S-VHS capture set-up problems

[2Bdecided]

I'm trying to digitise some old (1991-1998) S-VHS camcorder tapes. A few are S-VHS-C originals, but most are S-VHS dubs from the S-VHS-C originals (since recorded over several times!). All are PAL 4x3.

I'm shocked by the poor quality, but I guess they always looked like this, and my expectations have increased over the years.

My concern at this stage is to capture them to digital the best that I can.

I'm using the following equipment:

Panasonic NV-SV121EB deck
S-video output
Time Base Corrector ON (seems to help a little)
Digital NR OFF (hope I can do better in software later)

Dazzle Hollywood DV Bridge capture card
(S-video input)


I'm not convinced either of these devices is optimal for the job, and would appreciate advice. It's getting hard to find S-VHS decks at all these days, but if anyone has any suggestions, I'm all ears. One specific problem I have with this deck is that small drop outs aren't always masked in the way that a "HQ" deck ought to (maybe they were on the original tapes and copied over? Maybe I am expecting too much from S-VHS?).

The capture card seems to have some issues. It sometimes drops frames for no apparent reason, and sometimes manages to capture with the fields swapped/shifted! When it works, it's OK - the still pause on the VCR is captured with little moving noise, so it's not introducing a hideous amount itself.

Still, I think I need to find a better capture card before I capture 40+ 3 hour tapes. I've read about people using miniDV camcorders to digitise old tapes - is there a cheap, good model with S-Video input available in the European PAL market? (a lot of our models are/were crippled to remove inputs).

Or should I use something different for the A to D?

All help / suggestions gratefully received.

Cheers,
David.

[yup]

Hi 2Bdecided!

Your VCR NV-SV121EB not very new, analog techinic not very fast as digital but developing. I have small expirience for analog video capture and first time make this in company specialized on digitazing old VHS video which use for this NV-SV121. I only deal with with VHS not S-VHS and result was not very good. After I buy new Panasonic DMR-ES35V and time base corrector CTB-100 and using S video cable I am increase capture quality. Also You could use card which support loseless codec not DV and make noise reduction using Avisynth plugin.
yup.

[2Bdecided]

Thanks yup.

I've watched the output from the VCR on a CRT TV via S-video, and been pleased by the results.

If only I could get a capture card or DVD-R to provide comparable results!

The Panasonic DMR-ES35V isn't S-VHS, is it?

Cheers,
David.

[Guest]

I found Hollywood DV bridge to be useless. It always goofed up AV sync for any reasonable length of capture.

[2Bdecided]

I've come to the same conclusion. It's clipping the highlights too.

I've tried a Sony DVD recorder, and that's even worse: loads of dropped and duplicated frames with TBC on! Wobbly with TBC off.


So I guess it's either a Canpus ADVC-110 or 300, or a DV or Digital8 camcorder. I've heard good reports about all of these.

Question: when capturing to DV, what happens if (when!) the source isn't exactly 25fps? (Analogue can never be exact, right?) Even with a TBC, do you inevitably get dropped/duplicated frames eventually, or does the DV datarate itself change subtly to match the "not quite 25fps" incoming, and keep everything in sync without dropping frames?

Cheers,
David.

[yup]

2Bdecided!
Panasonic DMR-ES35V support only S-VHS Quasi Playback (SQPB) but use new DIGA videoprocessor and give better result for me on VHS tape than old type S-VHS VCR.
yup.

[2Bdecided]

Thanks.

It's true they don't have any S-VHS machines in this range, but it sounds like the processing will be applied to an analogue input from an (S-?)VHS source...

VCR Refresh Dubbing To DVD - Time Base Corrector + 3D Digital Noise Reduction (DNR)

What about your old collection of VHS tapes? When connecting a VCR and DIGA to record VHS videotape images onto a DVD Disc, the Time Base Corrector helps reduce jitter and performs signal conversion to create a stable signal. At the same time, 3D DNR detects and virtually eliminates randomly generated noise and colour irregularities to help minimise flicker. Thanks to these two technologies, the tape input signal is automatically detected and optimum processing is performed to provide an easy way to convert your treasured tape recordings into even more beautiful digital recordings. Of course, Panasonic has two solutions for archiving VHS to DVD without the need for an external VHS VCR. The DMREZ45V and DMREX95V have built-in VHS decks for easy archiving on one machine.

from...

http://www.panasonic.co.uk/technology/dvd-explained.html

This range of DVD recorders starts at a reasonable price - has anyone tried a stand-alone one fed from an S-VHS machine? The above paragraph reads like a bad translation, so it's difficult to be sure.

Cheers,
David.

[yup]

2Bdecided!

I do not use 3D DNR for output, connecting DMR-ES35V with TBC-100 by S-video cable and also connecting to AverMedia 507 capture card by S-Video cable. During capture I use huffyuv loseless codec. I see difference at picture quality (especialy at left border) directly from DMR-ES35V or after TBC-100 using the same S-Video cable. TBC-100 full frame time base corrector, which type TBC inside DMR-ES35V I do not know. After capturing I use motion compensated filter using Avisynth, for me this work better than internal 3D DNR in DMR-ES35V. If use TBC You do not need chromashift plugin. Do not forget about good cable, I use Ixos. Try.
yup.