Should we still be using LAME VBR or ABR ?

[Darksoul71]

Hi folks !

Have you read the actual VDub news ?
There´s written that Nandub actually "screws up" an AVI if you add VBR/ABR MP3 files encoded by
Nandub. No question that VBR works fine for the most of us but Lee Avery points out that this way encoded
AVIs have two serious problems:

1) They screw up if you open and resave them in another AVI editor than Nandub. (Just think of remerging for playback) That seems no big deal but they´re just "messed up".
2) Only direct show based players are able to handle VBR MP3 during playback. Else there´s async Audio and Video. So this might mess up compatibility for some players/OS in near future.

My conclusion:
I´ll either switch back to the (unfortunately illegal) hacked Radium MP3 codec or only use CBR MP3s encoded with LAME and add a wave header using this MP3 wave tool from doom9´s page. So I can mux my DivX 4.11 encoded AVI with a MP3 audio stream in Virtual Dub.

What do you think ?

-D$

[MxxCon]

from what i understand there is no "right" way to mux mp3 into avi unless it's cbr.
but whatever the case, why would you want to use radium codec? it's nothing more than hacked FhG's old codec to make it faster..new LAME with good presets make better quality and smaller size..

[MaTTeR]

Originally posted by MxxCon
from what i understand there is no "right" way to mux mp3 into avi unless it's cbr.
but whatever the case, why would you want to use radium codec? it's nothing more than hacked FhG's old codec to make it faster..new LAME with good presets make better quality and smaller size..

Sounds good to me. No way I'll stop using LAME. I've had VBR issues in AVI files but they are rare. The solution for me is to encode the track with LAME CBR if I have to. At the momement the alt presets just rock though and 8 times out of 10 you'll most likely not see a problem during playback. Just my 2 cents.

[pacohaas]

I've done over 100 movies all with LAME VBR mp3 audio muxed with Nandub and have had zero playback problems.

solution to the first "serious problem": use nandub

about the second problem, most, players use direct show filters to play the audio back so it's not really much of a problem.

[BigKing]

My Rips that I've made with DivX 4.11 under XP play just fine in wmp8, but when I try to use the playa, the audio is all out of sync.
Should I use CBR or ABR?

[Doom9]

bigking: cbr.... vbr is more for the wmp junkies like me

[MaTTeR]

Originally posted by BigKing
My Rips that I've made with DivX 4.11 under XP play just fine in wmp8, but when I try to use the playa, the audio is all out of sync.
Should I use CBR or ABR?

Try BSplayer, GDivX or ZoomPlayer and you shouldn't have the sync issues. WiMP and Playa seem to have issues IMO.

Using ABR or CBR has nothing to do with the sync problems. Since you ask though, ABR seems to be providing really nice quality for Divx rips. Look into using the --alt-preset standard or --alt-preset normal.

[JoaCHIP]

The answer is very simple. Putting VBR audio of any kind is outside the AVI specifications!

I wish there were more information out there to explain this issue, but as the author of Vidomi says here "The technique used to insert VBR and ABR audio is a total hack. It's amazing it works at all." -- http://www.vidomi.com/viewtopic.php?topic=2424&forum=6

Generally people are discussing it here and there. Here's a guy who seems to know why this hack is so bad: http://virtualdubmod.sourceforge.net/?page=irclog

Finally, as Avery Lee (author of VirtualDub himself) points out:"First, DirectShow's buffering does not seem to react very quickly to VBR audio, and if you have high variance in the audio stream, it can cause the video playback to suddenly speed up or slow down. Second, neither DirectShow nor AVIFile will write out an audio stream in this way, so nearly any other program will trash the AVI file when it's rewritten." -- From Virtualdub news update 02/Dec/2001So when you guys are saying "it works on my computer", please consider that it might not work in the future if you upgrade your systems or get a new computer or media player. So my advice is: Use CBR audio for AVI files!!!

[Bruce Willis]

you can use Avimux :)

[Darksoul71]

@JoaCHIP: Thanks for your answer but have you had a look at the date of my first posting ? Nearly 3 Years ago....

-D$

[KpeX]

Yup this is all old info - VBR MP3 can be made to work in AVI and in non-DS players (see mplayer or any libavcodec -based player, as well as most mpeg-4 standalones afaik).

However the last thing we need is another flame war on whether it's a hack in AVI or not. There are newer containers that better handle VBR audio, and AVI still works in most cases if you use a good muxing tool. Therefore I'll close this thread now.