cutting/trimming MPEG2 w/ VDubmod (and saving w/o recompress) - why doesnt it work ?

[Flexy]

i have the following problem:

I load a VOB or a MPG file from a CD and i want to cut out certain parts, like 1-800 ads etc. and re-save the file. I do NOT want to recompress or whatsoever.

The funny thing is i found a little tool called "chopper XP" which allows exactly this, although the usage is a bit weird. I can specify in/out points and cut off parts and save back the whole VOB.

Why cant i do the same in VDUpMod ?

If i load the file in VDUPMod and then want to save it back it either tells me "source video uses compression which is not compatible with avi files"...or similiar...i just dont understand why i just simply cant cut/trim a video (MPEG2 in this case) and then just save it back without recompress.

[mod]

If I can remember VDubMod only outputs .avi .ogm and .mkv

If ChopperXp works good for you, just keep using it ;)

[Dmitry Vergheles]

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=95398

[CWR03]

Cuttermaran is a very easy-to-use MPEG-2 editor, does so without re-rendering, and it's free.

[Adub]

You can also frameserve it to CCE or TMPGENC. I know that it will be considered recompressing, but set all settings to high or maximum and you won't notice a difference.

[FredThompson]

Use TyTool. It will let you edit at the field level and only re-encodes those GOPs which are edited.

Other free-for-use tools cut at the GOP point and don't properly resolve the cross-GOP links of open GOP streams.

[TakuSkan]

Use TyTool. It will let you edit at the field level and only re-encodes those GOPs which are edited..Could someone provide a URL where TyTool can be downloaded?

Thx,

TS

[FredThompson]

http://www.dealdatabase.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=48

Major release 10r1 is coming soon.

[TakuSkan]

http://www.dealdatabase.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=48Thanks... I'll try it out.

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Edit: TyTool doesn't open MPEG-2 files directly for editing that I can see. I need a simple interface like VirtualDubMod.
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I just got a Hauppauge WinTV PVR150 capture card and am trying it out to see if it's going to work well for capturing TV, VCR and S-Video inputs. Am not quite sure if it's the best bang for the $$ @ $75US. My old ATI All-In-Wonder 128 wasn't able to capture more than 320x240 on my old Athlon 800 T-Bird based system, so the Hauppauge is a step up to 720x480 with its hardware encoder.

I was going to try editing with VirtualDubMod, but I wasn't able to figure out whether or not it could be made to edit and save MPEG-2 encoded captures. Any advise there would be appreciated.

I tried Cuttermaran mentioned above, but had a lot of problems getting it off the ground, Still have a LOT of homework to do on all of this.

Thx

TS.

[Flexy]

i have to try those tools, but the few tools i saw are VERY basic and often only allow to select a section and save it. Not even deleting several pieces etc....so....they dont even deserve the term "editing". (Rather "cut ONE piece out")

If you want real editing you might want to consider a real NLE video editing program, i use Sony Vegas. Then you can edit, cut and everything you want.

Just re-encode the movie then in whatever format you want.

[FredThompson]

Oh, I dunno, maybe the initial poster meant what was posted and converting to RGB then re-encoding the whole thing isn't desired...

[FredThompson]

OK, so that was a little harsh given you're fairly new here. The initial poster asked for something specific. Vegas doesn't match the request.

[FredThompson]

Use the keyfile generation command in the File menu on your MPEG2 source then you can edit. Once you have created the list of sections to remove, use one of the multiplexing options in the File menu. You'll have to invest a little bit of time to learn the interface, just like any other program. I can remove the commercials from a 1-hour recording in less than 2 minutes with this. You'll have similar results when you're used to it. The interface isn't pretty, it's designed for speed.

[TakuSkan]

i have to try those tools, but the few tools i saw are VERY basic and often only allow to select a section and save it. Not even deleting several pieces etc....so....they dont even deserve the term "editing".Well... VirtualDubMod (this is the forum for that) does all of that fantastically. It just doesn't seem to have the ability to cut & patch pieces together quickly without re-writing the entire file. It saves to AVIs by default. I'm not sure if there's a free MPEG-2 encoding codec that can be installed to enable writing MPEG-2 files in VBM.

If you want real editing you might want to consider a real NLE video editing program, i use Sony Vegas.Well than there's Adobe Premiere that's both expensive, and works wonderfully.

But I'm just looking for something small and quick like VirtualDubMod. There's an editor that came with my Hauppauge called nanoPEG Editor that can process can write an edited version of a 60 minute, 3GB MPEG-2 file in just a little over 5 minutes on my old system. Great... but the interface isn't all that great..

TS

[FredThompson]

Use TyTool. Set the local dir then set hte output dir in the options menu, generate keyfile, edit (left hand on arrows, right hand on mouse unless you're a leftie.) use the help menu. exit the editor, saving defined sections to cut, mux. simple, quick, free, virtually lossless and the most robust method. You should have it mastered in 5 minutes.

Vegas, Premiere, VirtualDub flavors, etc., etc., etc. all convert the color model to RGB then force you to re-encode the entire thing. Again, invest 5 minutes and learn the TyTool interface. You'll be glad you did.

[midnightsun]

I use cuttermaran for this task. You need an encoder for it to work (it re-encodes the portion of the GOP where the cut is placed if you don't cut on a GOP boundary, but leaves the rest of the file untouched, giving you frame-accurate cutting). You can use HC (which is free) as the encoder, else if you already have tmpgenc, it uses that by default. It takes care of audio too, just keep in mind that an audio frame (whether you are a PAL or NTSC user) is generally of different duration than a video frame, so you may end up very slightly off-sync. However, if you are working on PAL material it's very easy to keep it in sync, since 4 video frames=5 ac3 frames, and 3 video frames=5 mp2 frames (PCM is no problem of course).

Give it a try :)

[FredThompson]

Again, use TyTool. This task requires operating below the frame level, including custom muxing. HC is a great encoder but not suited for this task until hank adds lower-level control.

[mod]

The funny thing is i found a little tool called "chopper XP" which allows exactly this, although the usage is a bit weird. I can specify in/out points and cut off parts and save back the whole VOB.

Why cannot he simply use ChopperXP? WHY?? :)

Is because of this?

although the usage is a bit weird

:eek: 'cmon..

[FredThompson]

The homepage for ChopperXp says it's discontinued and this can't be true unless it only cuts at I-frames and doens't resolve open GOP links: Preserves 100% quality (no recompression)

[TakuSkan]

Use TyTool. Set the local dir then set hte output dir in the options menu, generate keyfile, edit (left hand on arrows, right hand on mouse unless you're a leftie.) use the help menu. exit the editor, saving defined sections to cut, mux. simple, quick, free, virtually lossless and the most robust method. You should have it mastered in 5 minutes.Okay... I'm getting the hang of it. It does perform well. I like the variable forward and backwards playback. The video display is pretty funky... and it'd be nice to have a longer scroll bar to drag through the video more like VirtualDubMod.

Is there anything like this that can do the same for AVI files? I'd like to be able to quickly splice together a few AVIs encoded with XVid. Or are they an entirely different breed of video that precludes such editing? That's what I've been heard at this point.

The homepage for ChopperXp says it's discontinued ...I couldn't find it anywhere either.

How about the product Dmitry Vergheles mentioned above:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.p...newpost&t=95398

Its Elecard XMuxer Pro v1.1, and is available here. (http://www.elecard.com/products/product.php?product_id=156) I may give it a try.

TS

[FredThompson]

The main TyTool display is I-frames. You drop to the field display for positioning within GOPs. The display looks odd because it's line-doubled fields. Remember, this is editing at the field level, not the frame level. With TyTool, you mark the actual points inclusive for the removal. VirtualDub's end point is exclusive. TyTool works with DVD MPEG2 and various forms of streaming MPEG2 only. You can also make DVD Menus and generate the IFO/VOB sets. This is how I do TV recordings. It's far faster than any other method once you understand it.

AVI is a wrapper. The contents can vary so editing like this would be dependent upon the codec.

[FredThompson]

I forgot to mention, you can do GOP-level cuts but those don't resoluve the open-GOP links so it's best to do yoru edits within a GOP. The field-window will let you choose the first and last positions of a GOP but those will be treated as GOP cuts so you really want to avoid those 2 positions.

FWIW, each break is encoded individually in a way which preserves the open-GOP links then the data is stitched together at the byte level. This is the only way to make it work.

[TakuSkan]

Are there any TyTools tutorials online other than the ones I found here (http://themurrays.homeip.net/downloads/tivo/extraction_articles/tivo_dvd.html) and the URL it refers to here? (http://www.dealdatabase.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26095)

For some reason the GOP Editor Tool isn't popping up after I do this:

A new Dialog will appear (like the one to create the key file) Select the File you wish to edit, and Press the Add button. The file(s) will be added to the "Files to Process" text area. Then press the Process button. (http://themurrays.homeip.net/downloads/tivo/extraction_articles/tivo_dvd.html)

I have to start it up manually. But for some reason the when I processed the video file with the cut list file generated, the cut segement wasn't deleted... Everything to the end of the file from the starting point cut marker got deleted. Don't know if this is because I had to manually close TyTools, open and run GOP Editor, and then close that manually and finish the job in TyTools. Maybe something was lost in the process I had to use to get things to work.

And for some reason the output files were placed in the folder where the video file was, and not in the one specified at the top of the TyTools window.

Also... this is making a VOB from my MPEG-2 .MPG file, ready to process for bunring to a DVD-R. I guess that's okay, It seems I can rename VOBs to .MPG and they're the same thing.... no?

Thx

TS

[FredThompson]

Going backwards, the File menu also has options to multiplex to MPG files, not just VOB.

The safest thing is to keep all the files in one directory and point both source and target directory settings to that one. You can move the files later.

Something isn't right with your installation. You should have all the distribution files in one directory. Post these questions in the DDB forums for more help.

[TakuSkan]

Going backwards, the File menu also has options to multiplex to MPG files, not just VOB.Got it. Actually, the menu item says "Multiplex (New Format) 2" ... nothing there indicating output as a MPG, but it does.

The safest thing is to keep all the files in one directory and point both source and target directory settings to that one. You can move the files later.Can the "Tivo Address" field be used for setting a source folder on the system's hard drive. I guess so if it's typed in. I'd like to use a target folder on a different drive with more space. But I've yet to get TyTools to put the output file anywhere but in the source file's folder.

Something isn't right with your installation. You should have all the distribution files in one directory. I forgot to extract the extrat cygwin1.dll file to the TyTools program folder. I've got things working correctly now.

Post these questions in the DDB forums for more help.Okay... Thx Fred.

TS

[kis2005]

As for Chopper XP, I found it by doing a search in Google. I noticed that the homepage didn't have it but it is out there. As for the AVI with XviD codec, I thought not to say I know because I haven't ussed it my self, but VDubMod may do it as long as you have the XviD codec installed. If not, the only program that I have that will is Ulead Video Studio 9. It costs, and it is time consuming (you'll need a fast P4 or similar) but it will edit AVI with XviD. I'm not sure if it'll output in same format though or just MPEG. There is 30 day trial program, that should be enough time to give it a whirl.

Good luck

[TakuSkan]

As for Chopper XP, I found it by doing a search in Google. I noticed that the homepage didn't have it but it is out there.Do you have any experience with it? I've compared 5-6 different MPEG/AVI editors, and the two that I like the best so far are VideoReDo, and TyTools. I'm in agreement with Fred though. Though it's a bit daunting to get a handle on, TyTools looks like the most flexible, multi-use, quick and efficient MPEG editor I've seen at this point.

As for the AVI with XviD codec, I thought not to say I know because I haven't ussed it my self, but VDubMod may do it as long as you have the XviD codec installed. If not, the only program that I have that will is Ulead Video Studio 9. It costs, and it is time consuming (you'll need a fast P4 or similar) but it will edit AVI with XviD. I'm not sure if it'll output in same format though or just MPEG.Well... my earlier post on the subject of AVI editors with regard to XVid encoded files read:

Is there anything like this that can do the same for AVI files? I'd like to be able to quickly splice together a few AVIs encoded with XVid.

Specifically, we're talking about editors that can edit and write a copy of a video file quickly in a few minutes without the need to rewrite the entire file, a much more time consuming task. Both VDubMod and Ulead Video Studio 9 have to rewrite entire files after editing.

TS

[setarip_old]

Specifically, we're talking about editors that can edit and write a copy of a video file quickly in a few minutes without the need to rewrite the entire file, a much more time consuming task. Both VDubMod and Ulead Video Studio 9 have to rewrite entire files after editing.
It sounds like you've forgotten to set "Video" to "Direct stream copy". It took me only 3 minutes and 32 seconds to join two 1Gb (each) .AVIs, using VirtualDubMOD...

[TakuSkan]

It sounds like you've forgotten to set "Video" to "Direct stream copy". It took me only 3 minutes and 32 seconds to join two 1Gb (each) .AVIs, using VirtualDubMOD...Hey set!

You know... I neglected to set that a number of times. It finally sunk in at when point when I got output where the video and audio were out of sync, adn I agonized for hours doing research before I finally came upon Doom9 info I'd read before about setting that.

But 3:32 to join 2 .AVIs... Were those compressed or uncompressed? And would joining uncompressed files and compressed files go at significantly different speeds?

Also, your probably system may be a lot faster than my old Athlon 800 one. I'll have run some tests and see what the differences may be.

Edit: Deleted comments of TyTool/VideoReDo tests. Found my error.

TS

[setarip_old]

But 3:32 to join 2 .AVIs... Were those compressed or uncompressed? And would joining uncompressed files and compressed files go at significantly different speeds? Also, your probably system may be a lot faster than my old Athlon 800 one.

They were DivX-compressed .AVIs with .MP3 (CBR) audiostreams.
I don't believe compressed or uncompressed would have a bearing on the time required.
I did this particular join on an Athlon 3000...

[TakuSkan]

They were DivX-compressed .AVIs with .MP3 (CBR) audiostreams. I don't believe compressed or uncompressed would have a bearing on the time required.Wow... I have some XVid/AVIs I've been wanting to join. That answers one of dozens of issues on my list to figure out.

I did this particular join on an Athlon 3000...Let's see... 3000/800 = :eek:

I have decided to start researching which recent (at least 6-12 months old to get a better price I can afford) motherboards & CPUs I can replace my old ones with for better peformance working with video. Any suggestions? I'd like to be able to save some $$ and retain my old 512MB SDRAM card if there's no convincing reason to spend more on newer memory.

TS

[TakuSkan]

They were DivX-compressed .AVIs with .MP3 (CBR) audiostreams.
I don't believe compressed or uncompressed would have a bearing on the time required.I did this particular join on an Athlon 3000...Hmmm... I just tried appending one XVid file to another in VirtualDubMod, and got an error, "Can't append. Video streams have different data formats"

I'm guessing that's because I ran AutoGK on each, and thus have VBR MP3 encoded audio. You say you encoded with DivX, and a CBR audio stream.

TS