Analysing Video in MeGui does not work

[arrirc]

I am trying to convert my DVD collection to MP4 (X.264) and the GUI I am using is MeGUI. Unfortunately, the inbuilt analysis module for the type of source is not working and giving me an error related with TIVTC.dll. I posted this problem in the MeGUI thread but could not get any solution.

So is there any way to separately analyze and determine the type of video (Interlaced or Progressive) so that I can input these information manually?
If the source is Interlaced, what type of deinterlace method in megui I should adopt?

Please help :(

Thank you

[Sharktooth]

the problem is it does not work for you coz something is messed up on your side...
btw, :search: or google and look for telecine and interlacing.

[arrirc]

the problem is it does not work for you coz something is messed up on your side...

I hardly believe that anything is messed up at my side, as i have formatted my PC recently. This feature neither worked earlier nor it works now. the only thing that did not change between these formats is that I do not install these applications including AviSynth at default %Program Files% location.

Thanks for the google tip sharktooth, but I have already done that. But I was unable to zero down on a solution because of my inexperience in this matter- hence I requested help here. Not to mention, that I am not sure which method of deinterlace I should use- which i beleive you are the best person to tell.

[Sharktooth]

first of all ensure the avisynth plugins path is set correctly in megui settings...
however have a look at this: http://www.100fps.com/ AND this: http://www.doom9.org/ivtc-tut.htm

[Dark Eiri]

Sometimes I get the same error. This happens only in extremely low motion videos, don't know why.

[arrirc]

Thank you so much Sharktooth for those links- read both, tagged both for re-reading. So now I (somewhat) understand what exactly is interlacing-deinterlacing.
I have checked Megui settings, the Avisynth installation and plugins folder paths are correct. Only besplit path is not there. but I presume that must be a separate issue.

So there are two things left for me to figure out:
1. How exactly should I determine whether the DVD material is interlaced or progressive and
2. Which method in the MeGUI should I adopt to deinterlace in case the movie is a i) general movie (DVD) ii)animation movie? I have seen that if I choose the source type "interlaced" manually, then the default Deinterlacing method selected by meGUI is Yadif. Should I go with this?

EDIT: I found one application in Doom9 named SourceDetection. Can this application be used?

Sometimes I get the same error. This happens only in extremely low motion videos, don't know why.

For me, its almost always. :( I just hope that either one of us can figure it out so that we can use the "Analyze" function without much problem.

Sorry to ask you so many questions but I am rather disparate to figure things out.

[poisondeathray]

You will get better results if you take the time to learn about interlacing and do everything manually. Fact: No automated detection program will give you as good results as if you did it manually. The reason is there are simple patterns and very bizarre & difficult patterns. Although most modern retail North American DVD's have a simple pattern, but sometimes you get some foreign DVD's which are blended and very difficult to deinterlace.

Open your source in something like vdub (or any program that doesn't automatically apply deinterlacing). Advance frame by frame and it should very easy to tell if it's progressive vs. interlaced.

A great tool to learn about avisynth is AvsP. You can apply a setting then advance frame by frame and see it's effects, then readjust. You should also check field order: if it's top field first vs. bottom field first.

For very difficult patterns, post a sample and have one of the gurus in the avisynth section to give suggestions

[arrirc]

Thanks for your response poisondeathray :), i understand your point.

If I go by DGIndex then I find the movie to be Interlaced. Problem is in the deinterlace methods list in megui I could not find bob=wave deinterlace method! Which deinterlace method should I choose then (for animation and movie)?

[Guest]

Thanks for your response poisondeathray :), i understand your point. Apparently you don't, based on your next comment.

If I go by DGIndex then I find the movie to be Interlaced. The point is that you shouldn't "go by DGIndex". DGIndex tells you only how the stream was encoded, which is not the same as telling you if the content is really interlaced or progressive (or field-blended, or phase-shifted, or hybrid, or ...). If you don't understabd how that distinction can be true, then you have more learning to do.

[arrirc]

Apparently you don't, based on your next comment.

Then I surrender :(

The point is that you shouldn't "go by DGIndex".

Ok, got it...

The is there no easy way to understand whether the source is P or IL? The method that poisondeathray says requires quite a bit of experience and moreover it is rather relative. I believe only with experience I can learn to detect the source type by viewing it frame by frame. But I need to know whether my judgment is correct- and that's why can tools like GSpot be used to detect, or GSpot also sees the loaded vob in the same manner as DGI and reports in the same way?

[Guest]

You're just not getting it. There is NO automated tool that is a reliable touchstone, that can tell you the correct answer! There is nothing better than an experienced human mind. You can get that experience. It's not so hard as you think. To test your conclusions, you can follow poisondeathray's sound advice:

"post a sample and have one of the gurus in the avisynth section to give suggestions"

You can try to analyze one and post it. Then you can compare your conclusion to those of the gurus. After several times, your experience will develop and soon you will consider the process to be as easy as it actually is.

Post your first sample stream, and I'll walk you through the process.

[poisondeathray]

The is there no easy way to understand whether the source is P or IL? The method that poisondeathray says requires quite a bit of experience and moreover it is rather relative. I believe only with experience I can learn to detect the source type by viewing it frame by frame. But I need to know whether my judgment is correct- and that's why can tools like GSpot be used to detect, or GSpot also sees the loaded vob in the same manner as DGI and reports in the same way?


Actually the easy part is determining whether the source is interlaced or not. The hard part is what to do with it after ...

It takes absolutely no experience to open the source in virtualdub, and use the arrow key. If you see horizontal artifacts and something that looks like those examples in the 100fps.com link, it's interlaced. If you don't and it looks "normal" - it's progressive. It's as simple as that - give it a try! :)

The problem with the autodetection tools is that they can make the mistake of claiming "progressive" when the source is interlaced and vice-versa. Furthermore the deinterlacing solutions they propose are often limited and give subpar results. Eitherway you're in trouble.

And neuron2 even offered to walk you through the process - I would take him up on that!

[Guest]

It's as simple as that Well, not quite. You could have phase-shifted progressive, and that is going to look interlaced using your simple method. We need to follow Einstein: keep things as simple as possible, but not simpler.

My recommendation is to step through fields and look for typical "signatures". I've posted about them before.

And I have FAQ about it here:

http://neuron2.net/faq.html#analysis

[Avenger007]

http://avisynth.org/mediawiki/Interlace_detection

[arrirc]

Thank you very much poisondeathray, neuron2 and Avenger007 for replying.

I am grateful to both of you (poisondeathray and neuron2) for your offer of help. I shall surely go through the process and post the screen shots here for your valued opinion.

Thanks again

[Guest]

Don't post screenshots! Post a link to an unprocessed source clip. You can cut it in various ways, depending on the format of the clip. We can help you with that too.

[Sharktooth]

screenshots are quite useless to detect patterns. post a small clip as neuron2 suggested.

[arrirc]

Don't post screenshots! Post a link to an unprocessed source clip. You can cut it in various ways, depending on the format of the clip. We can help you with that too.

screenshots are quite useless to detect patterns. post a small clip as neuron2 suggested.

Thanks very much.

Its ripped DVD, so I think I need to use VD-MPEG2! Please tell me how to save stream. Should I go like this- set the first frame and then set the end frame. the File>Save as AVI? But then am I not processing the video stream as the resultant file is in AVI? :confused:

[Avenger007]

Its ripped DVD, so I think I need to use VirtualDub-MPEG2!
What program did you use to rip the DVD (it may also have the ability to extract a sample)?

[arrirc]

I generally use DVDFab HD Decrypter or DVD Decrypter

[Guest]

Open the VOB in DGIndex. Set a range with the [ and ] buttons. Then Save project and demux video. Upload the resulting M2V file.

[arrirc]

Thank you neuron2.

Please find the file here: http://rapidshare.com/files/161411683/VTS_01_32.demuxed.m2v
It appears to me to be interlaced.Though I thought that generally TV shows tend to be interlaced, whereas it is a movie (on DVD) made from 35mm negative film!

[Guest]

Sorry, but I have to be picky about the clip you selected.

It's essential to use a section with a lot of motion, and preferably pans and objects moving across the screen. A talking head like you provided makes it hard to discern changes between fields, and hard to see blended fields.

Please upload a sample with LOTS of motion.

Probably it has blended fields, but we'll be able to tell for sure with a better clip.

[arrirc]

No problem neuron2, thanks for your guidance. Give me a little time, I shall surely upload a part as you have instructed.

[foxyshadis]

You probably could have had suggestions on how to make the video analysis just work without the hassle if you'd posted in the MeGUI & GUIs forum. Oh well. MeGUI's usually accurate over 95% of the time on mine. I suspect you're missing a dll it was compiled against.

[poisondeathray]

You probably could have had suggestions on how to make the video analysis just work without the hassle if you'd posted in the MeGUI & GUIs forum. Oh well. MeGUI's usually accurate over 95% of the time on mine. I suspect you're missing a dll it was compiled against.

Actually, he did post in several threads including the MeGUI troubleshooting one, before starting this one. IIRC, he tried re-installing, downloading .dlls separately, and checking paths, etc...

[Avenger007]

He doesn't use %Program Files% path.

[arrirc]

Actually, he did post in several threads including the MeGUI troubleshooting one, before starting this one. IIRC, he tried re-installing, downloading .dlls separately, and checking paths, etc...

Thank you very much :)

He doesn't use %Program Files% path.

True...and if for this MeGUI does not function properly (for the feature in question that is), then I believe developers are the only persons who can take care of this.

I shall upload another suitable part of the video ASAP

[Sharktooth]

i dont use %Program Files% path too and it works here...
i think i tried to think at all possible causes but i still cant understand why it doesnt work for you.

[Avenger007]

Maybe he did custom installations of other programs that MeGUI and Avisynth depend on.
I asked in the troubleshooting thread if playing the avs script with and without the call to TIVTC worked, but he didn't answer.

[arrirc]

Maybe he did custom installations of other programs that MeGUI and Avisynth depend on.
I asked in the troubleshooting thread if playing the avs script with and without the call to TIVTC worked, but he didn't answer.

Then I must have missed it- very sorry. Anyway, could you please tell me what exactly I need to do to check that?

I shall be uploading the video part pretty soon- once i get a little break from my work. :sigh:

[Guest]

Still waiting for that upload!

[arrirc]

oops!!!! very sorry, I was even unable to sit in front of my PC for last few days...I shall surely do it today...