Layer break with cell type flag = 0 ?

[Taelon]

How can this be?

http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/3048/layerbreak9eb.th.gif (http://img31.imageshack.us/my.php?image=layerbreak9eb.gif)

[2COOL]

Is this a straight rip? What DVD is this?

[Taelon]

Yep, "Crash" R1

[jinjin_jp]

I experienced the same kind DVD like below(it is Lion King 3), too.
I think Layer-break checked when "seamless joint[8]" is '0'.
http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/7393/celltype0509233mn.th.jpg (http://img360.imageshack.us/my.php?image=celltype0509233mn.jpg)

[Taelon]

Yes I noticed if I uncheck the layer break, it reverts to an '8'. The other thing I don't understand is how can it be a layer break without an STC disconnect, or is that only when the VOB ID changes?

[r0lZ]

Take in mind that the layer break checkbox in PgcEdit is just a shortcut to the Seamless Joint flag, but inverted. I have added it so that it is easy to find and clear possible layer breaks in the main movie. But a non-seamless cell might be used for other purposes than the layer break. (Notably, the first cell of a PGC must be non-seamless.)

I din't understand why there are non-seamless cells w/o the STC discontinuity flag, but I suppose that this configuration can be used for several purposes. Layer break, cell command...

Could you verify if this cell matches the real layer break position, in the original DVD?

[Taelon]

Could you verify if this cell matches the real layer break position, in the original DVD?Thanks r0lZ, I'm sure I could, but I'm not sure how?

[bigotti5]

checked some of my dvds for layerbreak flags

if the Vob_ID does not change, the flag is 0 or 1
then checked the cell with Vobedit and saw the STC is sequentially

if the Vob_ID changes, the flag is 2 or 3 and in Vobedit the STC resets.

then I made some testauthorings with scenarist showing scenarist handles the flag in this way too

[r0lZ]

@Taelon:

Hum, yes, not easy. On my Sony, it is possible to display the current position of the lazer, and the layer currently read.

On a 'normal' standalone, you should be able to notice a little pause when you play the original DVD, between chapters 13 and 14.

It is theorically possible also to evaluate the length of the files on each layer, with the Entry VOBU sector of cell 14, and the length of the other files. But anyway, it's only an evaluation. So forget it.

Sorry, it was not a good idea.

[LIGHTNING UK!]

My old prog displays where the physical media layer break position is. Just look at the info panel on the right when in ISO Read mode.

Then in File mode, right click the _1.VOB file for that vts set and hit properties. That'll show you the start LBA of the file.

Then add the vobu start address of that cell (as displayed in pgcedit) to that file start lba, and it should match the physical layer break lba. (or be 1 sector either side of it because of how it's displayed / calculated).

[r0lZ]

Oh, sure, I forgot the capabilities of your 'old prog'! Thanks LUK!

[jinjin_jp]

Could you verify if this cell matches the real layer break position, in the original DVD?
Sorry to reply late.
About the example posted in #4, this cell matches the real layer break position, in the original DVD.

I calculated like below, thanks very much LIGHTNING UK!.

in ISO Read mode,
Layer Information:
Layer 0 Sectors: 1,366,448 (50.41%)
Layer 1 Sectors: 1,344,322 (49.59%)
or
First Physical Sector of Data Area: 196,608
Last Physical Sector of Data Area: 16,558,481
Last Physical Sector in Layer 0: 1,563,055
___calculation:1,563,055-196,608+1=1,366,448

in File mode,
the start LBA of the file(VTS_13_1.VOB)
788,177-1,312,436

displayed in pgcedit (posted in #4, Cell_37),
the vobu start address of that cell
578,271

So the start LBA of the cell (VTS_13_1-4.VOB, Cell_37)
788,177+578,271=1,366,448
this matches the real layer break position.

[Taelon]

My old prog displays where the physical media layer break position is. Just look at the info panel on the right when in ISO Read mode.DVDD, ISO Read Mode; Layer Information:
Layer 0 Sectors: 2,040,288 (50.76%)
Layer 1 Sectors: 1,978,881 (49.24%)
Then in File mode, right click the _1.VOB file for that vts set and hit properties. That'll show you the start LBA of the file.DVDD, File Mode; VTS_01_1.VTS, LBA: 133499 - 657700Then add the vobu start address of that cell (as displayed in pgcedit) to that file start lba, and it should match the physical layer break lba. (or be 1 sector either side of it because of how it's displayed / calculated).PgcEdit, PGC Editor - VTST1; Cell 14, Entry VOBU sector 1906789 as shown in Post #1

133499 + 1906789 = 2040288 a perfect match with the Layer Break. I knew there was LB info available in DVDD, but I wasn't sure what to do with it. Thanks alot for the explanation LIGHTNING UK!, I feel honored that you chose to reply to my thread. BTW your 'old prog' is still the best by far! :)

@r0lZ, as you can see the cell in question does match the physical LB in this case as well as jinjin_jp's example. So it would seem that dvd layer breaks are only considered 'seamless joints' unless there is a VOB change, which I still find curious and surprising.
.

[jinjin_jp]

Now I confirmed more example which is cell type flag=0, and found 5 examples.
(AVIATOR, BOURNE_IDENTITY, BOURNE_SUPREMACY, KUNG_FU_HUSTLE, THE_PHANTOM_OF_THE_OPERA)
And I happend to find the interesting example which is cell type flag=1.
(SPIDERMAN)
http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/8067/layerbreak05092420ml.th.jpg (http://img377.imageshack.us/my.php?image=layerbreak05092420ml.jpg)
This time I confirmed 7 DVDs, and only one is cell type flag=2.
But when I have confirmed like this about over 10 DVDs one years ago, all (except for post in #4, Lion King 3) were cell type flag=2.

[blutach]

Taelon's cell flag info looks entirely reasonable. Most of my DVDs are like this. Just untick it if you plan to pop it onto a DVD-5 with DVD Shrink or Rebuilder.

Regards