Annoying color problems with DVD source

[hayai]

I'm having some annoying problems with color when processing DVD source, in this case Two Towers. In the first two examples:
http://members.cox.net/hayai2/example1.png
http://members.cox.net/hayai2/example2.png
right after a scene change, the color from the previous frame is still present. And in the third example:
http://members.cox.net/hayai2/example3.png
the color in the frame is shifted slightly from where it should be. I've been looking for a solution to this problem but I've not found any references to it and I'm not sure where to look. This is the AVS script I'm using:

MPEG2Source("C:\Documents and Settings\Adam\Desktop\Video Encoding\new project\tt.d2v")
crop(2,58,-2,-62)
Telecide(Guide=1)
Decimate(Cycle=5)

I've tried more sophisticated methods of deinterlacing to no effect. Any help would be appreciated.

[Lil' Jer]

First of all, why are you doing an IVTC on a fully-progressive source?

[hayai]

It's interlaced
http://members.cox.net/hayai2/example4.png
therefore, not progressive.

[Lil' Jer]

It's interlaced
http://members.cox.net/hayai2/example4.png
therefore, not progressive.

I own both the US and UK versions of the movies and they aren't interlaced... What version do you own that is? Secondly, the artifacts you see look like they are due to bad matching due to your unnecessary IVTC.

[Lil' Jer]

It's interlaced
http://members.cox.net/hayai2/example4.png
therefore, not progressive.

Looks like you didn't do force film when you used DGIndex. Theatrical movies such as this are soft-telecined and you probably had the "honor pulldown flags" option selected which resulted in it being that way. So recreate the d2v file with forced film option selected and then load it and see if you get the artifacts still.

[hayai]

This is the R1 Extended edition.

EDIT: You're correct, force FILM produces progressive output. Thanks.

[Lil' Jer]

This is the R1 Extended edition.

Which isn't interlaced... Do what I said in the previous post and eliminate the Telecide and Decimate lines in your script and see if the artifacts are still there.

[Mug Funky]

and just in case you come up with a similar problem with another (hard-telecine, or FILM with pattern breaks) source, try cropping after telecide, rather than the other way around. chroma sampling is a strange beast that doesn't like to be prematurely cropped :)

[edit] to clarify, chroma field-order will be swapped if you crop by anything but mod 4 numbers. although avisynth will allow mod2 cropping on interlaced YV12, it really isn't something you should do, especially when running field-order sensitive operations like IVTC.

[Lil' Jer]

and just in case you come up with a similar problem with another (hard-telecine, or FILM with pattern breaks) source, try cropping after telecide, rather than the other way around. chroma sampling is a strange beast that doesn't like to be prematurely cropped :)

[edit] to clarify, chroma field-order will be swapped if you crop by anything but mod 4 numbers. although avisynth will allow mod2 cropping on interlaced YV12, it really isn't something you should do, especially when running field-order sensitive operations like IVTC.

Especially unnecessary IVTCs on a fully-progressive source. :p

[manono]

But it's a good point, Mug. His color bleeding problems were definitely caused by cropping the height by Mod2. The Crop page at AviSynth.org is quite clear about it:
In order to preserve the data structure of the different colorspaces, the following mods should be used. You will not get an error message if they are not obeyed, but it may create strange artifacts.
.
.
height mod-4 if video is interlaced
http://www.avisynth.org/Crop

So, if he wanted to keep those crop values, he should have cropped after the IVTC, when the video would have been progressive again.

[Oline 61]

I had the same problem with LoTR, but no matter what I cropped by, I got problems. I just gave up and cropped after Telecide/Decimate. I tried Force Film, but it left 2 interlaced frames in it's output. I have found that when all methods of IVTC using DGIndex or AviSynth fail, Mencoders -vf pullup,softskip with a -ofps 24000/1001 produces pure artifact free progressive 23.976 fps output. On problematic DVD's I transcode to FFVHUFF lossless with Mencoder and then use AviSynth to feed that into x264.

[Mug Funky]

you could probably cut out a lot of time and HDD space by piping the output of mencoder to x264... does x264 do stdin?

[Oline 61]

Not sure about stdin in x264. I tried piping on my Linux system, but my x264 compile was unable to produce a good stream. I may recompile and try again. This is not something I regularly do (the file came out to 41.4GB ouch!), but only for movies that I cannot IVTC any other way.