xbox360

[johnhamler1]

the 22th nov is realease of xbox360...
are u buying one,

how do you backup DVD????:)

[Sirber]

nope. Still having fun with my modded PS2 :D

[DryFire]

I'll also refrain from buying one at the moment. I'll let any kinks work themselves out.

Does the 360 have h.264 support? or will we have to wait for someone to mod it?

[communist]

Does the 360 have h.264 support? or will we have to wait for someone to mod it?
Why would Microsoft implement a competing format (especially if it'll cost them money)? They'll most probably try to push WMV/VC1 even more with the X360.

[DryFire]

I could always hope you know.... if no one mods it I think I'll just go the htpc route. Not a huge console fan anyway.

[Angelus]

I'm planning on the ol' standing outside the store to get one, then selling it on ebay for twice the amount. There's one on ebay now for over $1000 JUST for the premium package alone...

[charleski]

I could always hope you know.... if no one mods it I think I'll just go the htpc route. Not a huge console fan anyway.Anandtech has a feature on disassembling the 360 - it's a much bigger task than the original Xbox, and you'll want to upgrae the HD, which is more casework to deal with. Building an htpc will be a lot easier and probably end up not costing much more.

[Chainmax]

I'll also refrain from buying one at the moment. I'll let any kinks work themselves out.

Does the 360 have h.264 support? or will we have to wait for someone to mod it?

I think I heard that its MCE functionality is limited to WMV or something like that. It would probably be cheaper for you to mod an XBOX.

[pspvideo9]

The Xbox360 is severly limited in terms of the video codecs it can play back. See this FAQ for more details:
http://www.videora.com/en-us/Converter/Xbox360/video.html

[dragongodz]

the 22th nov is realease of xbox360...
are u buying one,

how do you backup DVD????
correct me if i am wrong but that looks like you are asking how to backup an xbox(as in game) dvd. if so then your answer can be found in these threads

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=94850
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=84744
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=41542

[Doobie]

the 22th nov is realease of xbox360...
are u buying one,

No, I'm not buying one. I'm a PC fan. The Xbox 360 is too expensive for the current quality of games on it.

[dani82]

@Angelus

thinking of doing the same; the profit will more than likely cover what i'm going to spend on friday

[johnhamler1]

I am waiting spring for the realease of ps3 with blue ray, could be a good deal, BR dvd player + gaming console...

not a fan of game consoles, but this new ps3 has an attractive look for anyone and not for kids only.

what i have read these 2 game consoles have a new c/right protection making impossible to play copied games/movies....

the war xbox360 vs ps2 will be full of blood....!!!I am very excited and curious who will win, if there is a winner.

@ the moderator, please keep this topic open a few weeks..., the x box is a dvd player, no???

[dragongodz]

what i have read these 2 game consoles have a new c/right protection making impossible to play copied games/movies....
please read my last reply about how relevant that is here for games. but i will say, you do realise the older consoles also had protections aswell , what did it stop in the end ?

@ the moderator, please keep this topic open a few weeks..., the x box is a dvd player, no???
HAHAHA yes both sony and ms push their consoles as "multimedia machines" rather than consoles. that doesnt mean they are suddenly dvd players though. ;)

[charleski]

what i have read these 2 game consoles have a new c/right protection making impossible to play copied games/movies....

the war xbox360 vs ps2 will be full of blood....!!!I am very excited and curious who will win, if there is a winner.

@ the moderator, please keep this topic open a few weeks..., the x box is a dvd player, no???
The original xbox can be modified to perform as a fairly decent media player, so that's relevant (personally I think people are going to have a lot more problems getting the 360 to do the same thing, but we'll have to see). The upcoming PS3 will be of interest as it'll be a cheap Blu-ray player, so that's relevant.

But please guys, use your heads! Any mention of the copy protection on games for these things is not only completely irrelevant to this forum, but against the rules - and the rule is there for a very good reason. Any further talk about this is just asking the moderators to lock the thread and take further action.

[johnhamler1]

I was mentioning about backups only...

PS3 cheap blue ray player? and how much it will be. The xbox360 should be at 350$, right...ps3 above 400$.

[arch_angel16]

Sony's CEO has been shooting his mouth off about how pricey PS3 is going to be. In fact, right now the PS3's looking extremely troubled as it is. Interesting things to note:

-at one point, PS3 was specified to have a gigabit ethernet and 100mbit ports - for 'daisy-chain' networking without any need for a router. Sadly, this feature was dropped.
-accordinig to current data surrounding the PS3's "Cell" processor, it's A: huge and B: pricey, we're talking a $175 cost to PRODUCE each core.
-apparently the sexy-fast rendering demoes Sony has shown of the PS3 weren't rendered realtime - they were rendered, quite slowly, then sped up as video. (read, you think the Xbox360's hard to code efficiently for? It looks like the answer to a virgin's prayer compared to Sony's development curve)
-Sony has no online strategy of any kind. Yes, you heard right. No services of any kind.
-Sony's charging an arm and leg for PS3 development kits, which is dissuading many smaller, independant studios from developing for their platform.
-even traditional Japanese Sony-ony development studios are quite hesitant about the strategy Sony's on. Square-Enix, a Sony holdout for many years, has announced they will develop games for 'other' consoles.

My take on this? Either the PS3's going to fizzle due to lack of developer adoption and high consumer costs, or Sony's going to drive themselves into the ground subsidizing console sales and development funding.

...meanwhile Nintendo is shouting "we're funky, we're ridiculously cheap, and we're backwards compatible!"

*sigh* Xbox360's launch was tepid at best (I'm sorry but a launch composed of nothing but minor sequels and sports & racing games is rather pathetic), PS3's looking worse and worse as time flies by, and Square-Enix's preview of the long-awaited Final Fantasy XII is NOT looking hot. *cries* it's not a good time to be a console gamer :(

[johnhamler1]

do these system support 32 bit, or they stay with 16 bits operations(if I am right, they work on 16 )?

[charleski]

If you want to know about the technical details of these machines, I'd suggest a site not devoted to video encoding, heh. Ars Technica is a good one:
The Cell processor (PS3) part 1 (http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/cpu/cell-1.ars)
The Cell processor part 2 (http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/cpu/cell-2.ars)
Xbox360 architecture part 1 (http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/cpu/xbox360-1.ars)
Xbox360 architecture part 2 (http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/cpu/xbox360-2.ars)
Architectural implications for games development (http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/hardware/crossplatform.ars)

[Doobie]

PS3 cheap blue ray player? and how much it will be. The xbox360 should be at 350$, right...ps3 above 400$.

I suspect that the PS3 will be released at $399 to $349. Sony is working on cutting costs as we speak.

I wouldn't say it's a cheap blu-ray player, unless you otherwise wanted a PS3. Basic blu-ray players will be much cheaper than the PS3.

[charleski]

Basic blu-ray players will be much cheaper than the PS3.Where did you get that idea? In 2-3 years, sure.
Sony will be able to push out a Blu-ray PS3 for around $400 by subsidising the hardware through game prices. Toshiba's first HD-DVD player has been priced at $1000 (http://www.cnet.com/4520-10602_1-5618766-1.html). Though real prices may end up lower, it's clear that the early units are going to be fairly costly. Blu-Ray will, if anything, be more costly initally.

[Doobie]

Sony will be able to push out a Blu-ray PS3 for around $400 by subsidising the hardware through game prices. Toshiba's first HD-DVD player has been priced at $1000 (http://www.cnet.com/4520-10602_1-5618766-1.html). Though real prices may end up lower, it's clear that the early units are going to be fairly costly. Blu-Ray will, if anything, be more costly initally.

You might want to look again. That's a HD-DVD recorder, not a player. Those are going to be very expensive for a while. And, the first unit hitting the shelf hardly counts.

[charleski]

You might want to look again. That's a HD-DVD recorder, not a player.LOL, try reading the text in the link, the headline is wrong: "Details are still sketchy on Toshiba's HD-DVD recorder, but pricing and availability for its play-only unit have finally been announced... The unnamed unit will be available in the fourth quarter of 2005 for a list price of $1,000." As we know, Toshiba has since pushed it back to early 2006.

[mrchri5]

It seems I'm the only one not excited about these new game systems. I have been mostly a pc gamer since my first computer and so far I haven't seen anything to make me want to change. Its also rediculous to pay another online fee when your already paying your broadband connection. I wish they could advance the quality of game play as much as they do the graphics.

I have a xbox and was bored with halo 2 in less than 2 weeks. I can't handle all the angry teenagers that think they are master chief and I would usually just mute the sound. Atari 2600 games have held my interest for longer than most of the new console stuff.

Maybe at 24 I am just getting to old and don't have the patience. About the only games I enjoy are the old classics like The Dig or myst and other similar games. At least with this attitude I shouldn't have to upgrade my pc again for a while.

My interest in movies is still going strong though.

[spuddog]

I wish they could advance the quality of game play as much as they do the graphics.



Amen Brother

[CWR03]

I have a xbox and was bored with halo 2 in less than 2 weeks. I can't handle all the angry teenagers that think they are master chief and I would usually just mute the sound. Atari 2600 games have held my interest for longer than most of the new console stuff.
I agree, in fact some of my favorite games are older ones. I can play Asteroids for hours, and there's not much to it at all (mostly asteroids, go figure). I've even been playing Doom lately with one of the better single-player map packs. I don't mind getting my butt kicked by some 13-year-old 'cause I remember beating adults in arcades all the time at that age, but there's no need to gloat. That's just plain rude.

[dragongodz]

yep, i only bought a playstation(1) when it got cheap and then simply to play a few games that were not being released on pc,eg. tekken 2 etc.

it seems that the majority of games are are released on pc nowdays and those that are not really dont seem to grab me. especially for the prices these consoles are going to be.

i know people could say, ye but they can play dvds and everything now. big deal, i have a dvd player already so why would i want to pay that extra for something i wouldnt use.Maybe at 24 I am just getting to old and don't have the patience. About the only games I enjoy are the old classics like The Dig or myst and other similar games.
wait until you are late 30's like me. i used to play impossible mission ,for example, on a C64 for hours. such a simple and repetative game but it dragged you in. ;)

[lexor]

I suspect that the PS3 will be released at $399 to $349. Sony is working on cutting costs as we speak.

I wouldn't say it's a cheap blu-ray player, unless you otherwise wanted a PS3. Basic blu-ray players will be much cheaper than the PS3.
when they'll both come out, PS3 will be cheaper at launch. Those blue ray players will enter the market at $900 USD (for most basic, stripped down version by Panasonic) and up. PS3 right now looks at $500 USD, and though it might go lower I don't expect it to fall to XBox360 price level, Sony president did say that the system is so good that consumers will buy it even if they raise the price over $500 USD.

so meh.

Having said that I'm not getting XBox360 untill it's moddable to my statisfaction (so probably not even first gen modchips) Good thing for early adopters is that it's fully functional DVD player out of the box (i.e. you no longer need to buy the remote, you can use game controller) so normal (non mpeg4/divx/xvid) dvd palyers can be unplugged to make room on the shelf :)

[ultimatebilly]

To all xbox 360 owners:
Have fun beta-testing! :D
http://www.xbox-scene.com/xbox1data/sep/EEFkZkkkyEHasmrPqu.php

[ssjkakaroto]

Sony's CEO has been shooting his mouth off about how pricey PS3 is going to be. In fact, right now the PS3's looking extremely troubled as it is. Interesting things to note:

-at one point, PS3 was specified to have a gigabit ethernet and 100mbit ports - for 'daisy-chain' networking without any need for a router. Sadly, this feature was dropped.
-accordinig to current data surrounding the PS3's "Cell" processor, it's A: huge and B: pricey, we're talking a $175 cost to PRODUCE each core.
-apparently the sexy-fast rendering demoes Sony has shown of the PS3 weren't rendered realtime - they were rendered, quite slowly, then sped up as video. (read, you think the Xbox360's hard to code efficiently for? It looks like the answer to a virgin's prayer compared to Sony's development curve)
-Sony has no online strategy of any kind. Yes, you heard right. No services of any kind.
-Sony's charging an arm and leg for PS3 development kits, which is dissuading many smaller, independant studios from developing for their platform.
-even traditional Japanese Sony-ony development studios are quite hesitant about the strategy Sony's on. Square-Enix, a Sony holdout for many years, has announced they will develop games for 'other' consoles.

My take on this? Either the PS3's going to fizzle due to lack of developer adoption and high consumer costs, or Sony's going to drive themselves into the ground subsidizing console sales and development funding.

...meanwhile Nintendo is shouting "we're funky, we're ridiculously cheap, and we're backwards compatible!"

*sigh* Xbox360's launch was tepid at best (I'm sorry but a launch composed of nothing but minor sequels and sports & racing games is rather pathetic), PS3's looking worse and worse as time flies by, and Square-Enix's preview of the long-awaited Final Fantasy XII is NOT looking hot. *cries* it's not a good time to be a console gamer :(the same was said about the PS2 when it came out (and in fact was true in the beginning) but Sony was able to catch up and pass in the end ;)

[neo75903]

-accordinig to current data surrounding the PS3's "Cell" processor, it's A: huge and B: pricey, we're talking a $175 cost to PRODUCE each core.
-Sony has no online strategy of any kind. Yes, you heard right. No services of any kind.
-Sony's charging an arm and leg for PS3 development kits, which is dissuading many smaller, independant studios from developing for their platform.
-even traditional Japanese Sony-ony development studios are quite hesitant about the strategy Sony's on. Square-Enix, a Sony holdout for many years, has announced they will develop games for 'other' consoles.

My take on this? Either the PS3's going to fizzle due to lack of developer adoption and high consumer costs, or Sony's going to drive themselves into the ground subsidizing console sales and development funding.


- cell cpu cost want be a problem in the long term, because the same cpu will be usef from mobile appliances to servers(IBM).

- Game developers are free to create their own network service, this allows for free game servers instead of M$ solution where u must subscribe to their service.

- Same happend with PS2 development kits, when it was introduced, at the end, we have a shortage of linux specialist ;)

There are already reports of xbox crashes within a day.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/80491849@N00/

[rjgn]

- Game developers are free to create their own network service, this allows for free game servers instead of M$ solution where u must subscribe to their service.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/80491849@N00/

Although personally I don't use xbox live (I'm a pc gamer) Microsoft's solution seems to me to be a vastly better one. Having everything integrated into Live gives a much much better experience for the end user. And remember I'm talking about your average console user here. It' pretty much just plug and play and the gamer has access to everything he or she needs under the one interface for EVERY game on the system.

Yes the cost is a bummer and as you say it seems a developer can't allow for free game servers but I think the way Sony is taking things with respect to online services is a blunder.

From a business perpective an integrated online service that can double as a content provision system is a very smart move and Live is probably what the xbox has going for it the most. Bear in mind that I'm fully aware of the disadvantages especially to more technically savy people like us but for the masses Ms's system looks far better.

[johnhamler1]

if I resume what I have read , most people here are not gamers,...it is why we are here, for movies...
yes, with age, spend hours and hours on a gaming station is borring. Specially I dont really appreciate to see our kids playing(mainly) one man shooter instead of "social" games like surf, tennis, soccer,...

the one play station which I have really no interest in, is the PSP...probably 20 years ago, I would have said, woooow, this thing is awesome...but I think this PSP just sucks!

anyway, I am excited to see this new PS3 coming out in spring,more for the blue thing than for the game console.

[Shinigami-Sama]

I agree, in fact some of my favorite games are older ones. I can play Asteroids for hours, and there's not much to it at all (mostly asteroids, go figure). I've even been playing Doom lately with one of the better single-player map packs. I don't mind getting my butt kicked by some 13-year-old 'cause I remember beating adults in arcades all the time at that age, but there's no need to gloat. That's just plain rude.
agreed, infact I just started playing my old sega and snes games again, I realy wish sega came back into the market, considerting they and nintendo are the last two true console/game companies, sega IMO being the better of the two, but they messed up with the dreamcast :(

anyways back on topic

one of my classmates seems to want an xbox to sell on ebay also, but I'm going to use this opertunity to buy an old xbox and some accessories for it, in a few months when the market is flooded with them ^-^

[dragongodz]

a little OT but i thought some xbox fans, and those that are not too , may find this interesting
http://www.smashmyxbox.com/

[Cyberace]

I will buy an Xbox360 once it's been hacked/cracked so it will run unsigned code, (either via a modchip or a software-mod), ...not to run backuped-games but to run XBMC (XboxMediaCenter) (http://www.xboxmediacenter.com), XBMC could/will become so much cooler once you get rid of the limitations of the old Xbox, compare one 32-bit 733Mhz CISC CPU with 64MB RAM to THREE(!) RISC CPU with 512MB RAM, you will be able to decode and view all native HDTV-video without problems and up-scale all non-native HDTV-video to HDTV-resolutions on-the-fly with all the bells and whistles of high-quality postprocessing filters :cool:

My guess is it that it takes around 12-month before the first modchips for it are available
...hopefully by then 40"+ 720p and 1080i HD TV's have gone done qite a lot in price :sly:

[Doobie]

when they'll both come out, PS3 will be cheaper at launch. Those blue ray players will enter the market at $900 USD

Anyone looking for a chaep blu-ray player isn't going to be buying one on the day the PS3 comes out. Again, the PS3 is not a cheap blu-ray player. It might be only cheap compared to other blu-ray players on the day of the PS3 introduction, which is hardly a fair comparison.

Someone estimated that the blu-ray component of the PS3 will cost Sony $101. Given that fact, it should be very feasible for stand-alone blu-ray players to be below $200. Anything above $200 will be a premium charged to early buyers or for extra features. In a year's time after the PS3 is released (or Christmas 2007), blu-ray players could be starting at below $100 while the PS3 will still be $400.

Blu-ray players will come down in price rapidly becaues blu-ray players will be competing against the PS3, HD-DVD (which is the one good thing about a standards war), and to a lessor degree DVD.

Initially, the PS3 will just be a not-so-expensive, expensive blu-ray player. It is crass to call it a cheap player.

Sony president did say that the system is so good that consumers will buy it even if they raise the price over $500 USD.

I think he's trying to hype the value. If Sony really believed that, the PS3 would be sold for $500. That's not going to happen.

[Latexxx]

Someone estimated that the blu-ray component of the PS3 will cost Sony $101. Given that fact, it should be very feasible for stand-alone blu-ray players to be below $200. Anything above $200 will be a premium charged to early buyers or for extra features. In a year's time after the PS3 is released (or Christmas 2007), blu-ray players could be starting at below $100 while the PS3 will still be $400.
The $101 is only the Blu-ray drive. In addition you need a processor powerful enough to decode 1080 AVC content and layer Java applets over it with partial transparency and the same resolution to produce a player capable of playing Blu-ray discs.

And consoles are different from consumer electronics. Consoles are sold at a loss but when it comes to electronics everybody will have their share of profits. So if the costs to produce a Blu-ray player will be $200, the final retail price will be at least $500.

[neo75903]

It' pretty much just plug and play and the gamer has access to everything he or she needs under the one interface for EVERY game on the system.

Why would u do that? U still need the disc to play the game, why not only show the online options when a game is inserted? I think that is less confusing.
Well thats my opinion.

I also think that sony model is still more interesting because you can choose ur own servers like it is the case now for doom, cs, and others on the pc.

[rjgn]

Why would u do that? U still need the disc to play the game, why not only show the online options when a game is inserted? I think that is less confusing.
Well thats my opinion.

I also think that sony model is still more interesting because you can choose ur own servers like it is the case now for doom, cs, and others on the pc.

Hmm not what I meant. What I mean is that xbox live has one consistent interface for all games. Every game on the xbox has to live aware. For example you can recieve game invites if your playing a completetly different game or even watching a movie. And just being able to pick a server as you can with the pc doesn't to me make it interesting. Just the same old model we are used to seeing. Again though, I can easily see how it would appeal more to anyone who is a pc gamer (as I am). But for the masses the integration that live brings makes much more sense. Even though it may not be as flexible for ourselves who would appreciate a more open solution, it makes it all a much more simple and clean way for console gamers to get online. I know a few people who own pc's who have tried to get into online gaming but found it all just too baffling whereas they found xbox live simple and easy to use. Which at the end of the day is the point. Online gaming is huge now and if Sony fails in this aspect when it comes to the PS3 then it it won't bode well for the console.

[wmansir]

I will buy an Xbox360 once it's been hacked/cracked so it will run unsigned code, (either via a modchip or a software-mod), ...not to run backuped-games but to run XBMC (XboxMediaCenter) (http://www.xboxmediacenter.com), XBMC could/will become so much cooler once you get rid of the limitations of the old Xbox, compare one 32-bit 733Mhz CISC CPU with 64MB RAM to THREE(!) RISC CPU with 512MB RAM, you will be able to decode and view all native HDTV-video without problems and up-scale all non-native HDTV-video to HDTV-resolutions on-the-fly with all the bells and whistles of high-quality postprocessing filters :cool:

My guess is it that it takes around 12-month before the first modchips for it are available
...hopefully by then 40"+ 720p and 1080i HD TV's have gone done qite a lot in price :sly:

This being a video site I'm suprised there hasn't been more discussion on this topic. Has anyone seen any reviews on how the 360 works with a networked MCE PC? I recall one of the demo video I saw said it would be able to stream HD content from MCEs on the network. Considering this type of integration is something MS is spearheading I think it could provide some interesting solutions with the 360 as a quiet, consumer device front-end to a beefy MCE back-end system.

[charleski]

Here's one opinion which suggests a problem with the decoder system: The 360 DVD player. It's just not good (http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2005/11/24/1927/p2)
From the anecdotes I've read, the streaming ability only works with Windows Media Center Edition, which is a real pity.

[Cyberace]

Has anyone seen any reviews on how the 360 works with a networked MCE PC?I think the biggest blowback is that Xbox360 can't play DivX/XviD/H.264 video nor AAC audio nativly on it (nor any other 'odd' video or audio formats/codecs for that matter like MKV, OGM, VP6, OGG, MPC, SHN, RealMedia or QuickTime). The Xbox360 will only play Microsoft WMV video and WMA audio (and MP3 too of course), though on the plus side it will álso play Microsoft HD-WMV format and upscale single DVD-Video movies to 1080i and progressive-scan 480p/720p from the Xbox360's DVD-ROM drive, ...but it will not play DVD-Video movies from the upcoming 'multiple DVD-juggler' thingy for MPC2005 (PC), (a feature which by the way XBMC now can via it's new DVD-player function if you store your DVD-Video movies/images on the harddrive or network).

PS! You can play MP3 and WMA audio-files on the Xbox360 from any Windows-XP PC, however to play (WMV) video-files or watch/record live-TV you will need to have MCE2005 (Microsoft Windows Media Center Edition 2005) installed on your PC. It does this over a proprietary protocol streaming over the network, since the protocol is proprietary (closed) you won't be able to create a 'server' to it for a Linux/UNIX OS or a NAS-device :mad:

http://channel9.msdn.com/showpost.aspx?postid=126995
http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/xbox360_inside.asp
http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/xbox360_inside_02.asp
http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2005/11/24/1927/p2
http://www.ga-forum.com/showthread.php?t=73324

[johnhamler1]

I am in europe, visited some shops last day, it should be here the 2nd december, gave my name and phone # for a reservation. shops will get only 10-15 units, so let me dream!!!cost around 350 euro fo the full 360 (20 G HDD,...)
300'000 units for all europe,!!!

[Hellworm]

PS! You can play MP3 and WMA audio-files on the Xbox360 from any Windows-XP PC, however to play (WMV) video-files or watch/record live-TV you will need to have MCE2005 (Microsoft Windows Media Center Edition 2005) installed on your PC. It does this over a proprietary protocol streaming over the network, since the protocol is proprietary (closed) you won't be able to create a 'server' to it for a Linux/UNIX OS or a NAS-device :mad:


I'll wait till theres a Linux distro for the Xbox360, like there was for the xbox. Then i'll be able to do what ever I want, with the pure power of it's cpus: watching everything I want, fast video encoding (perhaps realtime avc?) ... *dreaming*

[yuri6312]

ye
but i suspect ps3...

[johnhamler1]

a shop called me in the evening (europe), told they keep a xbox 360 for me....
so tomorrow, I will be the happy owner of the most wanted videogame IN THE WORLD...

[Neo Neko]

Most wanted? By who? The lines for the PS2 launch date were much longer than those I saw for the Xbox 360. There has been alot of hype. And grandstanding. But despite all the rebutting of purposefull undersupply. Launching the system as they have done it there was never any hope for them to supply the demand. Giving the illusion that everyone and their grandmothers want one. I'm not saying the system sucks. It's fine. Nothing special. Now the kinds can enjoy high resolution DOA breast bouncing. With lines so crisp you will be able to see the simulated nipple imprints. I have yet to hear anything the 360 is gonna have that the others likely won't. At least anything worth worrying about.

I'll admit at this point I am much more interested in the PS3. And that is largely due to my legacy investment in older PS systems. Backwards compatability is not a must. But it sure is nice. Especially looking at the half arsed backwards compatability in the 360.

Finally it's hard to get excited about a system from a company who's last system while superior hardware wise to all their competitors; could not defeat the has been Nintendo definatively enough to hold second place. Not to mention all the crashing and burning litteraly of both the old and new systems. And the extream loss all the previous and current systems were sold at.

I'm just gonna wait and see. Maybe christmas 06. But I am not touching anything this year for sure.

[johnhamler1]

Neo Neko,

you are right, but e bay sell it at 800$-1000$.
I have 2 and I am reselling mine to buy me a PS3 later 4 the blue thing.
this x box has only 1-2 games worth.
I would suggest to anyone seeking 4 one of these x box to wait for more games, or buy my X boxes360! :)

and BTW, i dont think it is DivX, if it is, I will keep one for myself as I need a Div x player.

[int 21h]

Most wanted? By who? The lines for the PS2 launch date were much longer than those I saw for the Xbox 360. There has been alot of hype. And grandstanding. But despite all the rebutting of purposefull undersupply. Launching the system as they have done it there was never any hope for them to supply the demand. Giving the illusion that everyone and their grandmothers want one. I'm not saying the system sucks. It's fine. Nothing special. Now the kinds can enjoy high resolution DOA breast bouncing. With lines so crisp you will be able to see the simulated nipple imprints. I have yet to hear anything the 360 is gonna have that the others likely won't. At least anything worth worrying about.

Centralized online gaming (Xbox Live)? Something Sony is still refusing to provide.


I'll admit at this point I am much more interested in the PS3. And that is largely due to my legacy investment in older PS systems. Backwards compatability is not a must. But it sure is nice. Especially looking at the half arsed backwards compatability in the 360.

Finally it's hard to get excited about a system from a company who's last system while superior hardware wise to all their competitors; could not defeat the has been Nintendo definatively enough to hold second place. Not to mention all the crashing and burning litteraly of both the old and new systems. And the extream loss all the previous and current systems were sold at.


The latest numbers I've seen put the slices right around 51% for PS2, 34% for Xbox, and 15% for Gamecube. These were published by Gartner right before the launch of the xbox360. I've also seen lower estimates putting Xbox and Gamecube both at 20%. Microsoft definitely has 2nd place in the North American console market.


I'm just gonna wait and see. Maybe christmas 06. But I am not touching anything this year for sure.

Same here. I'd like to see the possibilities with the hardware open up a little more. At a minimum, Microsoft should support non-WMV streaming. More optimistically, it would be nice to see some sort of a SDK, DDK that let video codec writers make their codec xbox360 compatible (ha!, really dreaming).

In any event, when a modchip does eventually come out, it will be hard to turn down a 3-core PPC box in that small of a form factor for that small of a price.

[Neo Neko]

Centralized online gaming (Xbox Live)? Something Sony is still refusing to provide.

That is fine. Now tell me why I need to pay Microsoft for it? What does it give me over just connecting over the internet to play for free? It's fine. But I have never needed centralised gaming before. As far as I am concerned it is a non-feature. A weak point even. If for whatever reason I can't connect to the centralised server I can't play on line period. Regardless of whether or not I can access anything else. Maybe I am missing something. It's fine. But it's not something I see myself wanting to pay for. Though I did hear blurbs about the basic service becomming free and only having to pay for whatever the gold version is.



The latest numbers I've seen put the slices right around 51% for PS2, 34% for Xbox, and 15% for Gamecube. These were published by Gartner right before the launch of the xbox360. I've also seen lower estimates putting Xbox and Gamecube both at 20%. Microsoft definitely has 2nd place in the North American console market.

As you said that is "only" North America. Which excludes the majority of the world. That is also going to be the market most biased in favor of Microsoft as it is their "home" market. So what MS has in just the North American market can't really be indicative can it? What are the odds that in Japan the home market of both sony and nintendo that the Xbox is in a solid 3rd? And would it matter in the larger scale if they were. Not at all. World wide which is the number I think should be the indicator. There Microsoft is tied with Nintendo! At least the most recent numbers I had seen. Which is really sad since they arguably did have superior hardware and resources. Things like Monopoly funding etc. But they still can't definatively beat out nintendo who is coasting on pure inertia as they leave the market and head off into irrelevance. Then there is the wide reports of crashing and literal burning due to faulty design. I know thay all have problems but MS seems to have more. Or perhaps that is an anti-MS media bias. I don't know. All I know is that I have never felt the need to worry about my playstation or gamecube's powersuply catching fire and filling my house with thick black toxic smoke. Or ever had the desire to make a string hammok to allow better air circulation so the powersupply doesn't catch fire. :p

In any event, when a modchip does eventually come out, it will be hard to turn down a 3-core PPC box in that small of a form factor for that small of a price.

That I can kinda agree with you on. I was not interested in the Xbox because even when it was new it was a more or less out dated stripped down PC. The 360 and the PS3 both though should rival even the top of the line PCs on the market for some time to come. So if I can run Linux etc on it. I might actually buy one. But it is doubtfull there will be any games I will want it for. :p

[int 21h]

Worldwide we're looking at what, maybe 2 million x-box 360s out there right now? And how many have we seen actual proof of some sort of combustion? Heck at one time it was estimated that somewhere upwards of 10% of North America's supply was sitting on Ebay...

I think the overheating thing is a little bit of hype, but I also think its a little too early to tell since the sample size is relatively small. Its funny, just the other night my wife came and bothered me because the PS2 would freeze and flash the power LED right at her. She didnt realize that placing the unit on the carpet was causing it to overheat.

[Neo Neko]

Worldwide we're looking at what, maybe 2 million x-box 360s out there right now?

Worldwide I was reffering to Xbox sales. Not 360. ;) Although it is this whole world wide thing that is causing much of the craze. As much as I hate it I see the wisdom in delayed releases of the past. PS2 was out in Japan for almost a year before it reached the US IIRC. Sure there were those that still imported it. And there was still shrot supply. But not as short as Microsoft curretly has. They did it on purpose though. It really has upped the hype. And given them a more diverse beta testing pool. :)

And how many have we seen actual proof of some sort of combustion? Heck at one time it was estimated that somewhere upwards of 10% of North America's supply was sitting on Ebay...

I have seen several reports of actual combustion of "Xbox" PSUs that started fires of one magnatude or another. As well as those that just smouldered a bit. Not 360 mind you. This was the original Xbox. But the 360 is still proving a bit hot tempered as well. :p

[CruNcher]

Sorry but i can't understand some of the peps here. You are buying this "GAME" Console because you wan't to have fun *high output of endorphins in your Brain* but some of the People here sound more like some kind of Zombies mutated by the Virus of Product Placement, Marketing and Social Depression or do you really belive that when a Game has superb Graphics that Game is automaticly a good Game *that will let those endorphins fly* if that should be the case i have to tell yeah thats a very wrong assumption, but the industry did a great work to make you belive this so im really impressed. Another point is that childish thing of selling those stuff higher priced on ebay man i allways have to lough about this and im sure the rich buying those overpriced stuff too because they have very powerful *endorphin discharges* in that situation it's their kind of game, they feel better in that Situation as other individuals not fooled and you helping them getting yourself more and more Social Depressed it's kinda funny how this works :) Gameplay enhancements today are almost dead and because Nintendo goes other ways it means they gonna lose in the end ? hmm im not so sure about that ;) go into google typ in "abandoned games" and have those *endorphin discharges* till you die :) Where Microsoft and Sony invest Researching into how to have the best Graphics Nintendo does into how Games effect our lifes and gameplay can higher those biological reactions in our Brain :) and haveing just some of those exclusive titles that do this will mutate into the same virus that brought some of you into this zombie state that i talked previously off (think about animes). But please try to forget that the industry never want's us to have those ultimate player that can do almost everything in terms of Media they don't they just wan't our money to keep this System *The Productcycle* *Evolution* going.

[stephanV]

The same can be said for HD-DVD/Blu-Ray. Right now we don't need movies at 1920x1080, we actually need movies that are worth while watching. :)

[Chainmax]

Finally it's hard to get excited about a system from a company who's last system while superior hardware wise to all their competitors; could not defeat the has been Nintendo definatively enough to hold second place. Not to mention all the crashing and burning litteraly of both the old and new systems. And the extream loss all the previous and current systems were sold at.

You are wrong. The Gamecube is the only one of the three last-gen systems that has been profitable from day one, it's still profitable after the bundle drop to $99. The PS2 only has been profitable for at most the last year, and the XBOX is still making Microsoft lose loads of money. I can provide linkage if you want.

The latest numbers I've seen put the slices right around 51% for PS2, 34% for Xbox, and 15% for Gamecube. These were published by Gartner right before the launch of the xbox360. I've also seen lower estimates putting Xbox and Gamecube both at 20%. Microsoft definitely has 2nd place in the North American console market.

I'm pretty sure you're wrong there. While PS2 is indeed in first place and a mile away, PS2 and GameCube are much closer. Again, I can provide linkage.

That is fine. Now tell me why I need to pay Microsoft for it? What does it give me over just connecting over the internet to play for free?

XBL does nothing that you can't do on a computer, I grant you that. Thing is, it integrates everything in an incredibly stylized, smooth-running and easy-to-use package that simply has no equal. You can see what your friends are playing, chat with them while they are playing a singleplayer or multiplayer game, you can download small games for cheap (giving small developers and amateur programmers a commercial outlet) and many more things with just powering up the console. And it's not like you don't have to pay for your PC's internet connection, so nothing you do on the internet in your PC is for free either.

[int 21h]

...
I'm pretty sure you're wrong there. While PS2 is indeed in first place and a mile away, PS2 and GameCube are much closer. Again, I can provide linkage.
...

http://quote.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000103&sid=alVpp_FPy3R0&refer=news_index

According to that article, an analyst at Piper Jaffray published on April 30th the following: PS2 - 56%, Xbox - 25%, Gamecube - 19%.

The latest estimate from Gartner is only mentioned now, the AP article has since been removed, Joystiq mentions it here: http://www.joystiq.com/entry/1234000133067806/


Here is a link from Major Nelson (1 year ago) and what he says is directly from the marketing department:
http://www.majornelson.com/blog/2004/12/some-cool-xbox-stats.html

If anyone out there pays for the AP archive, I'd imagine you can retrieve the original Gartner press release that way.

[Neo Neko]

You are wrong. The Gamecube is the only one of the three last-gen systems that has been profitable from day one, it's still profitable after the bundle drop to $99. The PS2 only has been profitable for at most the last year, and the XBOX is still making Microsoft lose loads of money. I can provide linkage if you want.

Link away if you like. But that is not exactly what I was reffering to. I was reffering to market/mind share and not profitability per unit sold. I was always quite sure Microsoft was dead last on the latter. And even though Nintendo may be pulling in actual money for selling Game Cube units. They are not putting out much in the way of exclusive must have titles anny more. Unless you are a poke-tard etc. Zelda is fine. And I would give anything for another classic mario adventure and not another Mario sports title. :( I even bought a GameCube myself. But I can honestly say that the old nitendo magic is gone.

XBL does nothing that you can't do on a computer, I grant you that. Thing is, it integrates everything in an incredibly stylized, smooth-running and easy-to-use package that simply has no equal. You can see what your friends are playing, chat with them while they are playing a singleplayer or multiplayer game, you can download small games for cheap (giving small developers and amateur programmers a commercial outlet) and many more things with just powering up the console. And it's not like you don't have to pay for your PC's internet connection, so nothing you do on the internet in your PC is for free either.

Integration. That's fine. That is Microsofts one strong point. And it again is also their weakest point. Integration also tends to make it's own gated community that keeps the rifraf out. Whether or not they are your friends who are not fortunate to own an Xbox. Can people that own coppies of unreal tournament or Quake III on Xbox play against people on the PC? Unless things have changed that is a negative. It's not the game creaters that are doing this. It is what they have to do to do business with Microsoft. They would much rather have all users of their game from any platform be able to play together.

I don't need a nice uniform interface. Most games tend to have the same basic netplay interface anyhow these days. Not that you could not use something like gamespy if you did. Nor do I need people pestering me to chat when I am playing. I purposefully turn off all IM etc cause I don't have time in the middle of a game much. But if someone thought this was such a good idea there is no reason that any game manufacturer could not include support for something like jabber in game for no charge what so ever. But it still just does not happen.