD-Audio layer, which contains an actual *filesystem*.