Changing position DVD title sequence

[Albion]

I have a Commercial DVD.In fact its a Hammer Film called Plague of the Zombies.There are two versions.The only difference being,the position of the opening title sequence.In the US version the titles are essentially in the wrong place.They need to be moved a few minutes forward where in all honesty they belong.This is the GB version.

Unfortunately all releases of this DVD have the titles a little way into the film,when it should be at the end of the opening sequence.

So I am asking is there a way to lift out these titles and drop them in at a later point.This would simply result in a copy of the DVD,but with the opening titles in a different place.

Any guides to this sort of editing? Many thanks in advance.

[blutach]

If they are in their own cell, you can move them around easily with the PGC Editor of PgcEdit (http://www.videohelp.com/~r0lZ/pgcedit/index.html). However, if not, then you will need to cut and move the video. DVD Remake Pro (http://www.dimadsoft.com/dvdremakepro/index.php) is probably the tool of choice here.

But it is very surprising that a commercial DVD would be incorrectly mastered.

Regards

[Albion]

Many thanks blutach.Will search out those programs and any guides.

The films haven't been incorrectly mastered.There are two prints.One for US distribution the other for GB and presumeably Europe.Unfortunately only the US print gets a transfer.

For some odd reason the US print has the title sequence in a different place.From seeing the film (and the only place I,ve seen the GB print is on TV) the most obvious,and natural position is at the end of the opening sequence.

Its a well known debating point regarding this film.

Thanks again

[Albion]

From downloading DVD Remake Pro,it does not seem to be able to precisely edit a particular sequence on a frame basis,which is essential with this task.

There is an indication that VirtualDubMod may be a program that will allow such editing in order to insert into DVD Remake Pro.On to guides and tutorials for VirtualDubMod.

[setarip_old]

There is an indication that VirtualDubMod may be a program that will allow such editing in order to insert into DVD Remake ProNo - VirtualDubMOD's output format is limited only to .AVI (NOT MPEG-2)...

[blutach]

DVD Remake Pro (http://www.dimadsoft.com/dvdremakepro/index.php) can cut on a GOP basis as can VobBlanker (http://jsoto.posunplugged.com/vobblanker.htm).

You might even try DVD Shrink in re-author mode.

Regards

[r0lZ]

Shrink is not frame-accurate neither.

And yes, VirtualDubMod can be used to build a new MPRG-2 stream, by frameserving to an external encoder such as CCE. I use MuxMan to multiplex. It's my preferred method.

The question is: is it really needed? IMO, it's a pitty to have to reencode the video and loose some quality just to be able to do a frame-accurate cut. It's not easy, too. You will also have to cut the audio and regenerate an audio stream. Same for the subpics, if you want to keep them.

Are you sure you cannot loose some frames at the cut point? If it's OK, you could use VobBlanker to do the cut, PgcEdit to reorder the cells and VobBlanker again or FixVTS to clean the VOBs. It's a lot faster and easier.

[goonix]

1. Demux all streams of the main movie and celltimes.txt with PgcDemux.
2. Cuttermaran can edit Mpeg2 on a frame basis. Only the related GOP will be reencoded, so you don't lose the quality of the stream and it is fast.
3. Use MuxMan to mux all streams and set the chapter marks (load celltimes.txt).
4. Replace the modified movie with VobBlanker.

goonix

[Albion]

Everyone.I appreciate your input.All sounds quite complicated for what I thought might be an easy process...quite wrong.

Its clear I will need to read,evaluate and test further to be confident of what I want to do.

goonix... can I ask how complicated is the process you outline,and sorry what is a GOP

[goonix]

For me it is easy. ;)

But if you are new to this DVD stuff, you have to learn something to get familiar with the mentioned tools.
PgcDemux and MuxMan are relatively easy to use.
For Cuttermaran and VobBlanker you can find some good tutorials.

GOP is a Group Of Pictures, containing one I-frame and several P- and B-frames.
The maximum GOP length is 15 frames (PAL) or 18 frames (NTSC).
So the maxium duration of a DVD-GOP is 0.6 sec.

Many tools can cut at an I-frame. But if you need to cut on a different frame (frame precise cut), the GOP have to be splitted into two parts and then reencoded to two smaller but complete GOPs. Cuttermaran (freeware) and Womble (payware) reencode only this splitted GOP. The rest of the stream is untouched. This is fast (a few minutes) and the quality loss at the cuts are not noticeable.

If you use VirtualDubMod for editing, the whole stream have to be reencoded. This needs a long time (several hours) and the quality of the whole stream will be degraded.

goonix

[Albion]

Ah...that is why DVDRemake Pro seemed to select the cutting point for me.

Well I've D/L Pgc Demux and vobBlanker.Now for Muxman and
cuttermaran.
May re-post if I have any particular difficulties?:o

[Albion]

Do I need the audio streams in Cuttermaran.The audio streams are out of sync with visuals by a huge amount.

[goonix]

Here you can find some informations about cuttermaran: http://wiki.cuttermaran.net

Your audio and video streams should be still in sync after demuxing.
For a test you can mux them back and verify.
If they are out of sync now, then check your PgcDemux settings.

goonix

[blutach]

PgcDemux will give the the AV Delay. The max allowable is 300 ms IIRC.

Regards

[Albion]

I just can't get Cuttermaran to work.No matter what settings I use on PGCDemux,the result is the same.After demuxing the NTSC files on the first vob stream, it is 48min long, while the audio is over an hour.As soon as it plays there is huge delay, and we are not talking ms here.More like 10-15 secs and more.

Did manage to D/L mpegVideowizard from Womble.It did everything.I edited all VOB's exactly,but on the monitor and in the export to VIDEO_TS the whole encode stutters terribly.
Strangely the Preview screen was as smooth as anything.

So I am at a loss to know what to next.Any other editors like
Womble that will allow me to edit VOB's and export or something like Cuttermaran that will keep everything together.

Many thanks

:confused:

[Mtz]

You can demux a single vob file with PGCDemux checking the latest options. Than you can import the big vob in Tmpgenc dvd author and make the chapters exactly where you want.
Save the new DVD. Than import both dvd in 2 instances of vobblanker and replace the cells one by one in the desired order. In vobblanker you can save every cell from the dvd made by tmpgenc and use it in replacing from the original dvd. The unwanted cells if more in original dvd must be blanked in vobblanker.

enjoy,
Mtz

[setarip_old]

Hi!on the monitor and in the export to VIDEO_TS the whole encode stutters terribly.Although I'm not personally familiar with the program (They've just come out with "MPEGVideoWizard DVD) I'd ask, have you possibly inadvertently set something within the program to PAL, rather than NTSC?

[setarip_old]

@Mtz

Hi!Than you can import the big vob in Tmpgenc dvd author and make the chapters exactly where you want.1) I presume you're referring to v.2.0, since earlier versions up to and including v.1.6 did not have the ability to cut on any single frame you wish.

2) More importantly to this thread, does v.2.0 support subtitles (Again, all earlier versions do not)?

3) In another thread at these forums, it was indicated that, whether you want/need to or not, v.2.0 automatically transcodes...

[Albion]

Hi!Although I'm not personally familiar with the program (They've just come out with "MPEGVideoWizard DVD) I'd ask, have you possibly inadvertently set something within the program to PAL, rather than NTSC?

I am using the DVD version.
Well,if you right click on the various clips they seem to identify them as NTSC.So I presume the program recognises them as such.
What is more irritating with this program is the fact that I have done everything I wanted to do and more.Each edit is absolutely seamless,and using an effects fade provided by the progarm one transition is marvellous,better than the original edit I was looking for.I feel determined to make this work.Why is it faultless in the preview screen,absolutely no stuttering,yet in the monitor screen and on the DVD export (played via winDVD) it is so bad.There's no sense to it.

Iam also going to try VideoRedo,although it may not be able to do the fade.Does DVDlab pro allow editing of VOB files.I beleive it can encode,but is not forced.

Setarip suggestion about PGCDemux,Tempgenc and VOBblanker is certainly something to try bearing in mind the problem I've had with Cuttermaran.

Albion

[blutach]

I can't believe your vid file and audio files demuxed from PgcDemux were so different. Possibly indicates a real bad mux to begin with.

Maybe post your PgcDemux log.

Regards

[r0lZ]

If the original material is interlaced, the problem of the stuttering might be caused by a bad field dominance. I don't know Cuttermaran nor MPEG Video Wizard (DVD), but you should verify if there is a setup for the order of the fields. Try to swap the fields and redo your work.
I might be totally wrong, too!

BTW, I'll have a look at those programs. Thanks guys for the references!
I have recently bought a standalone DVD recorder with HDD, but the cut/join feature of the recorder is so difficult to use and imprecise that I will need to cut the VOB files on my PC. Currently, I've made some tests with VobBlanker, and it works very well, with some post-processing with PgcEdit. The cut point is only possible on GOPs, but it's sufficient to remove the beginning, the end and the ads from the film.

[Albion]

THE SOLUTION :thanks:

Just wanted to thank everyone for their input and their interest in this thread.For those who may want to do something like this in the future,please read on.

Every post here has played its part in providing the solution that best suited me.So here it is.

The problem with the stuttering was with the encoder on MPEG VIDEO WIZARD.If your editing VOB files as I am DON'T use it.Its not up to the task.I still haven't managed to get to the bottom of the glaringly out of sync issue in Cuttermaran however.

VOB files unencrypted using DVDFab 1.99.As I only needed to edit the first 5 minutes,then I split the film into two disks using DVDFab,making the first disk only about the length of the first VOB file (0.99GB).This obviously cuts down on encoding later on.
VOB file imported into MPEG VIDEO WIZARD.Despite the poor onboard encoder,it is STILL a very good and intuitive editor,with a good PDF help file.

The finished project was then encoded using TMPGEnc 2.5.
Make sure you read the help file on how to set up TMPGEnc with project files used by MPEG VIDEO WIZARD.

The resulting demuxed files were then remuxed using MUXMAN and then burnt to DVD using Nero 6.
The end product is superb,and I have learnt something new.

Again many thanks.

Albion

[blutach]

Glad to hear it worked out for you.

Regards