Easy way to edit in VirtualDub?

[LoXodonte]

Using Virtualdub mod mpeg2 v 1.6.9, and I'm looking for a faster way to cut and export clips. I'm basically capturing 2+ hours worth of Xbox Live sessions, and am looking for an easier way to sort through. Their seems to be no easy way to rewind as fast as you can fast forward. The mousewheel also doesn't seem as responsive when rewinding.

I don't know if the filters are causing it to lag up or what, I'm basically using the avisynth deinterlace to 60fps filter, then cropping out the widescreen black bars. If theirs any tips and tricks you can think of, let me know!

[wonkey_monkey]

Their seems to be no easy way to rewind as fast as you can fast forward. The mousewheel also doesn't seem as responsive when rewinding.

What codec did you use? Unless you're using a keyframe-only codec, like MJPEG, DV, or HuffyUV, codecs are only designed to playback quickly forwards.

David

[LoXodonte]

Its in xvid.

[wonkey_monkey]

That will cause the problem. You'll either have to capture with a keyframe-only codec (which should be equally fast to seek in either direction) or lower the intra-keyframe distance in the Xvid settings to make reverse play quicker.

A keyframe-only codec will also have the advantage that you can cut without re-encoding (you can only cut Xvid easily and without re-encoding at a keyframe).

David

[LoXodonte]

"lower the intra-keyframe distance in the Xvid settings to make reverse play quicker"

Ok, I'll poke around for a setting and see if I can find one.

"you can cut without re-encoding (you can only cut Xvid easily and without re-encoding at a keyframe)"

does this mean I could load an avi clip, cut it however I like, and save individual clips without having to recompress? I would LOVE to know how to do this, as I'm basically saving in Huffyuv at this stage so I won't lose any quality. My HDD would love you for this info. :)

[setarip_old]

Hi!does this mean I could load an avi clip, cut it however I like, and save individual clips without having to recompress?As stated, yes, as long as you cut on a keyframe.


1)Load your original (DivX-compressed or otherwise) .AVI into VirtualDub
2) Set BOTH "Video" and "Audio" to "Direct Stream Copy"
3) Move slider to the starting point of the scene you wish to save
4) From the "Edit" dropdown menu, select "Go to next keyframe"
5) From the "Edit" dropdown menu, select "Set Selection Start"
6) Move slider to the ending point of the scene you wish to save
7) From the "Edit" dropdown menu, select "Go to next keyframe"
8) From the "Edit" dropdown menu, select "Set Selection End'
9) Save with a new filename

[foxyshadis]

huffyuv is actually one of those. Common keyframe-only codecs include huffyuv, lagarith, msu, and ffv1 for lossless, and mjpeg, mjpeg2000, DV, fraps, for lossy. However, by setting keyframe distance - aka gop length - to 1, you can coerce any codec to behave that way, but most of the efficiency of advanced codecs evaporates. (Using a very short distance, like 2-5, is a good compromise if you really need the space. Virtualdub 1.7.2 makes handling these a breeze, with minimal segment re-encoding.)

Of all the lossy codecs, morgan mjpeg2000 is probably the best at any given bitrate, saves a lot compared to mjpeg or i-frame only mpeg4. But the computational power needed is significant.

[LoXodonte]

awesome, thx for the info guys, can't wait to try it out. :thanks:

[LoXodonte]

9) Save with a new filename

Ok, you're gonna think I'm just dumb now. I go through all these steps, but what save option do I choose? If I do save as avi, I don't think it's doing what I think it's should because the file is huge.

Also, do you think I should use morgan mjpeg? Right now I'm capturing with Xvid @ quantinizer 2. The quality is of course just so so, but the file size is pretty darn good.

[setarip_old]

Sounds like you didn't read this step very carefully:

2) Set BOTH "Video" and "Audio" to "Direct Stream Copy" ...

[foxyshadis]

Save in AVI if you're going to use something for editing. It's a pain to use otherwise. Make sure the mode is in Direct stream copy if you're editing and not encoding, otherwise it should be in fast recompress. (Never full processing unless you use virtualdub filters.) For recompress, you have to pick the codec or it'll go to raw.

As for codecs, try out what you can get, you'll figure out really quickly what rocks and what sucks, for your use. =p

[LoXodonte]

Sounds like you didn't read this step very carefully:

No I did, but it started saving a huge copy. I've never done a direct stream before, so I imagine I won't be able to do anything except edit start/stop points, save in segments etc. I can't add filters or anything can I?

My question was in regards to what to do after I did all the steps. I guess if I understood the differences between full compress, direct stream, and fast recompress, I'd be a bit less confused.

[jeffy]

I guess if I understood the differences between full compress, direct stream, and fast recompress, I'd be a bit less confused.

Taken from the Help file available via F1, in VirtualDub 1.7.0.25854, highlighted:
Direct stream copy: In this mode, video frames are copied directly from input to output. No recompression takes place, and thus no quality loss can occur. This is the fastest possible mode for editing video in VirtualDub.

Because the video is not recompressed, video compression imposes restrictions on how the video can be edited.

Fast recompress: Video is decompressed and then recompressed using the desired output codec. VirtualDub automatically chooses a intermediate video format to use between the codecs for quality and speed.

An output video codec must be chosen in this mode.

Slow recompress: Video is decompressed and then recompressed using the desired output codec. This is similar to Fast Recompress except that the input and output formats can be chosen in the Video color depth dialog, and the two can be different, requiring a conversion in between.

If no output video codec is chosen, the video is written to disk uncompressed in the output format.

Full processing mode: All pipeline stages and features are enabled.

[jeffy]

No I did, but it started saving a huge copy.
Could you please tell us some basic facts, such as:
length of the video, filesize, video and audio codecs used (so far, you said "xvid"), resolution, fps.

[LoXodonte]

"Because the video is not recompressed, video compression imposes restrictions on how the video can be edited."

And this would be my question, the limitations of how much I can edit the video using direct stream copy.

See the 2nd sentence of my first post to see how lengthy, and the subject matter of my video clips Jeffy. 2+ hours on average. Filesize, I imagine that would be codec dependent, and I already told you I use xvid with quantinizer 2. Their is no source audio yet. Original resolution would be the popular 720x480 of capture cards. 700x360 after I crop black bars.

I've recorded into vdub with xvid, then use avisynth to split interlaced fields, then the deinterlace smooth filter to resize resolution, then cropping to pull out the black bars. When I'm done, I have 60 fps clips that I've been recompressing into huffyuv to preserve quality, which is just ok at this point. I then take this clips and pull them into sony vegas, and decide which ones I'll put in the video.

[foxyshadis]

The restrictions are entirely related to keyframes. All video has to start on a keyframe (I-frame), if you try to save from a delta frame you get an error. Huffyuv is key-only, so there are no restrictions on editing, whereas xvid isn't by default. And be very wary of b-frames when editing; it's a good idea to just turn them off unless you really need the space. Also, if the default q2 doesn't retain enough quality for you, check out the editing preset (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=119399) which uses EHR, but also gives larger files.

If you use virtualdub 1.7.2, there's a new mode, Smart Rendering, that allows primarily direct copy but will recompress a segment up to the next keyframe if you don't start on a keyframe. There are limitations on that, too, but as long as you have the same codec in the same rough configuration it'll be fine.

[LoXodonte]

OK, but just so I'm clear, if I'm adding filters and cropping, I can NOT use direct stream, I'll have to use Full Processing?

[setarip_old]

That's correct...

[LoXodonte]

one last question! is their a way to auto manage captured file sizes? For example, if I wanted to capture up tell 4.25 gigs, then start a new capture file automatically, could I in vdub?

[setarip_old]

Partial yes - You CAN set VirtualDub's capture to a maximum filesize (or a maximum capture time, if you prefer)...

[LoXodonte]

I created a post asking why my output brightness, contrast, gamma, looks quite different on the final file, then it does when I'm working on it in vegas. It looks much darker outside of vegas. No replies yet, anyone here know?

[foxyshadis]

Don't crosspost into totally unrelated threads. If anyone can help you, they'll see your original post and reply.

[LoXodonte]

well, it's not TOTALLY unrelated. It's for the same movie project. These kind folks were already familiar with the project setup, and were quite helpful with the other issues.

[gameplaya15143]

Just a little note..

Holding the SHIFT button causes vdub to seek to keyframes.

When you are 'rewinding' hold shift to snap to keyframes. Then step forward as normal to get to the exact frame where you want to cut.

Lots faster :cool: