My XVid binaries

[-h]

@Koepi: I'll add them tomorrow most likely, I'm just going through a diff of CVS and my bad tree to see what else sneaked in (nothing bad so far). You can seriously add them if you want, no one will mind. Just look at the crud that I've been committing! :)

@Nic: Apologies if you got any angry emails about the build being broken. It isn't the distributor's job to test new functionality before making builds available, it sets a bad precedent. One good thing that came of this is how fast it was resolved by user feedback - thanks to binary sites like yours getting the (however stuffed it may be ;)) codec out there.

-h

[Koepi]

Damnit. Well, then let's wait for -h to bring up his changes to CVS :)

Btw., you can use debugview (included with earlier nandub releases, downloadable at sysinternals.com [or wininternals.com? dunno]) to see the quantizer used during first pass... much easier to check then if everything works or not...

I don't know what i broke now that quant 16 seems to be used again :-(

-h, what's the status on your side? Can you please post when you updated the CVS?

@Nic: do it the way I do... set a marker "Do not use this build from <DATE>" ... should be enough. Don't let childish behaviour rule your mind. A little bit of constructive criticism is a MUST.

-h, what about the following way to scale the credits:

You have the first pass, credits get quant. <16>. In second pass, jump to the credits start position, sum up all frame sizes up to the end, subtract that from <desired size>, get the scale factor and then encode up to config->credits_frame and after that just apply quant. <16>?

I didn't look into the way you do that now, I just tried to avoid the reported error message by commenting out the check ;) Since it didn't work, we can play around now, if you like ;)

Do you have ICQ or something? Maybe we can coordinate our work then to avoid double or unneccessary work...

Regards,
Koepi

[-h]

CVS is patched as of about 20 minutes ago, most every internal 2-pass iteration I could think of I tested and found it working.

What you described for the credits is pretty much exactly what it does now :)

I'm on AIM as hst1nk (most days) and icq as hstink , though I don't know how many others share the name on icq. Can't remember my number, it's been months since I used it.

-h

[Koepi]

Hmpf, can't search users with trillian and i don't like to register on AIM since I am afraid of the plenty security leaks (well ICQ has them as well, but not as bad...)

25073073 - just contact me ;)

Regards,
Koepi

P.S.: I looked into the new codec.c and it looks WAY better now, that's a better attempt to do that correctly. I'll rebuild a binary ASAP, have to readd my debug output stuff ;)

[Franko30]

@ koepi:

downloaded debugview and the results are:

Quant 2 during first pass, 1st frame 2nd pass Quant 31, then Quant 16.

Frank

[Koepi]

Thanks Frank,

that brings light into that matter - so I broke something on second pass, first pass works correctly :)

Thanks again,
Koepi

[-h]

The current codec.c isn't how I'd like to implement it, but I just wanted to fix this issue asap. There's still a lot that needs cleaning up.

An ICQ search for your number isn't turning anything up (just freezing on my end). Try finding me on 85734223.

-h

[Koepi]

Amazing, found exactly that number via the icq webpage ;)
I already contacted you... :)

Regards,
Koepi

P.S.: unzipping fresh checkout now...

[-h]

I never got anything via ICQ - people have complained that I never reply to their ICQ messages, seems they just disappear somewhere along the line :confused:

Ah well, I've got to get up in 5 hours anyway - if you find anything scary.. merge the fix! :)

-h

[MaTTeR]

Sigh...Nics site is indeed closed:mad:

Whats up with this? I'll be traveling all this week on business but when I get back I'll get a compiler installed and put up a site myself;) I will welcome your feedback...this is what it's all about right?

[Koepi]

hehehe Matter ;)

-h, do you have anything fancy like zone alarm installed or are behind a restrictive router/firewall in your network? This is indeed strange...

Well, I just put up new binaries, you may check if they work (I can't sionce I'm still stcuk in a first pass with the old binaries... :-/ )

Please use debugview to see if everything works the way it should...
I added something more on the debug output/first pass, but it may be trash and maybe doesn't work at all...

Please, send reports :)

Regards,
Koepi

[Nic]

:)

-Nic

[Koepi]

Hidden update to XviD-11022002-3 ;)

I modified 1st pas sdebug output to actually show the total filesize as well (I need that for checking compression ratio...).

The last build (-2) should work as well.
Modified sources are as usual included in my zip-archive.

Can anyone test this binary on 2nd pass as well?
I had to stop my encoding session right in the middle (4 hours for nothing :( ) just to verify that at least 1st pass works.

Regards,
Koepi

[Franko30]

@ Koepi:

OK - it seems like you've done it (Fix2), the results stick to what you enter in the codec dialogue.

One minute file:

Credits Start 0: Quant 2 through whole 1st pass, then varying Quantizers in 2nd pass.

Credits Start 1100: 1st pass - Quant 2 till frame 1100, then Quant 16. 2nd pass - varying Quantizers till frame 1100, then Quant 16.


And the "pink" problem seems to be gone, too, with these builds - or should I take off my sunglasses? :cool:


Thanks, Koepi!


Frank

P.S.: I can't get rid of the feeling that I wanted to do s.th. else today besides testing binaries :D

[Koepi]

Thanks a million for testing Frank :)

I'm glad that it works now again :)

@Nic: the CVS is in usable state again, compiling without modification should work like charme again.

Regards,
Koepi

[Nic]

Well done Koepi :)

It will be great when all the pink/green blocks have disappeared....

(remember to tell Doom9 to download from your site from now on.....I dont want him (or me :) to get complaints :)

Take Care,
-Nic

[Franko30]

Originally posted by Koepi
Thanks a million for testing Frank :)
Regards,
Koepi


It was my pleasure!

BTW: I tested Fix 3 and it seems to work, too.


Hey, what about adding a "start credits" feature next? A lot of movies start with Credits and not much moving at all :D :D


Frank

[MaTTeR]

Which compiler are you guys using? Dibrom seems to recommend the Intel compiler for his LAME builds.

[Nic]

If you look through videocoding.de you'll see a similar thread about compilers, it doesn't look like the ICL is the way to go. I think everyone is using VC6. I've got VC7 which I was going to try out today & put up a binary.....ahh..I doubt it would have made much difference anyway,

Cheers,
-Nic

[MaTTeR]

Thanks Nic:)

If you decide to try VC7 please post your results. I guess I'll eventually get into the wonderful world of compiling:D

[Koepi]

It shouldn't be too hard to implement "start credits". I could do so - but first I want my movie to finish sometime close - it's on my HD since saturday, I'm in the 5th start now...

Regards,
Koepi

[Franko30]

Originally posted by Koepi
I'm in the 5th start now...

Regards,
Koepi


Take your time!

And don't crash your computer during your 5th try ;)

Frank

[Koepi]

Hi,

I added experimental start credits support to my binaries.
They might not work at all.
The GUI can be broken.

I just hacked in what i think is needed, but since my compi is occupied I can't test the new binary.

Please keep me posted with results.

Regards,
Koepi

[Nic]

Ive given up ;) :

11/02/02 part 2 (latest CVS)

www.freewebz.com/xvid

or

xvid.stormpages.com

With -h's fixes & Koepi's additions.

Cheers,
-Nic

[Koepi]

Heh, you added my additions? Nice :) They aren't that useless then I think - which makes me happy .)

Btw., did you already use M$ .Net VC?
Is the new dll faster?

Best regards,
Koepi

[Nic]

No im in the middle of a big project for a client & I really don't want any delays so I havent put it on my comp yet (Just in case)...But I think ill take the plunge tommorrow.

(I didn't add anything to the build, its straight from the CVS)

Cheers,
-Nic

[Franko30]

Originally posted by Koepi
Hi,

I added experimental start credits support to my binaries.
They might not work at all.
The GUI can be broken.
Regards,
Koepi


Hi again,

after doing some actual encoding (instead of testing) and watching the encoded Farscape episode with a feeling of "Wow!", I now had the time to test the "start credits" option.

And you're right, the GUI is "broken": :(


When checking the "Use start credits" box, start frame and end frame stay greyed out and cannot be used. Doesn't matter if "2 pass 1st pass" or "second pass int." or anything else is selected.

Frank

[Koepi]

Ok, thanks, I'll look at into it. Strange thing is, all the code is in there. Maybe I have to add a message handler ;)

I'm trying to involve a new option for two pass now, separate Intra frame quantizer settings - should give much better quality on low bitrate condition, but can break file size predictability... I'll test around with that for myself first.

Regards,
Koepi

[Koepi]

Ok, small bugfix without version numbering change:
I disabled the greyed out fields. They just will get respected when "Use start credits" is checked (hopefully....).

Frank, can you please redownload the binaries and check again?

Thanks,
Koepi

[Franko30]

Originally posted by Koepi

Frank, can you please redownload the binaries and check again?


Sorry, but unfortunately the "end frame" box in the "start credits" option is still greyed out.

Frank

[Koepi]

Damnit.

Well, in 5 minutes my 8 hours first pass is finsihed and then I can start testing here again (well, at least install other binaries).

I'll put up new binaries when i figured out why the box is still greyed out. But please don't use that binary for regular purposes since I (tried to) hardcode a Intra frame DRF range of 2x-3x on 2 pass modes(in the second part).... dunno if that works correctly. But for testing start credits it should be suitable.

I'll write another post when I updated the page.

Regards,
Koepi

[Franko30]

Well, I have to get up early tomorrow, so it's good night for me - if you succeed with the start credits and the other stuff, I can test anything you want later tomorrow morning.:D



Regards

Frank

[Koepi]

One more _damnit_!

I couldn't resolve doom9.org for ~2 1/2 hours now...

The new binary is up, the fields are working now. I added an extra that I'm testing ATM:
locked quantizers for keyframes.
It's hardcoded to 2x-3x until now, but if the result looks good I'll include it to the configuration GUI.

Still I need someone to test the start-credits option.

Sleep well guys,

regards,
Koepi

[vinetu]

Hi Koepi,
I've just tested the new build - Start and End credits works correctly.
The only mistake I found is uncorrect file sizes:
expected file size - 55 Mb
1pass(2passes) - 62 Mb
2pass(2passes) - 22 Mb
( avi lenght - 2500 frames ,25 fps)

BTW the "end credits" Quantizer is active right now on the first pass
instead of only on second pass.

[Ripe73]

HI!

If i have done a statsfile with a previous Xvidbuild can i use the same statsfile for the latest build or will it not work correct?

[-h]

.stats will always be the same between builds, so you can safely use the old one you made.

@Koepi: I'm going to start another overhaul of the vfw :) Wish I could get you on icq or aim. suxen_drol came up with a pretty good way to organise the frontend, so I'm going to move some tabs around (again), add some popup dialogs and see if I can merge your changes (or just recode them as per my own messy style). Credits will be supported by all modes, not just 2-pass. Also, the registry will store separate keys, not a struct blob (should make external automation easier?)

Going to start coding now, should be done in an hour or so ....

-h

[Teegedeck]

It depends. If your .stats aren't too old, you might get away with it. If they're several months old, you'll certainly have problems as meanwhile the internal inter-/intra-decision (keyframes) has changed.

[Ripe73]

Originally posted by Teegedeck
It depends. If your .stats aren't too old, you might get away with it. If they're several months old, you'll certainly have problems as meanwhile the internal inter-/intra-decision (keyframes) has changed.

I forgot to say they are from the 02-02 build.
Thanks

[Franko30]

Originally posted by Koepi
One more _damnit_!

Still I need someone to test the start-credits option.

Koepi

Hi Koepi,

I just had the time to test the start credits option:

The checkboxes work, but debugview shows that in first pass, quantizer 2 is used till the start of the end credits, then quant 16 as specified. In 2nd pass the specified credits quantizer gets used for start and end credits. Thus, the desired filesize 6651 (for a 1 minute file) isn't reached - resulting filesize is 6040. I guess is because of the Quantizer 2 during start credits in first pass, isn't it?

Frank

@ vinetu:

from what I learned so far, the credits Quantizer (16) is supposed to work in 1st AND 2nd pass. But I might be wrong, let's wait for a moderator's reply to that.

[Koepi]

Uh, have to look for that stupid mistake where i forgot to use that fixed quantizer on first pass.
Since the algorithm is VERY easy (just subtract the fixed quantizer regions [the space they need] from the desired size and use the residue to scale down the rest) it of course produces false results then :-/

sorry for that stupid mistake.
I have to checkout -h's changes and try to add my ideas then as well.
@-h:

can you make up some space for fixed keyframe quantizer as well? In fact those are the same as min and max quantizer, but special ones for keyframes... I only want to use them on 2 pass mode/2nd pass, so it shouldn't be a general tab holding this ;)

Thanks,
best regards,
Koepi

[-h]

can you make up some space for fixed keyframe quantizer as well? In fact those are the same as min and max quantizer, but special ones for keyframes... I only want to use them on 2 pass mode/2nd pass, so it shouldn't be a general tab holding this ;)

A whole lot of stuff is changing - credits are calculated with a rate % (same as gknot). There's going to be a dialog box for the internal 2-pass mode, so we can cram as much stuff on there as we want :)

Code is going well so far..

Finally got your icq messages, did you get the one I sent back?

-h

[Koepi]

Nope, i didn't get those - you should upgrade to an icq client that supports the new v7/v8 protocol. ICQ programmed their servers to drop randomly messages from clients with older protocols.
I recommand trillian - i think the URL was www.trillian.cc ...

Thanks,
Koepi

[-h]

How awesome of icq...
downloading now.

-h

[Koepi]

Well, in the meantime...

The experimental intraframe quantizer lock gave very nice results. I still wonder if they were nicer if we disallow quantizer jumps >1 or >2 after a keyframe... for example, if I had:

INTRA qu.3 (upped!)
Inter qu.11
Inter qu. 7
Inter qu. 5
Inter qu. 4
...
Inter qu. 3
Inter qu. 4
Inter qu. 4
Inter qu. 4
Inter qu. 3
(This happened quite a few times, but mostly it worked out correctly. Even these scenes still look awesome for:
640x352 TV Source rip 1h52m on 1 700MB CDR, using MPEG quantizer... there was still some minor noise left in the images which result in a vivd picture - but it's way better than the first version I tried...) ;)
Maybe the quality is even better if we have

INTRA qu. 3 (upped!)
Inter qu. 5
Inter qu. 7
Inter qu. 6 (or 7)
Inter qu. 5
Inter qu. 4
Inter qu. 4
Inter qu. 4
Inter qu. 3
...


?

We had to check in something global like "last_quantizer" and correct the decision we make:


if (frame->quant < last_quantizer-2)
{
frame->quant = last_quantizer - 2;
}
if (frame->quant > last_quantizer+2)
{
frame->quant = last_quantizer + 2;
}
last_quantizer = frame->quant;


This has only to apply for interframes of course.

What do you think -h?

Koepi

[Koepi]

Well well, since there were yet no changes commited to the CVS i cleaned up my version of XviD.
Changelog is inside the package and on my site, so you know where to fetch it ;)

- Added intraframe quantizer lock, hardcoded to 2x-3x until now.
- Added a routine to prevent quantizer jumping, largest jump amount is +-2 now.
- start credits should finally work. forgot to add them to the first pass as well ;)

As a note, this release is HIGHLY experimental due to the hardcoded quantizer lock, use with care. I got very good results with these intraframe quantizer locks, but have to test quality with the quantizer jumping prevention a little more. A first, fast test showed a once-more-improved image.

Have fun!

Best regards,
Koepi

[saVe]

i just wanted to thank you guys for the great work you've been doing! you should know that it is really appreciated! in the last two days or so i've become an xvid fan i think, the first thing i do after standing up is to check what's new around here... ;)

again, thanks a lot!

[-h]

@Koepi: everything's finished, except that credits aren't working properly (blah) and the edit box for bitrate, quality etc. doesn't automatically update the slider. It's too late to keep working, so it'll have to wait til tomorrow.

I think people might start getting used to such fast-paced development, that's a scary thought ;)

-h

[Koepi]

@-h:
hm, so should I wait until you finsihed the sliders as well? I know how to do such stuff in C++, but I'm still very bad in C, especially when it comes to the windows message handling.

And, what's wrong with the credits? They worked the way they were before, I even updated "my" binary/sources to work as start credits as well - it's the same code and got approval yetserday that it works (well, except for my modifications of course ;) ).

If you're going to sleep now, then good night & dream well!

Regards,
Koepi

[-h]

I'm about to turn in now.. looks like I've found an __int64 bug in VC6 :rolleyes:

The slider is easy to update, I'm just having trouble catching keystrokes in the text box. The credits work differently to before, no more fixed quantizers (a few more calculations).

I'd have debugged it by now, but VC is doing things like this:

if (codec->config.credits_start && frame <= codec->config.credits_start_frame)
{
start += nns.bytes;
}

This snippet actually adds "nns.bytes" to "codec->config.credits_start", instead of adding it to "start". I can't figure out why either.

Ah well, should be wrapped up tomorrow.

-h

[Ripe73]

HI!

I start a second pass with debugview and there was some frames with
Quant:1
Is that possible?I thought the lowest was 2.:confused:

EDIT
I used XviD-12022002-1

and there is a folder"modified_sources" and its only for your coder i hope:)

So Xvid can handle DRF:1-->better quality