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View Full Version : latest MeGUI (x264 core:60 r895M) major FPS loss for me

Zep
5th July 2008, 22:20
just ran some tests and 0.3.0.1014 build (x264 core:60 r895M) i only get 19.61 FPS VS the build from last week (
x264 core:60 r886M 1075536) i get 26.34 FPS.

exact same avs and source and settings etc...



Anyone else seeing a speed hit? Are there some new settings i need to be aware of perhaps?
Sharktooth
6th July 2008, 02:54
None that im aware of.
If you used the same profile, that should not happen.
Dark Shikari
6th July 2008, 02:57
Post the x264 logs for each.

/is hoping this isn't the "ratecontrol bug" reported earlier that nobody could replicate...
Sharktooth
6th July 2008, 03:01
dang... could it be due to the compiler version/optimizations? IIRC ratecontrol is written in pure C...
Dark Shikari
6th July 2008, 03:07
dang... could it be due to the compiler version/optimizations? IIRC ratecontrol is written in pure C...Doubtful, but possible.

If I had to guess what was going on in the thread with the ratecontrol bug, it appears that the FPU state isn't getting restored correctly after an MMX function, resulting in a floating point exception.

If the same is happening here, at least we've got the problem replicated... :confused:
Underground78
6th July 2008, 09:46
If the same is happening here, at least we've got the problem replicated... :confused:

:rolleyes:

If I remember correctly, there was a strange bug report in Megui bugs tracker which was spotted by Sharktooth. I think it was about x264 and bitrate too high in 2nd pass (by a factor of 4) but the stats were really strange. I'm not sure but it may be related to this bug ... :o

Edit :http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=2008801&group_id=156112&atid=798476 ... Here the stats :

Job commandline: "C:\Program Files (x86)\megui\tools\x264\x264.exe" --pass 1 --bitrate 10000 --stats "F:\RAW\BluRay-Film.2008.DTS.DL.1080p.BluRay.x264\BluRay-Film.stats"
--bframes 16 --b-pyramid --direct auto --filter -2,-1 --subme 1 --partitions none --me dia --merange 8 --threads auto --thread-input --sar 1:1 --progress
--no-psnr --no-ssim --output NUL "F:\RAW\BluRay-Film.2008.DTS.DL.1080p.BluRay.x264\BluRay-Film.avs"

avis [info]: 1920x800 @ 23.98 fps (131222 frames)
x264 [info]: using SAR=1/1
x264 [info]: using cpu capabilities: MMX2 SSE2Fast SSSE3 Cache64
x264 [info]: slice I:2555 Avg QP:17.88 size:125467
x264 [info]: slice P:83976 Avg QP:19.85 size: 61956
x264 [info]: slice B:44691 Avg QP:21.63 size: 24878
x264 [info]: mb I I16..4: 46.9% 0.0% 53.1%
x264 [info]: mb P I16..4: 46.9% 0.0% 0.0% P16..4: 47.6% 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% skip: 5.5%
x264 [info]: mb B I16..4: 5.4% 0.0% 0.0% B16..8: 26.5% 0.0% 0.0% direct:29.0% skip:39.0%
x264 [info]: final ratefactor: 20.21
x264 [info]: direct mvs spatial:99.4% temporal:0.6%
x264 [info]: kb/s:9698.8

encoded 131222 frames, 18.76 fps, 9698.92 kb/s

Job commandline: "C:\Program Files (x86)\megui\tools\x264\x264.exe" --pass 2 --bitrate 10000 --stats "F:\RAW\BluRay-Film.2008.DTS.DL.1080p.BluRay.x264\BluRay-Film.stats"
--bframes 16 --b-pyramid --weightb --direct auto --filter -2,-1 --partitions p8x8,b8x8,i4x4,i8x8 --8x8dct --merange 8 --threads auto --thread-input --sar 1:1 --progress
--no-psnr --no-ssim --output "F:\RAW\BluRay-Film.2008.DTS.DL.1080p.BluRay.x264\BluRay-Film.mkv" "F:\RAW\BluRay-Film.2008.DTS.DL.1080p.BluRay.x264\BluRay-Film.avs"

avis [info]: 1920x800 @ 23.98 fps (131222 frames)
x264 [info]: using SAR=1/1
x264 [info]: using cpu capabilities: MMX2 SSE2Fast SSSE3 Cache64
x264 [info]: slice I:2555 Avg QP:42.51 size:316814
x264 [info]: slice P:83976 Avg QP:41.17 size:255942
x264 [info]: slice B:44691 Avg QP:42.96 size:161177
x264 [info]: mb I I16..4: 48.2% 43.4% 8.3%
x264 [info]: mb P I16..4: 38.3% 35.7% 3.2% P16..4: 11.4% 7.3% 1.7% 0.0% 0.0% skip: 2.3%
x264 [info]: mb B I16..4: 27.8% 0.0% 0.0% B16..8: 26.6% 2.9% 3.5% direct:19.1% skip:20.0%
x264 [info]: 8x8 transform intra:39.0% inter:32.4%
x264 [info]: direct mvs spatial:96.6% temporal:3.4%
x264 [info]: kb/s:43128.5

encoded 131222 frames, 8.08 fps, 43128.62 kb/s
Zep
6th July 2008, 10:07
Post the x264 logs for each.

/is hoping this isn't the "ratecontrol bug" reported earlier that nobody could replicate...

I'll do more testing and try to figure out what is going on. Since that post I have tried setting back everything to MeGUI defaults and both cores encode same speed when I do that.

thx
Zep
6th July 2008, 10:13
:rolleyes:

If I remember correctly, there was a strange bug report in Megui bugs tracker which was spotted by Sharktooth. I think it was about x264 and bitrate too high in 2nd pass (by a factor of 4) but the stats were really strange. I'm not sure but it may be related to this bug ... :o



pass 1 speed is fine. in fact it may be a little faster. 81 FPS and now I get 83 FPS. So this also appears ito be a 2nd pass thing only. I'm gonna do more testing later. I just woke up 15 minutes ago so right now I need my morning tea and not x264 worries :D
foxyshadis
6th July 2008, 16:19
The inclusion of PsyRDO in a new patched build? See if the speed suddenly diverges when you raise it to subme 6.
Dark Shikari
6th July 2008, 16:24
The inclusion of PsyRDO in a new patched build? See if the speed suddenly diverges when you raise it to subme 6.Yeah, that sounds like someone has been sticking Psy RDO in MeGUI builds before its done... :p
Sharktooth
7th July 2008, 13:31
megui ALWAYS includes the latest bobor's modified (patched) x264 build.
lexor
7th July 2008, 15:30
megui ALWAYS includes the latest bobor's modified (patched) x264 build.

Not always, only when you update it. Speaking of which, is there a way to just set x264.nl for update? Must you manually upload builds to megui update servers?
Sharktooth
7th July 2008, 15:59
everyone can create his own custom auto-update repository...
however, yes, actually im manually updating x264 everytime a new version is built.
bob0r
8th July 2008, 01:07
Not always, only when you update it. Speaking of which, is there a way to just set x264.nl for update? Must you manually upload builds to megui update servers?

If you could somehow create a script or part of megui that checks version of:

http://x264.nl/x264/x264.exe
(or any mirror. example: http://mirror02.x264.nl/x264/x264.exe)

That .exe file is always the latest version, same as on the main page.

So its a static path, the file is there, the scripting is up to you guys. (its always been there)

(simple output of x264 --version should do)

Oh and btw, i also think megui should use the x264 GIT code, rather than patched versions, however this does have one benefit, many testers for the patches. So yeah, thats up to the megui devs ... ill just keep compiling the patched builds when requested.
Sharktooth
8th July 2008, 03:10
patched versions mean, blu-ray compatibility, better VBV management, more visual quality thru PRDO.
unless the NAL-HRD and VBV patches hit the GIT, there will always be a patched build for megui.
bob0r
8th July 2008, 15:22
Uhm the VBV patches are already in the GIT code?
And Gabriel maintains them.

As for PsyRDO there is probably a reason its not in GIT yet.
So thats why testing it is good, but its obviously not yet as the developer(s) intended it to be.

As for the blu-ray compatibility, i can agree there, though there are no full bluray (or hddvd) specs available, else i am sure some --bluray switch would be added.
ZombiePimp
8th July 2008, 16:08
I really can't agree with sticking PsyRDO in MeGUI as if it were stable. The bad thing is that it's turned on by default, causing many people to use it unknowingly. At least make it disabled by default, please.
LoRd_MuldeR
8th July 2008, 16:12
I really can't agree with sticking PsyRDO in MeGUI as if it were stable. The bad thing is that it's turned on by default, causing many people to use it unknowingly. At least make it disabled by default, please.

According to Dark Shikari there is no sample yet, where Psy RDO makes things look worse. It either improves the visual quality or has no noticeable effect at all.
So Psy RDO should be a nice goody for the Me GUI users, even for those who don't know about it yet.

Also I think a lot if people want to use Psy RDO explicitly now. Not including it in MeGUI would force all those people to manually "update" their x264.exe file...
Sharktooth
8th July 2008, 16:14
@LoRd_MuldeR: agreed
Dark Shikari
8th July 2008, 16:15
According to Dark Shikari there is no sample yet, where Psy RDO makes things look worse.But is it ready to be pushed out to the masses? I'm not entirely sure about that.

I could imagine situations where it could make things worse.
Sharktooth
8th July 2008, 16:18
yes, that's true, however ppl is free to replace the x264 build that comes with megui with another build... it's just not recommended...
or they just can disable psy-rdo using the custom commandline textbox...
anyways they have a choice.. or even more than one.
Dark Shikari
8th July 2008, 16:20
yes, that's true, however ppl is free to replace the x264 build that comes with megui with another build... it's just not recommended...
or they just can disable psy-rdo using the custom commandline textbox...
anyways they have a choice.. or even more than one.But it isn't documented--people have no idea that its there.
LoRd_MuldeR
8th July 2008, 16:23
But is it ready to be pushed out to the masses? I'm not entirely sure about that.

Well, I think this should be decided by the developers. They have the most experience and they know about all the details...

I can only say: I like Psy RDO look :)

I could imagine situations where it could make things worse.

And there are many situations where no Psy RDO makes things worse...
Sharktooth
8th July 2008, 16:29
But it isn't documented--people have no idea that its there.
in the auto-update window there's "Jarod's patched x264..." or something similar.
so the can just look for that build to know there's psy-rdo...
elguaxo
8th July 2008, 16:39
I could imagine situations where it could make things worse.

Just curious. In the few 2-pass encodes I tried Psy-RDO was really better than the same encode without Psy-RDO. What would be the situations where it could fail?
Dark Shikari
8th July 2008, 16:56
Just curious. In the few 2-pass encodes I tried Psy-RDO was really better than the same encode without Psy-RDO. What would be the situations where it could fail?Probably cases like low bitrate anime where all you care about is sharpness of the lines; Psy RDO might just cause more ringing in those cases.

(Of course perhaps such cases are the same ones where one might not want AQ...)
elguaxo
8th July 2008, 17:02
ok, thanks! So far I've tried it only on live action movies and I really love it.
ZombiePimp
8th July 2008, 17:07
Besides the decreased FPS and increase in CRF encode size, I can attest to Psy RDO overemphasizing the otherwise unnoticeable flaws in some source material, particularly on faces. I'll save that discussion for the official thread though.
LoRd_MuldeR
8th July 2008, 17:30
I can attest to Psy RDO overemphasizing the otherwise unnoticeable flaws in some source material

Maybe Psy RDO simply retains more "details", including flaws, of your source, instead of smoothing them out :confused:
In that case some post-processing filter might help...
TheRyuu
8th July 2008, 18:51
Besides the decreased FPS and increase in CRF encode size, I can attest to Psy RDO overemphasizing the otherwise unnoticeable flaws in some source material, particularly on faces. I'll save that discussion for the official thread though.

Remember, x264 works best with input = output, so if the flaws are in the source then you might want to look to some other way to get rid of it rather then just saying x264 will smooth it over. (which is bad)