LSFmod [v1.9 - Update 2009/10/05]

[rkalwaitis]

Sagekilla,

If I interleave them doesnt that defeat the purpose of seeing the original input and the filtered output in seperate panes? That was the beauty of the other show commands from other Lato scripts. I tried to play around with it a bit and the little script I worked on would show both input and output, but they were not in synch. In other words the input played much closer to real time than the output. I wanted to see the same frames and the same time as in MCTemporalDenoise show option. I keep playing with it. I get an input and output view with VD (as you know), but I run scripts with avisynth and the input is filtered already for the output to change I need to filter the avs file with a vd filter. So it really does my no good. I like to open the avs files in media player and then I can see the unfiltered input and filtered output. I can see what I actually changed.

lastly since you a x264aholic I would be interest in perhaps you sharing the settings you use for your products when you use MCTemporaldenoise.

Thanks

[rkalwaitis]

Sagekilla,
Primarily Motion Estimation settings.
thanks

[LaTo]

Lato,

I find this a very useful script, but unlike you other scripts I can not compare my efforts with the show true or false option. What is the chance of maybe adding that? I do like seeing the original and the filtered side by side. Just something to think about. If I were smart enough I would do it myself.

Thanks, K

Yes, It's on my todo list for v1.4.
But when? Maybe in 1 week, 1 month... I don't know :p

[Sagekilla]

@rkalwaitis: The idea of interleaving the original frame and the processed frame is that you could flip back and forth in a program like AvsP or VirtualDub(Mod) and see exactly what the filter did.

Also, the x264 is a bit off topic, check your pms ;)

[rkalwaitis]

Im gonna check out the Avsp and the Mod version of VirtualDub. You guys are teaching me too much.

Thanks Lato, ill watch for it. Good stuff!!!!

[Blue_MiSfit]

If you want to do side-by-side comparison it's very easy. AvsP is my weapon of choice!


a=last
lsfmod()
stackhorizontal(a,last)


volia :)

~MiSfit

[rkalwaitis]

Thanks Misfit, That was simple enough even I got it.

[dansus]

Hi, im getting error at 0k in megui with 1.3.

Ive updated all dependencies and seemingly no clue why its failing, any ideas?

[LaTo]

Hi, im getting error at 0k in megui with 1.3.

Ive updated all dependencies and seemingly no clue why its failing, any ideas?

Post your script and the exact error message...

[LaTo]

v1.4:
changed defaults="new" to defaults="slow" & defaults="fast"
added show parameter
cleaned a little the code

:cool:

[MadRat]

My favorite sharpener is FFT3DFilter. Has there been a unbiased, objective comparison between LSFmod and FFT3DFilter?

[rkalwaitis]

Thanks for the show option Lato, you rock.

K

[Jeremy Duncan]

My favorite sharpener is FFT3DFilter. Has there been a unbiased, objective comparison between LSFmod and FFT3DFilter?

I made a test disk especially for just that kind of reasoning, MadRat.

In the test disk is a moving pattern, and in that moving pattern is a hidden image that is revealed by enhancing the image quality.

The disk was intended to be used with a resizer to enlarge the picture, as well as with a plugin like seesaw or lsfmod or fft3dfilter.

here is the test disk.
progressive ntsc test disk (http://www.megaupload.com/?d=PHYV5OKP)

[MadRat]

I made a test disk especially for just that kind of reasoning, MadRat.

In the test disk is a moving pattern, and in that moving pattern is a hidden image that is revealed by enhancing the image quality.

The disk was intended to be used with a resizer to enlarge the picture, as well as with a plugin like seesaw or lsfmod or fft3dfilter.

here is the test disk.
progressive ntsc test disk (http://www.megaupload.com/?d=PHYV5OKP)

Thank you, and I did download it but I was asking if there was a way of actually measuring, for example on a graph, the amount of sharpening as well as the negatives like banding, noise enhancement and haloing.

[Jeremy Duncan]

Thank you, and I did download it but I was asking if there was a way of actually measuring, for example on a graph, the amount of sharpening as well as the negatives like banding, noise enhancement and haloing.

The test disk shows haloing or no haloing dependant on the script.

Been a while since I looked at banding or noise stuff, so I can't quite say if the disk will show results for those, but it might. :)

The test disk is not a graph, but the hidden pattern on the moving part is a clear indicator of the quality of the plugin and the setting used with the plugin, as you will not get a clear look at the hidden pattern without a quality plugin and quality settings.

[lych_necross]

@LaTo,

I just tried v1.4 with the defaults="fast" settings, and it looks great. I love using it for realtime processing.

[mikeytown2]

@MadRat
U can play around with this if you want graphs
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=144638

[rkalwaitis]

Lato,

This rocks. Just a quick question. Can utilizing to much sharpening add a grainy appearance?

LSFmod(smode=5,smethod=5,defaults="fast", soft=-2,edgemaskHQ=true)......This is what I tried.

[Sagekilla]

Sharpening the details too much could also sharpen the grain inherent in film content. So yes, excessive sharpening and amplify grain beyond it's normal appearance.

[DegrainMedian]

Thanks for sharing ...

[rkalwaitis]

Thanks Sagekilla,

That is what Im doing then. Im oversharpening which causes a grainy appearance. I have the same problem with seesaw spresso combo. Ill relook at what Im doing.

k

[EuropeanMan]

^ are you denoising before sharpening...if you need grain in your print...try adding it afterwards?

[EuropeanMan]

I made a test disk especially for just that kind of reasoning, MadRat.

In the test disk is a moving pattern, and in that moving pattern is a hidden image that is revealed by enhancing the image quality.

The disk was intended to be used with a resizer to enlarge the picture, as well as with a plugin like seesaw or lsfmod or fft3dfilter.

here is the test disk.
progressive ntsc test disk (http://www.megaupload.com/?d=PHYV5OKP)

downloaded your test pattern...will be interesting to see what I can come up with...haven't tried sharpening through fft3d yet...thanks for this.

i also would be interested if anyone has posted object results from testing fft3d vs. lsf vs. seesaw

[leeperry]

anyone has posted object results from testing fft3d vs. lsf vs. seesaw
I would personally love to see some examples where LSFmod looks better than LSF.
I've tried a lot of stuff, I can't spot any difference...and I'm using a very fast build of LSF, so I would only be willing to drop it if there were any visible improvement :p

[rkalwaitis]

European Man. Seesaw is faster than FFT3d. I try to use it in this way. Depending upon the settings and the source you can get very good results.

a = last
b = a.FluxSmoothT(11)
SeeSaw(a, b, NRlimit=2, NRlimit2=1, Sstr=1.4, Slimit=7, Spower=2, Sdamplo=8, SdampHi=10, Szp=10, bias=1, sootheT=30)
SPresso(limit=2, limitC=2, bias=100, biasC=100, RGmode=4, RGmodeC=4)

This is off course to taste. Sstr=1.4 ive noticed controls the grainy look. The lower the number the less obvious grain. I max out my Spresso bias'. But 80-up seem to give nice results. RGmodes and remove grain.....you know the drill.

I will try denoising after sharpening. Let you know what It comes out with.

thanks k

[LaTo]

I would personally love to see some examples where LSFmod looks better than LSF.
Easy :p

Source [685kb] (http://latoninf.free.fr/d9/LM/compare/3src.png)
LimitedSharpenFaster(strength=200) [820kb] (http://latoninf.free.fr/d9/LM/compare/3lsf.png)
LSFmod(defaults="slow",strength=200) [721kb] (http://latoninf.free.fr/d9/LM/compare/3slow.png)
LSFmod(defaults="fast",strength=200) [720kb] (http://latoninf.free.fr/d9/LM/compare/3fast.png)

It's not a revolution, but LSFmod is better than LSF for me...

[leeperry]

hummm interesting :D

LSF does crazy banding in the bottom right, LSFmod does not....but you used extreme strength, I use ss1.0 strength=40 in ffdshow as LSF does ugly posterizing if I go >40 :o

[rkalwaitis]

I agree LSFMod is better than LSF.

[Sagekilla]

If you look at the roof of the house, it looks like LSFMod managed to enhance the details there better than LSF did.

[krieger2005]

But LSFMod (slow) add also more halos (see the tree trunk at the left side at the bottom).

[LaTo]

v1.5:
fixed LUT expression (thanks to Didée)
changed Smethod to Smethod+secure

;)

[McCauley]

Hi LaTo,

thanks for your constant updates.
Any ETA for the MoComped sharpening/soothing? Looking forward to it.

Regards
McCauley

[LaTo]

v1.6:
added preblur option
added new Smethod=4

[canuckerfan]

i'm a little confused about the default settings for this script. I understand the 3 different templates you have set (old, slow, and fast). but what are the defaults for each individual parametre? and can I make changes to a parametre once a template has been activated (ex: LSFMod(defaults="slow", strength=65)?

[LaTo]

v1.7:
changed Smethod=4 to "source"

[LaTo]

Another use of the source clip:

You can set an "inverse-degrained clip" as a source clip and bypass Lmode&PP...
Effects are really not bad and it's very fast! I use this script in realtime with 1080p :cool:

LSFmod(source=mt_adddiff(last,mt_makediff(last,last.removegrain(17,-1),U=1,V=1),U=1,V=1),
\ strength=100,Smode=3,Smethod=1,preblur="OFF",secure=false,Lmode=0,soothe=false)

Source (http://latoninf.free.fr/d9/LM/compare/0src.png)
Code above (http://latoninf.free.fr/d9/LM/compare/0special.png)

:)

(You can adjust strength to your taste, try also removegrain(4,-1) which is stronger but some halos are left)

[badshah]

where is the download link

[LaTo]

where is the download link

In the first post :rolleyes:

[LaTo]

Just a quick question. Can utilizing to much sharpening add a grainy appearance?
Yes, but you can try to avoid this with preblur=true

...but you used extreme strength, I use ss1.0 strength=40 in ffdshow as LSF does ugly posterizing if I go >40 :o
Can you show a screenshot with this "ugly posterizing" (and the source) ? :thanks:

[leeperry]

Can you show a screenshot with this "ugly posterizing" (and the source)?
well, it's very subtle....you can use any HD source, then this in MT :
LimitedSharpenFaster(ss_x=1.0,ss_y=1.0,strength=40)
and it will look good, but if you go >40 it will exhibit very ugly posterizing :o
I've tried it all overshoot/blur etc etc, never managed to overcome this issue....so I'm using very little unsharp masking(set to 3) in ffdshow, then LSF on top of it@ss1.0/40 :)

BTW, I also tried your LSFMod 1.6 but it's really slow compared to the original LSF(even further w/ the LimitedSupport_09Jan06B.dll modded version).....and even this was mad slow in the VDUB benchmark :

LSFmod(ss_x=1.0,ss_y=1.0,Lmode=1,soothe=false,Smode=5,strength=40)

I believe it was much faster with <1.4 builds :o

[LaTo]

well, it's very subtle....you can use any HD source, then this in MT :
LimitedSharpenFaster(ss_x=1.0,ss_y=1.0,strength=40)
and it will look good, but if you go >40 it will exhibit very ugly posterizing :o
I've tried it all overshoot/blur etc etc, never managed to overcome this issue....so I'm using very little unsharp masking(set to 3) in ffdshow, then LSF on top of it@ss1.0/40 :)

BTW, I also tried your LSFMod 1.6 but it's really slow compared to the original LSF(even further w/ the LimitedSupport_09Jan06B.dll modded version).....and even this was mad slow in the VDUB benchmark :

LSFmod(ss_x=1.0,ss_y=1.0,Lmode=1,soothe=false,Smode=5,strength=40)

I believe it was much faster with <1.4 builds :o

If you want exactly the same settings as LSF (so the same speed), simply: LSFmod(defaults="old")

Try secure=true on your clip with your settings:
LSFmod(defaults="old",ss_x=1.0,ss_y=1.0,secure=true,strength=40)

This should fix the "posterizing" problem (even with strength>40)...
If not, post a sample please, because I can't reproduce the issue on my side ;)

[leeperry]

well it gives a "wax museum" look to faces @ss1.0>40 :D

ok I'll try and report back, thanks for your help

[rfmmars]

Using a 720p .Mkv file in AVSp I had servre color fringing. Using the Std. LSF funtion I did not. Also the speed was 50% slower for version 1.7


LSFmod(SdmpHi=1,ss_x=2.0,ss_y=2.0,strength=[<"Sharpness (400)", 0, 1000, 185>])

Had same results with LSFmod()


http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/6914/lsfmodcolorproblem.th.jpg (http://img9.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lsfmodcolorproblem.jpg)

Richard

[LaTo]

Using a 720p .Mkv file in AVSp I had servre color fringing.
I haven't this issue in my side, please post a sample... (1-2sec is okay)

Also the speed was 50% slower for version 1.7
You should use defaults="fast" if you want speed

[rfmmars]

I haven't this issue in my side, please post a sample... (1-2sec is okay)


You should use defaults="fast" if you want speed

What interesting is it isn't on each frame, in fact you can go back and forth and then to the problem frame again and the the color is fine, but again going back and forth again to that frame, the color error may be the same, less or greater. The problem appears every 7 or 8 frames, and lasts 1 to 3 frames.

I have two tabs in AVSp with identical scripts except one has the standard LSF checked and the other with your version 1.7 checked. I haven't seen this problem in your other releases.

I will post a small clip as soon as possible.

Richard

[rfmmars]

It looks like a memory problem on my end. Today when I was making a sample clip to upload, the problem wasn't there. Yesterday it happen at the end of a long computer session, I should have rebooted before posting a non exiting problem, well maybe 1.7 does use more memnory since the LSF std didn't have that problem, but now LSFmod.1.7 looks great now.

I changed Defults to "fast" and yes it ran much much faster.

Sorry for all the trouble.

Richard

[canuckerfan]

i'm a little confused about the default settings for this script. I understand the 3 different templates you have set (old, slow, and fast). but what are the defaults for each individual parametre? and can I make changes to a parametre once a template has been activated (ex: LSFMod(defaults="slow", strength=65)?
i'm still a little confused about this... could someone please clarify?

[LaTo]

I understand the 3 different templates you have set (old, slow, and fast). but what are the defaults for each individual parametre?
You should read the first post or the readme at the beginning of the script (in the SETTINGS part).
By default, LSFmod uses defaults="slow".

and can I make changes to a parametre once a template has been activated (ex: LSFMod(defaults="slow", strength=65)?
Yes, you can change everything...
ex: LSFMod(defaults="slow", Lmode=1, Soothe=false, strength=200)

[McCauley]

Hi LaTo,

have you had a look at this (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1256206#post1256206)?
If used as upsizer the result is sharper, but i havent found good sources to test detail retention and haloing behaviour.
Perhaps it is worth a look.

Regards
McCauley

PS: Still waiting for the m'c'ed sharpening. :devil:

[@Tron@]

Thanks for updates. Its relly great !