Okay to Encode After Using DGPulldown?

[LiquidLion]

My situation is that I have a pal dvd9 documentary that I want to convert to ntsc. I demuxed it, and encoded the .m2v in procoder express to ntsc, 25fps with no compression. After doing the dgpulldown, I'm going to author it, with the original audio, in TMPGenc DVD Author, and I read that TDA will keep the origianl ac3 5.1 audio instead of compressing it to 2 channel ac3, which is what I want.

After the authoring, I want to encode it with dvd-rb to fit the video on dvd5. Will this "ruin" the dgpulldown at all? After encoding it with dvd-rb, will I have to demux, do dgpulldown, remux, and re-author it?

Thanks!

[jdobbs]

I can't think of a reason why it wouldn't work... but I've never actually tried it. The pulldown flags should be reapplied during REBUILD.

Are you using the freeware of Pro version of DVD-RB? I have a pending trouble report in which someone said TMPGEnc's output causes problems going through DVD-RB on the freeware version (no report on Pro)... I don't know much beyond that except that the report says it only happens on sources authored with TMPEGEnc (never on commercial DVDs or those authored by other packages). For that reason it has stayed pretty low on the priority list (as its up-in-the-air as to whether DVD-RB is even at fault).

[LiquidLion]

I'm using the dvd-rb pro. I'll post back if there are problems with the pro version and TDA.

Thanks!

[jdobbs]

I'd appreciate it. I haven't used TMPGEnc in a long, long time...

[blutach]

Just a point - I think the audio needs transcoding too from 25 fps to 23.976.

Regards

[jptheripper]

no you dont, that is the whole point of using dgpulldown

[blutach]

My mistake. Sorry.

Regards

[LiquidLion]

I neglected to double check if my source is interlaced, and it is. Okay, since I don't know how to use avisynth, I am thinking about using dvd-rb to force reencode (no compression) using the deinterlace option and decomb filter/plugin, demux, then use procoder express to reencode it as 25p pal to 25p ntsc. After which, I will do dgpulldown and author to dvd...put the vobs back into dvd-rb to reencode to dvd5.

Sounds like a good plan?

[manono]

Hi-

Sounds like a good plan?

No. You plan to reencode this thing 3 times? Is it interlaced, or is it just encoded as interlaced, as is true for most PAL DVDs, and the source is really progressive? That is, do you see any interlacing when examining the vobs. Exactly how did you determine it's interlaced? In fact, I have some reservations about this entire project of yours.

[I]I demuxed it, and encoded the .m2v in procoder express to ntsc, 25fps with no compression.

Is there only a semantic distinction here, or perhaps something I don't undertand? I read that as saying you reencoded it for the same size, for 720x480/25fps, and DGPulldowned for 25->29.97, am I right?

I have 2 questions. If it's been reencoded to MPEG-2, isn't that by definition compressed, even if for the same size as the source? And, no offense intended to either DVD-RB or jdobbs, but if you have enough knowledge to do the conversion using Procoder, why didn't you just go ahead and compress it to DVD5 size while you were at it? If you had, you'd be done already, and you'd have better quality than what you're proposing, since the source would have been reencoded only once, rather than twice (or 3 times).

[LiquidLion]

Hi-

Sounds like a good plan?

No. You plan to reencode this thing 3 times? Is it interlaced, or is it just encoded as interlaced, as is true for most PAL DVDs, and the source is really progressive? That is, do you see any interlacing when examining the vobs. Exactly how did you determine it's interlaced? In fact, I have some reservations about this entire project of yours.

[I]I demuxed it, and encoded the .m2v in procoder express to ntsc, 25fps with no compression.

Is there only a semantic distinction here, or perhaps something I don't undertand? I read that as saying you reencoded it for the same size, for 720x480/25fps, and DGPulldowned for 25->29.97, am I right?

I have 2 questions. If it's been reencoded to MPEG-2, isn't that by definition compressed, even if for the same size as the source? And, no offense intended to either DVD-RB or jdobbs, but if you have enough knowledge to do the conversion using Procoder, why didn't you just go ahead and compress it to DVD5 size while you were at it? If you had, you'd be done already, and you'd have better quality than what you're proposing, since the source would have been reencoded only once, rather than twice (or 3 times).

Actually, I already gave up on this endeavor and currently paying a professional to convert the dvd over to ntsc. The dvd is more than worth $$$ he's charging. I'll just stick to dvd backup going forward.

Thanks, guys.

[manono]

Geez, what a waste. I'll bet dollars to donuts that he screws it up, professional or no.

The message I got via e-mail (which you must have edited) said you wanted to keep the DD 5.1 AC3, and Procoder had converted it. The obvious answer for that is not to let Procoder touch the audio, and to mux in the original audio when the MPEG-2 encoding is done. Or demux what Procoder spat out and reauthor with the original AC3 audio.

[LiquidLion]

Geez, what a waste. I'll bet dollars to donuts that he screws it up, professional or no.

The message I got via e-mail (which you must have edited) said you wanted to keep the DD 5.1 AC3, and Procoder had converted it. The obvious answer for that is not to let Procoder touch the audio, and to mux in the original audio when the MPEG-2 encoding is done. Or demux what Procoder spat out and reauthor with the original AC3 audio.

I don't know if he'll screw it up or not, but I don't mind paying thousands to convert the DVD to ntsc, since he came highly recommended from my colleagues and all of them said he works for John at ilm...don't know what ilm is and don't care. And I can you bet you that he won't screw it up because I was given reference to his work in movies and TV. Thanks for the suggestions, though.

[jdobbs]

Wow... for that kinda money I would have made it work in DVD-RB. ;)

[Added] If by "ILM" they are tallking about "Industrial Light & Magic" I'd say there's a decent chance the guy knows a thing or two. That's the Lucasfilm special effects folks.

[manono]

Yeah, there's a chance he knows what to do, maybe a good chance. But being a computer special effects wiz is a far cry from being an expert on standards conversions. There are several people at Doom9 (including me) that could have done it properly for far less, menus and all. Heck, we could have talked you through the process (maybe without menus, though).

And just think, for some of that money jdobbs would have gotten PAL2NTSC going in DVD-RB, something a lot of folks have been requesting.

Anyway, when it's all done, I (and perhaps others) wouldn't mind seeing samples of both the source and the conversion.

Good luck.

[blutach]

Speaking of which manono, how's that guide coming along mate? ;)

Regards

[LiquidLion]

Sorry I didn't get back sooner.

jdobbs, that bug you were referring, I didn't encounter it at all after authoring with tmpgenc dvd author, then using dvd-rb for final encoding with basic filters, so I guess the bug doesn't exist in the pro version.

I'm just going to stick with basic dvd back-ups.

manono, the documentary is over 100 hrs of raw footage taken from a friend of mine (camera guy/naturist). The entire project was financed by myself and a couple of enthusiasts. The dvd I have on hand was a quick slap job by my friend before he can get me the raw source to send to a production house to produce a high-quality dvd.

I'm going to try to learn some avisynth scripts to use in procoder express and see how that goes. Again, thanks for the suggestions!