x264 devices settings

[klinika]

1080i50 (1080i/25) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080i)

Sorry to barge in, but does anyone have a source for that other than wikipedia? The article seems to lack one. Up until recently I was convinced that in this style of notation the last number was solely for signifying frame rates, slash or no slash.

[nm]

There are no widespread interlaced sources shot at 50 or 60 frames/s, only 25 or 30 frames/s. All the broadcast and SD/HD disc standards that define framerates only support interlaced video at 25 or 30 (actually 30000/1001) frames/s.

[klinika]

There are no widespread interlaced sources shot at 50 or 60 frames/s, only 25 or 30 frames/s. All the broadcast and SD/HD disc standards that define framerates only support interlaced video at 25 or 30 (actually 30000/1001) frames/s.

Aye, it's just a bit surprising to me that in 1080iN notation the N can represent either field or frame rate. Unless there's an authoritative source, I believe it to be a bastardization of the ITU/EBU standard notation serving just to obfuscate it unnecessarily. Anyway, sorry for the OT, I went and asked for sources on wikipedia so I'll take it there.

[shon3i]

Ok guys sorry for troll :) you are right, I do not know where my mind was :D I tested this combination last night and everyhing is as on table.

so here is:


maxrate > 15mbps, 1 second GOP

Progressive:
1080p 23.976, 24fps = --keyint 24
720p 23.976, 24fps = --keyint 24
720p 50fps = --keyint 50
720p 59.940fps = -- keyint 60

Interlaced:
1080i 29.970fps = --keyint 30
1080i 25fps = --keyint 25
480i 29.970fps = --keyint 30
576i 25fps = --keyint 25

maxrate <= 15mbps, 2 seconds GOP

Progressive:
1080p 23.976, 24fps = --keyint 48
720p 23.976, 24fps = --keyint 48
720p 50fps = --keyint 100
720p 59.940fps = -- keyint 120

Interlaced:
1080i 29.970fps = --keyint 60
1080i 25fps = --keyint 50
480i 29.970fps = --keyint 60
576i 25fps = --keyint 50

[rack04]

Is maxrate the same as the bitrate that you specify in 2 pass?

[nm]

Is maxrate the same as the bitrate that you specify in 2 pass?
No, unless you want to encode at a constant bitrate. VBV maxrate is set according to target device limitations. 1/2-pass bitrate is a user setting for average encoding bitrate, somewhere below the maximum rate.

[benwaggoner]

Everyone follow after me:

480i30 is NTSC interlaced
576i25 is PAL interlaced
720p50 is PAL 720p
720p60 is NTSC 720p
1080p24 is film 1080p
1080p25 is PAL speedup 1080p film
1080i25 is PAL 1080i
1080i30 is NTSC 1080i

These are your digital broadcast/disc formats in wide use, with non-ambiguous nomenclature.

Of course, of those, we really only need 720p60 for sports/news/action stuff, and 1080p for movie/entertainment stuff. Everything else is a weaker alternative.

[thewebchat]

What. NTSC has always been 480i60. And NTSC 1080i has always been 1080i60. Why are we trying to retroactively rename terminology.

[LoRd_MuldeR]

NTSC with 29.97 interlaced/weaved frames per second equals 59.94 fields per second.

So it can be defined as either "i30" (referring to the number of interlaced frames per second) or as "i60" (referring to the fields per second).

Both definitions are valid in a way, but we must a agree on one to avoid confusion. I tend to prefer the latter, as it better reflects the temporal resolution.

Also it is highly questionable whether video with a resolution above 720x480 pixels should still be called "NTSC" ;)

[popper]

There are no widespread interlaced sources shot at 50 or 60 frames/s, only 25 or 30 frames/s. All the broadcast and SD/HD disc standards that define framerates only support interlaced video at 25 or 30 (actually 30000/1001) frames/s.


what i get from that page
http://tom.niko.users.sbb.rs/gop.jpg
seems simple enough, and we are talking about trying to make it as easy as possible, so as to try and help everyone actually Clearly visualise the intent of the spec.

is:

it doesnt matter if there are, or are no widspread i50 or i60.

the Only thing that matters is:
that IF your bitrate is 15Mbit/s or less then you Can use a 2 second or greater? GOP IF you want to, but you dont have to, you can still use a 1 second GOP if you like within the standard.

less is more here it seems yet again...

to get a valid --keyint value you do the SIMPLE THING, if its Less than 15Mbit/s you simply take the FPS or 'frame rate value[Hz]' if you prefer calling it that , round it up* to the nearest int, and then double it.

if its More than 15Mbit/s then you Do NOT double it, but rather just use the nearest rounded up int of the FPS/'frame rate value[Hz]'.

so your i50 or i60 (or even p50 p60) would use a --keyint value of 100 and 120 If their bitrates were 15Mbit/s or less, or 50 and 60 if they were using faster bitrates!

now we Might have a slight problem here, in that if your after Encoding a future SD/HD high speed camera footage to 15Mbit/s or less, with an FPS of something like >1200 fps at QVGA.

lets say a fixed 10Mbit/s at an fps of 1200 ,then that means you would use a --keyint = 2400 , does --keyint allow for this high a value ?

and were can we get some high quality and high speed footage to try this....

the reason i picked 1200 fps or greater is the fact the HW SOC can apparently capture and encode at these extremely high frame rates for some modes of operation, so if its not here yet, generally , it will sooner or later...
http://www.imgtec.com/news/Release/index.asp?NewsID=440

*because the US etc cant be bothered to just use the simple and set standard BBC PAL int's of 24,25,50,100, and one day 200 TV standards....

[nm]

what i get from that page
http://tom.niko.users.sbb.rs/gop.jpg
seems simple enough, and we are talking about trying to make it as easy as possible, so as to try and help everyone actually visualise the intent of the spec.

is:

it doesnt matter if there are no widspread i50 or i60.

You are pointing to a draft document that specifically defines the allowed framerates for Blu-ray. Interlaced 50 or 60 frames/s video is not allowed.

the Only thing that matters is:
that IF your bitrate is 15Mbit/s or less then you Can use a 2 second GOP IF you want to, but you dont have to, you can still use a 1 second GOP if you like.

to get a --keyint value you do the SIMPLE THING, if its Less than 15Mbit/s you simply take the FPS or 'frame rate value[Hz]' if you prefer calling it that , round it up* to the nearest int, and then double it.

if its More than 15Mbit/s then you Do NOT double it, but rather just use the nearest rounded up int of the FPS/'frame rate value[Hz]'.
Yes, but the spec still defines the rates that you are allowed to use for each interlaced and progressive frame format.

so your i50 or i60 (or even p50 p60) would use a --keyint value of 100 and 120 If their bitrates were 15Mbit/s or less, or 50 and 60 if they were using faster bitrates!
Interlaced video at 50 or 60 frames/s is not allowed, only 720p50/60 is.

now we Might have a slight problem here, in that if your after Encoding a future SD/HD high speed camera footage to 15Mbit/s or less, with an FPS of something like >1200 fps at QVGA.
What problem? The current broadcast and disc formats don't allow such framerates so you are free to use whatever keyint you want for such a non-standard encode.

If high-speed footage is used in some standard production, it is either played back in slow motion or frames are skipped or combined.

Man, I wish interlacing would die already.

[popper]

Everyone follow after me:

480i30 is NTSC interlaced
576i25 is PAL interlaced
720p50 is PAL 720p
720p60 is NTSC 720p
1080p24 is film 1080p
1080p25 is PAL speedup 1080p film
1080i25 is PAL 1080i
1080i30 is NTSC 1080i

These are your digital broadcast/disc formats in wide use, with non-ambiguous nomenclature.

Of course, of those, we really only need 720p60 for sports/news/action stuff, and 1080p for movie/entertainment stuff. Everything else is a weaker alternative.


your forgetting to include the near future 2K and 4K modes, shouldnt you be planning, or indeed already adding in these options today for testing etc, to be ready when the consumer kit arrives on mass from the far east OEMs etc,
the DVB org already demoed (PAL) 2K and 4K end to end transmission, Encoded with H.264 last year or perhaps the year before , i forget now.

[Manao]

From a nomenclature's point of view, 1080i60 is the proper name and makes much more sense than 1080i30. That way, you have xxxx[p|i]yyy, where xxxx is the vertical resolution, yyy is the temporal resolution, and 'i' says the image has been irremediably destroyed.

[klinika]

Well, as long as we can agree that 1080i/N and 1080/I/N refer solely to frame rates, it's not all fubar yet :p

[rapscallion]

If some kind soul could input the presets for "standalone AVCHD", it would be much appreciated.(they are different than Blu-ray)

[ronnylov]

I agree with rapscallion, standalone AVCHD device settings would be nice.

Regarding bluray:
How is the maxrate of 15 Mbit/s achieved when encoding with x264 and not using CBR?
Is it enough to set vbvmaxrate to 15 Mbit/s? There still may be short peaks above 15 Mbit/s?
But on the other hand why should anybody want to do that for bluray?
Maybe if stored on a slow medium (like DVD @ 1x DVD speed)

I guess the safe way to do it is to just use one second keyint and let the bitrate peak above 15 Mbit/s if needed to?

[nm]

How is the maxrate of 15 Mbit/s achieved when encoding with x264 and not using CBR?
By using VBV.

Is it enough to set vbvmaxrate to 15 Mbit/s? There still may be short peaks above 15 Mbit/s?
Buffer size must also be set -- according to the spec limits. "Peaks" don't matter as long as VBV is set correctly. Of course, quality will be lower in difficult scenes.

But on the other hand why should anybody want to do that for bluray?
Maybe if stored on a slow medium (like DVD @ 1x DVD speed)
That, or storing a large amount of video on a single disc. Longer keyint also improves quality at the same bitrate.

[ronnylov]

Is it possible to somehow use max keyint of 2 seconds only on the parts where bitrate is below 15 Mbit/s and use max keyint of 1 second only on the difficult parts where the lower 15 Mbit/s VBV limits are exceeded? Maybe do it as an extra pass of the encoder where those parts are re-encoded if necessary to achieve a better quality. It would be a nice feature of a bluray compatible h.264 encoder.

[shon3i]

Is it possible to somehow use max keyint of 2 seconds only on the parts where bitrate is below 15 Mbit/s and use max keyint of 1 second only on the difficult parts where the lower 15 Mbit/s VBV limits are exceeded? Maybe do it as an extra pass of the encoder where those parts are re-encoded if necessary to achieve a better quality. It would be a nice feature of a bluray compatible h.264 encoder.
I don't think blu-ray standard allow variable GOP, anyway blu-ray allow Open GOP feature which is better and very usefull with short GOP's

[fleon]

Well , based on the findings of this threat http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=141628 and also based on my own tests I can confirm that the psp supports:

*Reference Frames: 3
*Mixed References: yes
*B-Frames: 16 ( I have test it with --no-b-adapt --scenecut=-1 --bframes 16 so it really supports it)
*Direct Prediction: Auto
*Weighted B-Frames: yes
*CABAC: yes
*Motion Estimation: SATD Exhaustive
*Trellis: 2
*ME Range: 32
*Subpixel Refinement: 9
*Analysis: All
*8x8 DCT: No!
*No Fast-P-Skip: yes
*No DCT-Decimate: yes
*also vbv-maxrate is not needed at all, there is no limit on the psp
*Deblocking: yes

I also can add that the most recent video that I have converted with these settings and crf 22 is this one http://keithschofield.com/justice/ adding the tune film preset :rolleyes:, and it looks very good, but it kind of lags a little, but it may be just because of that video, I have not tested more videos recently.

I also wanna add that I convert all my videos to 480x272 for space reasons(I have only a 8gb memorystick), but I am pretty sure that the psp can support more resolutions

I may also help with the iphone settings since my brother have one..

[Chengbin]

I might as well update the specs for the Archos 5 Android since it has been vastly improved.

I still don't have one due to Bestbuy and Futureshop not wanting to restock them, but these are figures that have been tested to work. These are not the limits. I'll find the limits when I get one hopefully.

Under 800x448, it can support every feature in x264's high profile including weightp 2, bframe 16 and ref frame 16.

It supports 16 b frames for all resolution up to 1280x720. Ref frame limits are unknown, but it can support 8 on a 1280x544 (or 720, I forgot, but one of those two) video.

Maximum bitrate is unknown at 1280x720, but I guess it is at least 15Mbps because people say that videos with an average bitrate of 7Mbps plays smoothly.

30fps is having sync issues no matter what bitrate. Hopefully it will get fixed soon.

[ninja_racoon]

my encode wont play on psp , what do you think is wrong with my settings?

x264 settings

program --profile main --pass 2 --bitrate 384 --stats ".stats" --slow-firstpass --thread-input --deblock -4:-4 --b-adapt 2 --rc-lookahead 60 --merange 24 --me umh --direct auto --subme 9 --partitions p8x8,b8x8,i4x4 --no-8x8dct --no-dct-decimate --no-fast-pskip --output "output" "input"

avisynth

import("C:\Program Files (x86)\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\SeeSaw.avs")
DirectShowSource("D:\RaveN\My Videos\Film\video\video.mkv", fps=23.976, convertfps=true)
crop( 0, 2, 0, -2)

a= last
b=a.DeGrainMedian(limitY=3,limitUV=4,mode=2)
SeeSaw(a,b, NRlimit=3, NRlimit2=4, Sstr=1.5, Slimit=5, Spower=5, Sdamplo=6, Szp=16, sootheS=20)

Spline64Resize(480,200)
TextSub("D:\RaveN\My Videos\Presets\subtitle.ass", 1)

[nm]

my encode wont play on psp , what do you think is wrong with my settings?
Perhaps PSP doesn't like the pixel dimensions of your video: 480x200 instead of 480x272. Try adding black bars to the top and bottom.

[ninja_racoon]

Perhaps PSP doesn't like the pixel dimensions of your video: 480x200 instead of 480x272. Try adding black bars to the top and bottom.
most of my encodes are 480x200 and they all work fine on psp until Ive used megui.

[Rumbah]

You forgot to set --level 3, then it should work (but I have to say that I have some encodes that won't play on the PSP although the settings are correct)

[ninja_racoon]

You forgot to set --level 3, then it should work (but I have to say that I have some encodes that won't play on the PSP although the settings are correct)
I set my avc level @auto , do I have to set it to 3 to work?

[Chainmax]

Does anyone know what are the specs for the Nokia 5800? From what little I recall, it only supported low resolution x264 encodes. I have one, so I can test whatever you want.

[Rumbah]

I set my avc level @auto , do I have to set it to 3 to work?

Yes, the PSP only accepts level 3 files, auto set it to 4 or 4.1 in my tests if I remember correctly. So you should set it to 3 for it to work (and don't forget -ref 3 if you use a slower profile with more ref frames or tune animation).

[benwaggoner]

Another thing to watch out with the PSP is that it doesn't support CAVLC, IIRC, just CABAC.

No B-pyramid either, also IIRC.

[STaRGaZeR]

from a nomenclature's point of view, 1080i60 is the proper name and makes much more sense than 1080i30. That way, you have xxxx[p|i]yyy, where xxxx is the vertical resolution, yyy is the temporal resolution, and 'i' says the image has been irremediably destroyed.

I lol'd :D

[Atak_Snajpera]

Another thing to watch out with the PSP is that it doesn't support CAVLC, IIRC, just CABAC.

No B-pyramid either, also IIRC.
PSP supports CAVLC! You have to use level 2.1 instead of 3.0

[zinga]

The old x264 b-pyramid was "supported" by the PSP, except it didn't exactly decode correctly. Actually, the video would mostly be quite watchable, just some block-like artefacts (not blocking) would show up now and then.
Unsure about the new b-pyramid, but from memory, it would increase the ref count so I had some issues. Can't test this now though.

[lovenithin08]

Ok,

This thread is a new start to sum up all informations about devices settings for x264. If you have some extra infos, please share them. Hence, we can have a better spot and optimize our presets...

Spreadsheet is available here (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tYGTjNd0dG6P_A9z-YkFzFg&output=html). Not complete yet. I'll update as soon as I can.

Comments & discussion are welcome.

:thanks:


could u please update the spreadsheet for 5800. it could be helpful!

[Kurtnoise]

Do you have extra infos for it ?


btw, this spreadsheet shouldn't be used soon (http://x264dev.multimedia.cx/?p=270)...

[desta]

Sorry to bump an older thread, but I wondered if anyone might know the capabilities (official/unofficial) for Android 2.1. I've just got a HTC Desire and am looking to put some video on it, but wasn't sure what encoding settings to start with as a reference point. I've seen a few people say to use the standard iphone settings (baseline, level 3, vbv buf/max 10000, etc), but knowing the iphone can handle high profile, level 4.1 leads me to believe the htc desire can fairly comfortably achieve the same?!

[Chengbin]

Sorry to bump an older thread, but I wondered if anyone might know the capabilities (official/unofficial) for Android 2.1. I've just got a HTC Desire and am looking to put some video on it, but wasn't sure what encoding settings to start with as a reference point. I've seen a few people say to use the standard iphone settings (baseline, level 3, vbv buf/max 10000, etc), but knowing the iphone can handle high profile, level 4.1 leads me to believe the htc desire can fairly comfortably achieve the same?!

No. Android has terrible video support. The hardware may be capable of it, but the Android system doesn't have the hardware accelerated decoding code for it.

[desta]

No. Android has terrible video support. The hardware may be capable of it, but the Android system doesn't have the hardware accelerated decoding code for it.
Ah ok, thanks for the info.

Shortly after my last post I did actually try some higher settings, but most of them were a non-starter. Anything higher than baseline just wouldn't play. Anything higher than level 3 would play, but in a garbled mess. I can actually get some nice looking video with baseline level 3 ("nice" considering it's displayed on a small screen), but I lose a hell of a lot of compression without bframes. :/

Ah well... maybe if/when coreplayer for Android arrives it'll help with higher support. It helped me play video on my old N95 that the inbuilt media player couldn't handle. Then again, there's supposedly going to be an update for android that will enable divx hd playback.

[FBX]

Just posting this here to add my own experiences in encoding for PS3 playback. I used the PS3 preset in MeGUI 0.3.5.0 and encountered strange problems with the videos starting properly on both the PS3 and WMP. The videos would start with a blank screen for the first ten seconds while the sound was playing on the PS3, whereas the videos would play sped-up with no sound during the first few seconds on WMP. After much trial and error work, I found the issue was with the B-frame and I-Frame settings. For completely stable playback on both PS3 and WMP, I found turning B-frames off (set to zero) and setting Extra I-frames to 100 fixed all problems I was having. This is not to say they must be set this way for any PS3 playback, it's rather just a "safe-mode" I found that avoids issues entirely.

[nurbs]

It should also be noted that in the discussion in the MeGUI preset thread FBX was the only one experiencing such problems. No one else reported problems with b-frames and WMP, in fact when I read that I encoded a file to test it and it was fine, and for me and others there is no problem with the default settings of x264 with regard to PS3 compatibility.

[jacksback]

Hi everyone.

I recently bought an Android Touchpad and was wondering what encoding settings I should use for my HD movies? The pad apparently supports full hd 1080p mkv playback

Here are the specs

CPU: ARM A8
FSB: 1G MHz
Memory: DDR 256MB 　
LCD TFT display: 10.2”
Resolution: 1024×600

Thanks

[nurbs]

What does the manual say about level support? 1080p means level 4.1 or 4.0 which are largely identical except the latter has tighter VBV constraints. If you know the level it supports just use the presets and tunings in x264 and uses the --level and appropriate VBV settings to ensure it works.
If you want to play it safe downsize to 720p and maybe keep within level 3.1. In my experience most HD sources don't really have much detail beyond that resolution, you mostly get more noise/grain. Furthermore high bitrates could be problematic for an ARM if the whole thing doesn't have a fast DSP or an ASIC for the decoding. Since you save space and don't really lose much I'd give it a try.

I'd also be interested in taking a look at the touchpad. Could you post a link or the product and company name?

[stax76]

Maybe best to use 1024 as width, more seem to be a waste of disc space and encoding time unless you also want to play it somewhere with bigger screen.

[jacksback]

Sorry, should have said "I've ordered one" because don't have it yet or the manual. I'll have a read when I get it in about 2 weeks time.

Going to encode a test movie using the ipad profile and will set the resolution the match the screen res of the Android pad.

Thanks for your replies

[jacksback]

Here's a link to the same one I bought on Ebay

The seller I bought mine from - got it for 215 pounds all inclusive
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/10-2-Android-2-1-Apad-1-GHz-256-RAM-Tablet-PC-HD-UMPC-/260644152610?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3caf9a2522

Some better pics
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-10-2-INCH-TOUCH-SCREEN-TABLET-ANDROID-APAD-WEB-PAD-/300450358469?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item45f43ca4c5

[Chengbin]

I'll be VERY surprised if a non Archos Android device can play one 720p format, let alone a hoard of 1080p formats.

But on topic, why don't you try it out? There won't be information about the settings supported on the internet or the manual. Guess and check is my choice.

Start by checking if it supports high profile. If it doesn't, check if main profile is supported, if not, try baseline. If it does, check if it supports 720p. If it plays 720p smoothly, try 1080p, the check bitrate, etc.

[jacksback]

I'll be VERY surprised if a non Archos Android device can play one 720p format, let alone a hoard of 1080p formats.

But on topic, why don't you try it out? There won't be information about the settings supported on the internet or the manual. Guess and check is my choice.

Start by checking if it supports high profile. If it doesn't, check if main profile is supported, if not, try baseline. If it does, check if it supports 720p. If it plays 720p smoothly, try 1080p, the check bitrate, etc.

I encoded three movies last night using the iPad profile, chose 2 channel aac audio and a custom resolution of 1024 x 600. I encoded using CQ22 and had an average bitrate of 1700kbps. I'll test these three out first and will move onto the higher profile when I get the device. I guess it will just be trial and error to start. I'll even try playing a full hd encode to see if it does what it says on the tin :)

[Tengato]

Hi, I'm having the hardest time trying to encode video for my PSP (model 3000, firmware v6.31).
Here is my process, starting from a .VOB file:

dgindex.exe -AIF=[C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1.VOB] -OF=[C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1] -FO=0 -EXIT -HIDE -OM=2

AviSynth:

LoadPlugin("C:\MeGUI\tools\dgindex\DGDecode.dll")
DGDecode_mpeg2source("C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1.d2v")
LanczosResize(480, 272)

x264:
x264.exe --profile main --level 3 --crf 21 --partitions p8x8,b8x8,i4x4 --no-8x8dct --ref 3 --output "C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1.264" "C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1.avs"

For audio I use MeGUI and Nero AAC to encode the .ac3 file, downmixing to Stereo.

MP4Box:
mp4box.exe -add "C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1.264:fps=23.976" -add "C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1 T80 3_2ch 448Kbps DELAY 0ms.mp4" -psp -tmp "C:\MyVideo" -new "C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1-muxed.mp4"

The resulting MP4 plays fine in Zune Software and Quicktime Player, but when I put it on my PSP and try to play it it shows one or two frames of black and then displays the message "The video cannot be played." I've tried letting x264 create the file and then just having MP4Box add the audio, but the result is the same. I figure I must be missing a parameter somewhere that's necessary for PSP compatibility?

Thanks,
-Pat

[Rumbah]

Try adding --b-pyramid none to your command line and it should work.

[Wishbringer]

x264:
x264.exe --profile main --level 3 --crf 21 --partitions p8x8,b8x8,i4x4 --no-8x8dct --ref 3 --output "C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1.264" "C:\MyVideo\VTS_01_1.avs"

I use "--aud --b-pyramid none" too

[virtualdub]

ok .maybe the same prob here http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=156110
try to use old 1649 build x264 to encoding clips, never using the newest build until we get clear solution from GPAC.
Check your x264 build version first.