is camcorder HDV/AVCHD compatible with Blu-Ray directly?

[fib0by]

If I save to the computer an HDV (MPEG2) file from an HDV camcorder, or an AVCHD file from an AVCHD camcorder, do I still have to process (re-encode) the video track before creating the Blu-Ray image?

Or are those tracks compatible with the Blu-Ray standard, so therefore only remuxing / authoring is required? (and perhaps re-encoding of the audio track, but that's fine)

[kabanero]

fib0by,

I have Sony HDR-HC1, HDV camcorder.
I transfer video to PC in multiple clips at scene changes using HDVSplit.
Then copy those .M2T files to USB flash drive.
Then I stick that flash drive in PS3.
PS3 plays them perfectly, HDV MPEG-2 video 1440x1080, with MPEG 2.0 audio.

That's PS3.

I am not sure if other stand alone BD players can do that.

[fib0by]

kabanero,

Interesting, that's good to know, especially since I own a PS3 too.

See, this is what's not clear to me: HDV is actually 1440x1080, not 1920x1080. Is that resolution permitted by the Blu-Ray standard for the MPEG2 codec?

If push comes to shove, I may use an interim solution similar to what you did, but my goal is to create a Blu-Ray image. Whether the physical layer is actually 25GB Blu-Ray, or just BD-9, is not essential at first (until the prices for the BD media drop).

[kabanero]

kabanero,

See, this is what's not clear to me: HDV is actually 1440x1080, not 1920x1080. Is that resolution permitted by the Blu-Ray standard for the MPEG2 codec?

Yes. HDV (MPEG-2 codec) and AVCHD (AVC codec) are both 1440x1080 and it is a part of Blu-ray specification.

[fico99]

fib0by,

I have Sony HDR-HC1, HDV camcorder.
I transfer video to PC in multiple clips at scene changes using HDVSplit.
Then copy those .M2T files to USB flash drive.
Then I stick that flash drive in PS3.
PS3 plays them perfectly, HDV MPEG-2 video 1440x1080, with MPEG 2.0 audio.

That's PS3.

I am not sure if other stand alone BD players can do that.

Unfortunately, the PS3 plays those directly from the XMB @ 60Hz only.

Owners of a European HDV Camcorder, which operates @ 50 Hz (1080i50), need to create an AVCHD DVD or an AVCHD file structure first and put that on an external hard disk drive or storage card first. The PS3 will then switch automatically to 50Hz, just as it does with DVD or BD.

Disadvantage is that, we Europeans, have to re-encode everything from HDV to AVCHD for smooth playback without any stuttering :(

[fib0by]

Looks like AVCHD camcorders, such as Canon HF10 (http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/Canon-Vixia-HF10-Camcorder-Review-34711.htm) create a BD structure in real time on the flash memory. So, in theory, one could actually just dump the whole flash on a BD (or a DVD-9 with UDF 2.50) and play it in a BD player.

I tested that with a flash ISO image from HF10 I've found on the Internet and it played just fine on the PS3.

[Atak_Snajpera]

I tested that with a flash ISO image from HF10 I've found on the Internet and it played just fine on the PS3.

Where can I download that image?

[fib0by]

Where can I download that image?

http://file.meyersproduction.com/hf10/

The HF10.dmg.zip is a DMG image - Apple's equivalent for ISO. There's a variety of tools to convert that to ISO, on Linux I used dmg2iso.
The ISO is the image of the flash memory on a HF10. Pay attention, the ISO was made with the 8.3 naming convention, so a lot of filenames are mangled. What I did was to run tsMuxeR on a different source to create a standard BD image, then compared that to the HF10 ISO and this way I could manually restore the filenames on the ISO to the correct names. Sounds complicated, but it took maybe 5 minutes - there aren't that many files on the image.

After restoring the names, I extracted the BD image from the ISO directory tree, and burned it to a DVD5-RW, using ImgBurn on Windows, with the UDF 2.50 option turned on.
The PS3 identified the disk as "AVCHD" and played it in full HD. Each m2ts file on the flash (which represents a separate scene when filming) appeared as a separate chapter on the BD player, which is awesome. I wish tsMuxeR could do the same.

[n0mag!c]

Unfortunately, the PS3 plays those directly from the XMB @ 60Hz only.

Owners of a European HDV Camcorder, which operates @ 50 Hz (1080i50), need to create an AVCHD DVD or an AVCHD file structure first and put that on an external hard disk drive or storage card first. The PS3 will then switch automatically to 50Hz, just as it does with DVD or BD.

Disadvantage is that, we Europeans, have to re-encode everything from HDV to AVCHD for smooth playback without any stuttering :(

Yes, this is really annoying issue (on xbox-360 too). :devil:
I found this feedback-form PS3 (http://playstation.metafaq.com/templates/playstation/portal/emailpage?_mftvst:answerRef=%24http%3a%2f%2fapi.transversal.com%2fmfapi%2fobjectref%2fEntryStore%2fEntry%2fhttp%3a%2f%2fwww.metafaq.com%2fmfapi%2fMetafaq%2fClients%2fplaystation%2fModules%2fplaystation3%3a92298%3a5&_mftvst:areaID=%24ps3&_mftvst:kbVal=%24&_mftvst:listType=%24&_mftvst:page=i0&_mftvst:query=%24&id=J030JRPCJCVK8BBI2E0TLQURV4) and sent request for fixing. Maybe alltogether we can make things right?..

[fico99]

Yes, this is really annoying issue (on xbox-360 too). :devil:
I found this feedback-form PS3 (http://playstation.metafaq.com/templates/playstation/portal/emailpage?_mftvst:answerRef=%24http%3a%2f%2fapi.transversal.com%2fmfapi%2fobjectref%2fEntryStore%2fEntry%2fhttp%3a%2f%2fwww.metafaq.com%2fmfapi%2fMetafaq%2fClients%2fplaystation%2fModules%2fplaystation3%3a92298%3a5&_mftvst:areaID=%24ps3&_mftvst:kbVal=%24&_mftvst:listType=%24&_mftvst:page=i0&_mftvst:query=%24&id=J030JRPCJCVK8BBI2E0TLQURV4) and sent request for fixing. Maybe alltogether we can make things right?..

n0mag!c,

I just figured that with the following easy steps you can let the PS3 play native PAL HDV 25fps 1080i 1440x1080 @ 50Hz :)

1. Demux the MPEG-2 video from the original HDV capture file
2. Convert the MPEG audio to an AC3 audio file
3. Mux both video+audio files with tsMuxeR to a Blu-ray File Structure
4. Burn the Blu-ray File Structure to a DVD5 or DVD9 using the UDF 2.50 format.

[n0mag!c]

4. Burn the Blu-ray File Structure to a DVD5 or DVD9 using the UDF 2.50 format.
yes, i know that BDMV/BDAV/AVCHD disks play at native 50Hz. but i'm talking 'bout low-density video files such as divx or mp4. they don't deserve to be reencoded. :)
anyway :thanks: for your attention!

[ymj]

n0mag!c,

I just figured that with the following easy steps you can let the PS3 play native PAL HDV 25fps 1080i 1440x1080 @ 50Hz :)

1. Demux the MPEG-2 video from the original HDV capture file
2. Convert the MPEG audio to an AC3 audio file
3. Mux both video+audio files with tsMuxeR to a Blu-ray File Structure
4. Burn the Blu-ray File Structure to a DVD5 or DVD9 using the UDF 2.50 format.


Yes that's pretty cool and also described here http://forum.videohelp.com/topic346069.html

But what if we want several clips on one AVCHD ?
I still haven't found an easy way to achieve this...

[ymj]

http://file.meyersproduction.com/hf10/

The HF10.dmg.zip is a DMG image - Apple's equivalent for ISO. There's a variety of tools to convert that to ISO, on Linux I used dmg2iso.
The ISO is the image of the flash memory on a HF10. Pay attention, the ISO was made with the 8.3 naming convention, so a lot of filenames are mangled. What I did was to run tsMuxeR on a different source to create a standard BD image, then compared that to the HF10 ISO and this way I could manually restore the filenames on the ISO to the correct names. Sounds complicated, but it took maybe 5 minutes - there aren't that many files on the image.

After restoring the names, I extracted the BD image from the ISO directory tree, and burned it to a DVD5-RW, using ImgBurn on Windows, with the UDF 2.50 option turned on.
The PS3 identified the disk as "AVCHD" and played it in full HD. Each m2ts file on the flash (which represents a separate scene when filming) appeared as a separate chapter on the BD player, which is awesome. I wish tsMuxeR could do the same.

Yep awesome,
but do you know how one can create such a BD/AVCHD structure so that each clip is seen as a new chapter or new menu entry ?

[Eric69]

AVCHD and BD are 2 different formats.

Some players like the PS will play AVCHD and some won't. Other than the fact that some BD players will play both formats, they're not the same.

[Golgot13]

AVCHD and BD are 2 different formats.

Some players like the PS will play AVCHD and some won't. Other than the fact that some BD players will play both formats, they're not the same.

Not agree.
AVCHD and BD is similar:
AVCHD is a BD9 in HDMV without AACS and with AVC codec for video.

Why some player don't support AVCHD?
Because this player check the disc (BDRom, DVDRom, CDR, BDR or DVDR)
before to test a data structure of disc (BD Video, DVD Video, CD Audio).
Some players don't want to play BD9 (it is on BD specification) because it's a DVD disc (DVD9).
Some other player don't play the BD structure if there is not AACS...

Some update (official or hack) will solve this problem...

[Eric69]

AVCHD and BD is similar:

Similar but not the same. :)


AVCHD is a BD9 in HDMV without AACS and with AVC codec for video.

There's nothing HDMV about AVCHD. There are 2 authoring modes in BD - HDMV is one, BD-J is the other.

[Golgot13]

Similar but not the same. :)

There's nothing HDMV about AVCHD.

You will know if you read the BD specification ROM2 Part3 and AVCRec specification.
You can see some info on www.blu-raydisc.info