Blu-Ray and HD-DVD Ripping Tools?

[johner23]

Seeing that link above, I wonder if somebody, in a near future, will be able to create some program which can defeat the protection mechanism about Blu-Ray and HD-DVD technologies.

--> http://www.heise-security.co.uk/news/75103

Does anybody knows any program that can handle such thing nowadays?

Or, if some programmer like Anydvd's or DVD Region Free's will be able to create similar softwares, but instead to work with dvd's, can handle Blu-Ray or HD-DVD discs.

And, at final question, do you know HOW the new protection about Blu-Ray or HD-DVD's works and their weak / strong points?

Thanks

[nwg]

I am no expert in HD but, it doesn't look like protection has been cracked at all.

When a HD-DVD or Blu Ray disc is played. HDCP is sent along with the picture that encrypts the signal. The display then has to decrypt the HDCP before the picture can be shown. This can be a TV, projector or even a computer monitor.

So, all the person has done is captured a screenshot just like it is already done with DVD and DVD player software.

Somone will correct me if I am totally wrong.

[crypto]

So, all the person has done is captured a screenshot just like it is already done with DVD and DVD player software.

Somone will correct me if I am totally wrong.

That's exactly what has been done. I don't understand the fuzz about this. Its a typical nessy summer story. Screenshot can only be taken from the decoded signal. So this is an analog copy. The individual images have to be encoded again.

[nwg]

That's exactly what has been done. I don't understand the fuzz about this. Its a typical nessy summer story. Screenshot can only be taken from the decoded signal. So this is an analog copy. The individual images have to be encoded again.

Thanks, so I was right.

[hoozdapimp]

That's exactly what has been done. I don't understand the fuzz about this. Its a typical nessy summer story. Screenshot can only be taken from the decoded signal. So this is an analog copy. The individual images have to be encoded again.

I was under the impression that the screenshots taken are just raw images of a single frame of the movie in an unencrypted format. Once all of the frames are put together, they can then be (at least somewhat easily) re-encoded.

I think the term analog is somewhat misleading...it's a raw capture, not some lesser quality capture.

Brings back memories of FlaskMpeg and all the horror I first experienced when ripping DVD's to DivX (low or high motion) 3.11....

[nwg]

I wouldn't want to try to recreate a film frame by frame especially one in HD.

[johner23]

AACS has not yet been cracked

1) Can anyone explain more carefully about that kind of protection and how does it work-protect the discs?

2) Any chance to create some ripper to decrypt HDVD/ HDTV discs which use that kind of protections? Such a kind of "DeAACS" or something like that? ;)

Or that kind of system recquires other ways that are different from dvd's?

3) DVD Rip Guard and Sony Arccos protections could be defeated several times and at least, each month we have some updates for that protections.

Can AACS (once cracked), be updated in such short time, similar dvd protections?

EDITED:

--> http://www.aacsla.com/home

--> http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htf/showthread.php?t=216645

--> http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20050810-5194.html ( very old, but explaining some details )

--> http://www.afterdawn.com/glossary/terms/bdplus.cfm

--> http://www.cdrinfo.com/Sections/News/Details.aspx?NewsId=15046

--> http://www.afterdawn.com/glossary/terms/rom_mark.cfm

--> http://www.hdbeat.com/2005/10/05/how-rom-mark-works/

More informations about the subject are welcome. :)

Thanks

[linx05]

I know DVD Jon has registered the website deaacs. I read that on a wiki. Good luck to him I say.

To the older members here, did everyone think the protections in DVDs (when they first came about) could not be broken? Was it the same feeling as we all have now about AACS?

[happycase]

Managed Copy should make "ripping tools" unnecessary. Unless you're a pirate, that is.

[lucindrea]

Or that kind of system recquires other ways that are different from dvd's?

3) DVD Rip Guard and Sony Arccos protections could be defeated several times and at least, each month we have some updates for that protections.

Can AACS (once cracked), be updated in such short time, similar dvd protections?


here is where i see the problem ... MOST setop players and computer dvd's were standarized before encryption was the norm , so their was only so much that could be done without requireing everyone to go out and buy a new player ..

with blue ray and Hd the players are still semi-nonstandard .. so encryption can be made as such that it can be part of the hardware , think dreamcast game disks , only 1 player could ever read the disks. With dreamcasts you need a special cable hooked directly to the orginal hardware to get any data , the same may end up happening with the blue and HD disks ,
ie. a screen capture frame by frame that gets re-encoded.

[johner23]

so encryption can be made as such that it can be part of the hardware , think dreamcast game disks , only 1 player could ever read the disks

Oh, dear God... :rolleyes:

It's possible that we need to change the chips or whatever to play the hardware properly, like many does using PS 1/2, Dreamscat, X-Box and other consoles?

And more: some kind of emulation will be necessary?

I know that in some programs, specially those which are more professional and expensive, many people must to "crack" the hardware too, not only the software itself.

And such ones sometimes use a kind of dongles to protect the program to be run without the original donle/licence.

Yes, yes, some people can be able to crack the dongles too, but the effort fot it is harder. ;(

Well, when these formats become more popular and stable, they will need to create some system that have compatibility with many hardware and player around the world.

Maybe after that, someone could create some physical/logical device which can defeat that system...

At this moment, nothing about rippers or similar things, right?

Thanks

[happycase]

No, no rippers.

[StonedJuggalo]

Well, I'm sure when the market catches up and they start pumping out BR blank media, or something similar, someone will come up with a good ripper for them. I remember when arccos was considered the 'uncrackable' protection (for about a month or two).

And now here we are, able to backup pretty much any DVD, regardless of production company, and redardless of protection. Even a few versions of arccos later. It'll happen.

If you build it, someone will copy it. :D

[check]

Managed Copy should make "ripping tools" unnecessary. Unless you're a pirate, that is.
I would hope this to be true - but there will unfortunately be no guarantee that 'managed copy' will be anything like what the name suggests, and even the name does not sound all that great.

[Doom9]

Forget about managed copy giving you the right to make a DivX backup.. it ain't gonna happen. And as far as the encryption goes, they've learned.. whether it'll be enough remains to be seen. Even if the algorithms are proven to be secure (meaning they are available for the academic community to try and crack them... security through obscurity just doesn't work for encryption), a bad implementation still would undo everything.. and if you remember dodsrip and decss, what made those tools possible was an improperly secured implementation of CSS.. only later did people discover that CSS was unsafe.

[hellgauss]

When someone claims that an algorithm is 'broken', it should always say under what condiction.

CSS was a very weak algorithm. It use only 40bits, so it is weak also in a brute force attack. Also someone find how to crack it with a faster attack, which costs only a few seconds on a standard machine. I don't know if rippers like dvddecrypter, vstrip, smartripper, ecc use this attack or they simple have a 'key' to manage css contents.


AACS is a lot stronger than css.
1)It use an unbreakable algorthm to encrypt key (elliptic curves, if i remember well, for keys, and aes for crypting contents).
2)It has a very well structured mechanism for removing 'corrupted keys'. This means that if a player key become public it can be easily removed from future discs.

This not means that aacs will be unbreakable. I think that it will be very easy for hackers to disassmble a software player and get a key. Remember that if you can see the video, you also have the key somewhere.This key can be used to decrypt data.
I think there will be one of these two scenarios:

1)Someone will create an application to break the movie knowing the player key. Keys will be distribuited over p2p network, so if a player key becomes corrupted, someone will distribute the new key. This will allow a rip very similar to the dvddecrypter one.
2)Encrypted data will be sent directly to the GPU. This will allow the possibility to emulate a player and see video, but you will not have acces to the compressed data. It will be very difficult to recompress these streams, expecially if you use hdmi.

I read somewhere (maybe on doom9? :) ) that aacs is not about stop piracy. It's about have control over player. Only authorized player can access contents.

[SeeMoreDigital]

I guess once dedicated software players are developed to play store bought (ie: encrypted) Blu-ray and HD-DVD disc's, there will be some brain boxes out there who might be able to track down how the software player de-crypts the disc while it's being played... And emulate this function for use with other applications!

But I guess I'm over simplifying matters... :D