Slightly Oversized

[dialysis1]

I seem to be having a problem backing up the movie Alien 3. It keeps coming out slightly oversized. PgcEdit says it's 101.7%. Dvd Shrink says compression at 97.7%. I tried it twice with the same results. I even ran the oversized files through again. I am using Dvd-Rb 1.09.3 with the HC encoder set at best setting. Matrix is at encoder default. All my backups have always been fine. No changes have been made to the program. Is there any information that I can provide so I can solve this?

[rahzel]

the output size is never consistant, it varies with every movie. it varies, but not by much, id say around 10mb or so.

i'm guessing you changed the default setting, and used the "TargetSectors" option. if so, this is your problem. either find a lower, safe number, or just use the defaults to avoid oversize. using the default, you should never go over.

btw, DVDShrink's default is 4464mb, and a DVD+R holds 4482 and a DVD-R holds 4489mb.

[jdobbs]

Note to everyone:

Please don't change your TargetSectors from the default to a higher value and then post saying you "oversized".... It isn't "oversizing" -- it is doing exactly what you are telling it to do. This kind of problem falls into the category of "self inflicted injury".

[dialysis1]

I haven't changed a thing. All my backups have always been good.Here's the rebuilder log when I tried to redo the oversized ones:


[03:58:26] Phase I, PREPARATION started.
- HC encoder selected
- "Movie Only" mode is enabled.
- VTS_01: 2,307,792 sectors.
-- Scanning and writing .D2V & .AVS files
-- Processed 165,257 frames.
-- Building .AVS and .ECL files
- Reduction Level for DVD-5: 96.6%
- Overall Bitrate : 6,040/4,832Kbs
- Space for Video : 4,065,654KB
- HIGH/LOW/TYPICAL Bitrates: 7,856/400/4,832 Kbs
[04:02:59] Phase I, PREPARATION completed in 4 minutes.
[04:06:50] Phase II ENCODING started
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 0
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 1
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 2
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 3
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 4
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 5
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 6
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 7
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 8
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 9
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 10
- Extracting STILLS for VTS_01 segment 11
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 12
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 13
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 14
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 15
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 16
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 17
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 18
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 19
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 20
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 21
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 22
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 23
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 24
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 25
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 26
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 27
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 28
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 29
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 30
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 31
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 32
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 33
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 34
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 35
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 36
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 37
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 38
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 39
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 40
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 41
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 42
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 43
- Extracting STILLS for VTS_01 segment 44
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 45
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 46
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 47
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 48
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 49
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 50
- Creating M2V for VTS_01 segment 51
- Extracting STILLS for VTS_01 segment 52
[09:07:36] Phase II ENCODING completed in 301 minutes.
[11:55:12] Phase III, REBUILD started.
- Processing VTS_01
- Reading/processing TMAP table...
- Rebuilding seg 0 VOBID 1 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 1 VOBID 1 CELLID 2
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_01
- Rebuilding seg 2 VOBID 2 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 3 VOBID 2 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 4 VOBID 2 CELLID 3
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_02
- Rebuilding seg 5 VOBID 3 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 6 VOBID 3 CELLID 2
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_03
- Rebuilding seg 7 VOBID 4 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 8 VOBID 4 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 9 VOBID 4 CELLID 3
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_04
- Rebuilding seg 10 VOBID 5 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 11 VOBID 5 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 12 VOBID 5 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 13 VOBID 5 CELLID 2
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_05
- Rebuilding seg 14 VOBID 6 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 15 VOBID 6 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 16 VOBID 6 CELLID 3
- Rebuilding seg 17 VOBID 6 CELLID 3
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_06
- Rebuilding seg 18 VOBID 7 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 19 VOBID 7 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 20 VOBID 7 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 21 VOBID 7 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 22 VOBID 7 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 23 VOBID 7 CELLID 3
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_07
- Rebuilding seg 24 VOBID 8 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 25 VOBID 8 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 26 VOBID 8 CELLID 3
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_08
- Rebuilding seg 27 VOBID 9 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 28 VOBID 9 CELLID 2
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_09
- Rebuilding seg 29 VOBID 10 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 30 VOBID 10 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 31 VOBID 10 CELLID 3
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_10
- Rebuilding seg 32 VOBID 11 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 33 VOBID 11 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 34 VOBID 11 CELLID 2
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_11
- Rebuilding seg 35 VOBID 12 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 36 VOBID 12 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 37 VOBID 12 CELLID 3
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_12
- Rebuilding seg 38 VOBID 13 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 39 VOBID 13 CELLID 2
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_13
- Rebuilding seg 40 VOBID 14 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 41 VOBID 14 CELLID 2
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_14
- Rebuilding seg 42 VOBID 15 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 43 VOBID 15 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 44 VOBID 15 CELLID 3
- Rebuilding seg 45 VOBID 15 CELLID 3
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_15
- Rebuilding seg 46 VOBID 16 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 47 VOBID 16 CELLID 2
- Rebuilding seg 48 VOBID 16 CELLID 3
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_16
- Rebuilding seg 49 VOBID 17 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 50 VOBID 17 CELLID 1
- Rebuilding seg 51 VOBID 17 CELLID 2
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_17
- Rebuilding seg 52 VOBID 18 CELLID 1
- Updating NAVPACKS for VOBID_18
- Updated VTS_C_ADT.
- Updated VTS_VOBU_ADMAP.
- Updated IFO: VTS_01_0.IFO
- Correcting VTS Sectors...
[12:15:22] Phase III, REBUILD completed in 20 minutes.

[jdobbs]

Please post your REBUILDER.INI file.

In over 900 discs processed I have never had a single oversized disc using the default settings...

Are you using Pro or Freeware?

[dialysis1]

Here's my Rebuilder.ini file"

[Options]
Mode=5
OneClick=0
ReduceOpt=0
NoWarn=1
AdditionalOutput=1
LogFile=1
QuEncHQ=1
EncoderMinimized=1
RemoveDTS=1
HC_Quality=3
HC_Matrix=1
SkinVersion=12
Skin=Rockas Original
AudioDub=1
QuEncodeType=0
iDCT=0
GOP=0
DCPrec=0
MainMatrix=Encoder Default
LowMatrix=Same as Main Feature
VLowMatrix=Same as Main Feature
ExtraMatrix=6-Medium_Low(2500-3200)
ProCoder_Quality=4
DVD_Label=NO_SELECTION
DVD_Name=NO_SELECTION.ISO
MovieOnly=1
HalfD1=0
Convert_16_9=0
DisableInterlace=0
ConvertToYUY2=1
ISO_Output=0
Completed=50
HC_VBR_Bias=20
Encode_Processes=1
ISO_Delete_Option=1
Decrypter_Write=0
Delete_Image_Option=0
HC_OPV=0
QuEncScene=1
CCE=1
AutoQMatAQM=1
[Paths]
QuEnc=C:\Program Files\DVD-RB PRO\Encoders\QuEnc\QuEnc.exe
ReJig=C:\Program Files\DVD-RB PRO\Encoders\ReJig\ReJig.exe
HC=C:\Program Files\DVD-RB PRO\Encoders\HC Encoder\HCbatch.EXE
ProCoder=C:\Program Files\DVD-RB PRO\Encoders\EclPro\EclPro.exe
DECOMB=C:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\Decomb521.dll
MPEG2DEC=C:\Program Files\DVD-RB PRO\DGDecode.dll
Working=C:\
Output=D:\
Source=
CCEBasic=C:\Program Files\AutoQMatEnc\AutoQMatEnc.exe
CCENEW=C:\Program Files\AutoQMatEnc\AutoQMatEnc.exe
CCE250=C:\Program Files\AutoQMatEnc\AutoQMatEnc.exe
[Audio]
Remapping=
Selected=
[Subpictures]
Selected=
[Setup]
Languages=1111111111111111111111110111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
sLanguages=1111111111111111111111110111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
[CCEOptions]
VBR_bias=25
Quality_prec=16
eclPasses=3
[AutoQMatOptions]
VBR_bias=25
Quality_prec=16
eclPasses=2

[rahzel]

what movie did you do, and what size is the output?

[dialysis1]

Well I tried the movie again. Re-ripped the movie and let it run overnight. It still comes out to 4.40 gb. I'm currently trying another movie with the same settings.

[jdobbs]

Hmmm... your INI file look fine. It must be something peculiar about that one disc. I'll try it. Which version of Alien 3 is it (Standard, Collectors Edition, or Quadrilogy)? In the mean time you might try adding this to the [Options] area of the INI file:

TargetSectors=2220000

That will lower the target size and should make this one fit.

[laserfan]

I guess I will add here a shameless plug for my "Wish List" request that Rebuilder's log contain the source path & original name. Would also be nice to show the original source size if possible...

p.s. Heck, while you're at it jdobbs, why not include too the target sector size in the log. Would sure help dontcha think given all the many new threads that pop-up on this issue? Would leave no question either, later, about what the ini's setting was when the backup was made.

[dialysis1]

It's just Alien 3 widescreen. No special edition. After the movie that I'm doing now, I will try again. I don't know if this has anything to do with the problem but the first audio is 2ch and I ckose instead the second audio which is 6ch. I'm thinking of trying it with 2ch.

[dialysis1]

Okay, I just finished doing White Noise. I chose this movie because it's a 1hr 38min movie that requires quite a bit of compression. Everything is fine! The movie size is 4.31gb which is where it should be so I'm guessing that it's something with the movie. Never had this problem before. I've used Dvd Rebuilder on over 100 movies.
I did noticed something though. On White Noise, the log file states that it updated NAVPACKS twice while on Alien 3 as you can see above that this happened many times.
Hmmmm.

[dialysis1]

Just finished the movie again. This time I chose the 2ch audio. The movie is now bigger than before. It is now 4.41gb.

[jdobbs]

Whatever the problem is it seems to be just happening on your computer or just on the disc you are trying to encode... What version of HC Encoder are you using? Maybe a change could make a difference?

[dialysis1]

I've been using HC .18 since it was released. It seems to happen only on this movie. I'm going to try QuEnc.

[jdobbs]

You may want to try HC v0.17 to see if it is something that changed on this version.

[dialysis1]

I just finished the movie using QuEnc 0.7.0.0. The movie size is 4.28gb which leads me to agree that it's the encoder. I will try tonight with HC 0.17.

[dialysis1]

jdobbs, you were right! How did you know? I just finished the movie with HC 0.17. It came out great! Movie size is 4.31gb.
I noticed that with HC 0.18 I was getting about 10 underflows every second pass and with ver. 0.17 there were none. In my searching some were saying that it's nothing to worry about as long as the encoder fixes it. Could these underflows be the cause of the increased file size?
Anyway, thank you so much for your help in tracking down this problem. I knew that if any one could figure this out, it would be you.
Once again, thank you.

[Boulder]

The underflows don't cause the oversizing, it just means that the encoder will encode those certain GOPs with a higher quantizer so that the bitrate will be lower there.

I wonder if hank315 (the author of HC) has been notified of this oversizing behaviour?