What do the Studios use?

[WildTexasChef]

Since Blu-ray's are encoded with one of 3 video formats (MP2, h.264 & VC-1) along with the audio track being either a Dolby based audio format, or a DTS based format, What I want to know is what do the proffesional studios use?

Universal, BBC, and a few smaller studios, production companies etc are using the VC-1 video codec, and most of the time (but not always) Dolby audio. Although I have found a few VC-1 blu-rays with DTS audio.

Sony, Waner Brothers, Disney Blu-rays are almost always using a video codec of MPG2 or most often now h.264. Lately I have seen them both use more DTS based audio then Dolby based audio. Although a few have Dolby.

There are many "Consumer" level software packages out there that easily allow the home &/or small business consumer to create their own Blu-ray discs. All these programs that I have found though create the blu-ray disc with either MPG2 or H.264 video tracks. Some allow Dolby 5.1 a few even allow DTS 5.1 audio to be used and created on a blu-ray. I have yet to find a single Blu-ray software program that will allow the creation of a VC-1 Blu-ray.

So what I want to know. Is what are the productions companies/studios using as their software to create & put their movies into VC-1 Blu-rays? ie... what is NBC/Universal & BBC using as their software to put their TV shows/movies into VC-1 Blu-ray?

Yes... I know the software is probably very very expensive. I know the AACS & BD+ encryption software licensing runs around $50,000 or more! Thats just for the encryption (BD+ AACS) software though & has nothing to do with creating their Blu-ray disc in VC-1.

I have another thread going on how to work with VC-1. This thread isn't a discussion on how to solve my problem of contending, converting & playing VC-1 content. This thread is meant to be a discussion on what software the proffesional production companies & studios use to release their Blu-ray media.

Anyone in the industry in a proffesional manner care to answer this question?

WTC

[chaynik]

For the most part, custom solutions. I used to do compression/dvd authoring (although standard def) for a major studio and we used a custom solution from Toshiba. Major studios work very closely with the hardware/software developers as they are the earliest adopters of such new technology. I remember seeing Toshiba engineers (or rather one main one, responsible if memory serves right for 80% of the development of the SD-DVD encoder/authorer, mind blowing) in and out all the time tweaking things.

During my time there, I remember BluRay just starting off and the BluRay compression guys ripping their hair out with the reference Microsoft VC-1 encoder. I remember them telling me the encoding consisted of marking every single cut and tweaking the encoding variables individually. For a standard 1.5+ hour feature, you can imagine how long this took. Then again, this was about 2.5 years ago, so I'm sure much has changed.

For BluRay authoring, I remember seeing Sony Bluprint.

Hope this helps somewhat...

[WildTexasChef]

For the most part, custom solutions. I used to do compression/dvd authoring (although standard def) for a major studio and we used a custom solution from Toshiba. Major studios work very closely with the hardware/software developers as they are the earliest adopters of such new technology. I remember seeing Toshiba engineers (or rather one main one, responsible if memory serves right for 80% of the development of the SD-DVD encoder/authorer, mind blowing) in and out all the time tweaking things.

During my time there, I remember BluRay just starting off and the BluRay compression guys ripping their hair out with the reference Microsoft VC-1 encoder. I remember them telling me the encoding consisted of marking every single cut and tweaking the encoding variables individually. For a standard 1.5+ hour feature, you can imagine how long this took. Then again, this was about 2.5 years ago, so I'm sure much has changed.

For BluRay authoring, I remember seeing Sony Bluprint.

Hope this helps somewhat...

Sounds quite logical for the major studio/production companies such as Sony, NBC/Universial etc. I am honestly not suprised that the bigger studios have custome software/hardware to handle their production of Blu-rays and SD-DVD's as well.

My follow question though is all of the smaller, lower budget production companies. Even the "porn" industry which are now starting to release Blu-ray porn. Aside from the costs of buying & licensing the "Drm" software of DVD's and Blu-ray. The vast majority of those production companies I know can't afford the cost of "Custom" DVD/Blu-ray production software. Thats why only but a few of the largest "porn" companies can even afford the $50,000+ licensing fee for the BD+/AACS DRM used for Blu-ray. SD-DVD DRM licensing fees are only around $5,000.

I Find it quite interesting that I can easily find information on & obtain the software to DRM my own productions (If I were a production company, for both Blu-ray & DVD) yet not all that easy to find the software to create the "Master" copy needed by the Blu-ray & DVD manufacturing companies. Which BTW are very easy to find as well.

Since you mention that a Toshiba engineer was always in & out tweaking things & that was a while back. I am guessing that this was before their was a winner in the HD-DVD/Blu-ray wars? I am sure they (Toshiba) was pusing the VC-1 standard that was mainly being used on HD-DVD's at the time?

Since NBC/Universal was the biggest supporter of HD-DVD's. I am not surpised that the Blu-rays they have relased have all used the VC-1 video codec. Probably because they had allready invested in the production software of VC-1 and trained on that codec, therefore they aren't about to switch to using h.264 or MPG2 for their blu-rays anytime soon.

What I do find interesting though. Is Warner Brothers. They have the exclusive rights to Blu-ray/DVD production of all the BBC produced shows here in North America. Examples being "Doctor Who", "Torchwood" & a few others. All of the BBC Blu-rays are using the VC-1 codec. However... most all other Blu-rays that Warner Brothers are releasing (Such as Casablanca, Smallville, All the "Batman" movies) are NOT using VC-1 codec. But a combination of MPG2 & h.264.

Then again I am not to surprised by Warner Brothers either. As they have several different departments doing DVD/Blu-ray proudction of movies. Same as Paramount, & even Sony. (Paramount Classics, Sony Classics, WB Classics)

Blu-ray is still so new though that alot of companies in the industry are still trying to figure out what to do with it & work with it! I am still suprised to see what movies/TV shows are & aren't being released in Blu-ray.

WTC

[chaynik]

What I do find interesting though. Is Warner Brothers. They have the exclusive rights to Blu-ray/DVD production of all the BBC produced shows here in North America. Examples being "Doctor Who", "Torchwood" & a few others. All of the BBC Blu-rays are using the VC-1 codec. However... most all other Blu-rays that Warner Brothers are releasing (Such as Casablanca, Smallville, All the "Batman" movies) are NOT using VC-1 codec. But a combination of MPG2 & h.264
It could very well have to do with what facility was used to prepare the media. It's quite possible that the BBC titles were encoded in Britain at a totally different facility than that is used for the domestic WB titles, hence the difference in format. Since both are spec-compliant, this was allowed to happen. The reason why a lot of the VAM (value added material: behind the scenes, trailers, etc) you see is MPEG-2 I would imagine is due to the same encodes being shared for both SD-DVD and BluRay. If such material was produced in SD, it makes no sense to encode it twice as MPEG-2 other than saving a bit of space and the costs of tying up a more expensive h.264/VC-1 encoder vs a more available MPEG-2 one rule that one out.

As far as software, have you looked into Sony BluPrint? I don't know how much it costs, but information about it is readily available on Sony's website: http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/bluprint

[Nightshiver]

blu-print is reportedly $50,000 per license. Not really cost effective for consumers. Better to use something along the lines of Vegas Pro or Adobe Premiere, unless you feel like selling your house.

[Blue_MiSfit]

Yep. BluRay encoding / mastering is... well... expensive :)

I work for a company that delivers HD content that's close to BluRay quality video, and we use our own mashup of software (including AviSynth and x264), plus a bunch of neat-o scripts and stuff to tie it all together. It works okay sometimes :p

~MiSfit

[PatlaborForce]

Sony, Waner Brothers, Disney Blu-rays are almost always using a video codec of MPG2 or most often now h.264. Lately I have seen them both use more DTS based audio then Dolby based audio. Although a few have Dolby.

Sony stopped using MPEG-2 ages ago and has been exclusively H.264. Disney has been all H.264 from the start. I don't know where you got your information about Warner but it has been using VC-1 since it's first HD DVD release and has continued on through their shift to Blu-Ray. I've yet to actually see a single Warner disc that uses anything but VC-1 for the main feature.

However... most all other Blu-rays that Warner Brothers are releasing (Such as Casablanca, Smallville, All the "Batman" movies) are NOT using VC-1 codec. But a combination of MPG2 & h.264.

This is completely false. All those titles use VC-1 for the main movie with some use of MPEG-2 for extras. Check out the codecs here for: Casablanca (http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/923/casablanca_uce.html), Smallville Season 7 (http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1527/smallville_s7.html), Batman Begins (http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/248/batmanbegins.html), Dark Knight (http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1825/darkknight.html), Batman Anthology Boxset (http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1380/batmananthology.html).

The breakdown by US Studio is this:

Sony and subsidiaries: H.264 (used to use MPEG-2 at the start and there may be a subsidiary release here and there that may use MPEG-2 but not highly likely).
Paramount: H.264 (also used MPEG-2 at the start for Blu-Ray releases), VC-1 for some HD DVDs.
Universal: VC-1
Warner Bros.: VC-1
Disney and subsidiaries: H.264

[WildTexasChef]

blu-print is reportedly $50,000 per license. Not really cost effective for consumers. Better to use something along the lines of Vegas Pro or Adobe Premiere, unless you feel like selling your house.

You can get it for around $5,000 without the DRM encoding. (AACS, BD+) if you want that, then it runs an additional $46,000. Called a few places to get a ball park figure.

Very true even without the DRM it isn't for the average consumer, or even video podcaster.

Problem with Vegas Pro &/or Adobe Premiere (I have both) Is there isn't full support for the VC-1 codec. Either decoding (Importing) or encoding (Exporting).

TGC

[Nightshiver]

Which is why you don't have to use VC-1 exclusively. But I do understand where you are coming from.

[audyovydeo]

plus a bunch of neat-o scripts and stuff

mmmh, I'd love to peep at them scripts...
I assume your platforms are some form of unix ?
I gave up *x for personal use years ago, but still aim to do as much scripting as possible under Windows (cygwil ye be blest).

my production chain from DV or AVCHD capture to x264 encode is 100% scripted, *except* obviously for the art/editing (Premiere mainly, Avisynth sometimes) part.

cheers
audyovydeo