Welcome to Doom9's Forum, THE in-place to be for everyone interested in DVD conversion.

Before you start posting please read the forum rules. By posting to this forum you agree to abide by the rules.

 

Go Back   Doom9's Forum > Capturing and Editing Video > HDTV / DVB / TiVo

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 7th June 2004, 21:55   #1  |  Link
len0x
I'm afraid we've to stop
 
len0x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Amongst mad people
Posts: 5,400
Looking for 60fps FILM source

Does anyone have 60fps source which is in fact 24fps film and can be converted to it via:

SelectEven()
Decimate(5)

Please PM me if you need space to upload it to. Thanks.

P.S. It's been a while since I was working on analysis of sources, may be its time to pick it up again
__________________
Gordian Knot Family:
Gordian Knot: website, download
Auto Gordian Knot: Website and download, tutorial, FAQ
len0x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th June 2004, 02:46   #2  |  Link
Guest
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 21,924
http://neuron2.net/ipw-web/bulletin/...opic.php?t=361

There is a file linked there. But see the thread to understand why it is problematic to convert as you describe.
Guest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th June 2004, 12:47   #3  |  Link
SeeMoreDigital
Life looks better in HD
 
SeeMoreDigital's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Notts, UK
Posts: 11,211
I have an 800MB 720p @ 60fps file of the space shuttle launch. But I don't know if it started it's life from film.

It would be nice if there were more 720p 60fps clips about.


Cheers
__________________
| I've been testing hardware media playback devices and software A/V encoders and decoders since 2001 | My Network Layout & A/V Gear |
SeeMoreDigital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th June 2004, 13:29   #4  |  Link
len0x
I'm afraid we've to stop
 
len0x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Amongst mad people
Posts: 5,400
Quote:
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
I have an 800MB 720p @ 60fps file of the space shuttle launch. But I don't know if it started it's life from film.
I have it and its FILM but its not progressive source - it has to be properly IVTCed after SelectEven(). (although I might have 1080i version of it). Can you chop a small bit of it please ?
__________________
Gordian Knot Family:
Gordian Knot: website, download
Auto Gordian Knot: Website and download, tutorial, FAQ
len0x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th June 2004, 13:49   #5  |  Link
len0x
I'm afraid we've to stop
 
len0x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Amongst mad people
Posts: 5,400
Quote:
Originally posted by neuron2
There is a file linked there. But see the thread to understand why it is problematic to convert as you describe.
Getting it now, but I guess I can't really deal with it automatically like I was hoping to. I need more a pure FILM material (with repeated patterns).
__________________
Gordian Knot Family:
Gordian Knot: website, download
Auto Gordian Knot: Website and download, tutorial, FAQ
len0x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th June 2004, 14:45   #6  |  Link
SeeMoreDigital
Life looks better in HD
 
SeeMoreDigital's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Notts, UK
Posts: 11,211
Hi len0x,

I have not got the tools on this PC to cut segments from Mpeg2's. I've got the whole lot burned onto an 800MB CD~R so I can mail it to you, if you PM me with an address.

I must admit I find these 720p 60fps streams rather intriguing. And would like to know how they start their life. Do they start as, 24fps film converted directly to 60fps 720p Mpeg2. Or do they start as, 24fps film converted to 30fps 1080i Mpeg2 to 60fps 720p Mpeg2?

I suppose creating 30fps interlaced HD material into 60fps progressive could be done by turning each interlaced field into a full frame but why do this, unless it's to provide backward compatibility for viewers who don't have progressive receiving equipment?

From what I have read, technically an 720p image should look better than 1080i image despite the fact each frame carries less pixels. But why use 60 frames and not 30frames to do it?

Can one of you guys shed some light?


Cheers
__________________
| I've been testing hardware media playback devices and software A/V encoders and decoders since 2001 | My Network Layout & A/V Gear |
SeeMoreDigital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2004, 13:34   #7  |  Link
lord_malebolgia
Registered User
 
lord_malebolgia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7


Hi you might try this, it works for me with the lotr1 1280x720 60p ts stream:

LoadPlugin("E:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\MPEGDecoder.dll")
LoadPlugin("E:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\decomb521\decomb521.dll")
MPEGSource("Y:\!_Movies\absinth-tlotr.tfotra\absinthtlotr.tfotra.ts")
decimate(mode=0,cycle=2)
decimate(mode=0,cycle=5)

you get a nice 23,97 f/s stream
lord_malebolgia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2004, 13:37   #8  |  Link
len0x
I'm afraid we've to stop
 
len0x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Amongst mad people
Posts: 5,400
Quote:
Originally posted by lord_malebolgia


Hi you might try this, it works for me with the lotr1 1280x720 60p ts stream:
Where did you get the source from?
__________________
Gordian Knot Family:
Gordian Knot: website, download
Auto Gordian Knot: Website and download, tutorial, FAQ
len0x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2004, 15:23   #9  |  Link
lord_malebolgia
Registered User
 
lord_malebolgia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7


You can find it the newsgroups

you might want to use www.newzbin.com in order to find hdtv streams currently posted on usenet

Just search for "hdtv"

If you become a registered member you can find more and download the .nzb files for the newsbin usenetagent

I think currently tlotr can be found in a.b.hdtv

Beware, not all streams wich are posted there are ts or even 60 P you have to be lucky
lord_malebolgia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2004, 22:54   #10  |  Link
len0x
I'm afraid we've to stop
 
len0x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Amongst mad people
Posts: 5,400
Quote:
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
I have not got the tools on this PC to cut segments from Mpeg2's. I've got the whole lot burned onto an 800MB CD~R so I can mail it to you, if you PM me with an address.
Thanks for sending it to me. The source is a real progressive NTSC 30fps, I believe, shot on video. I don't see any duplicates there, so just SelectEven() works just fine. I was hoping to find something more challenging

@lord_malebolgia

For pure FILM sources there is no need to do decimate(2) as it supposed to be equvalent to SelectEven(), only slower.
__________________
Gordian Knot Family:
Gordian Knot: website, download
Auto Gordian Knot: Website and download, tutorial, FAQ
len0x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2004, 00:23   #11  |  Link
lord_malebolgia
Registered User
 
lord_malebolgia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7
Quote:
For pure FILM sources there is no need to do decimate(2) as it supposed to be equvalent to SelectEven(), only slower.
I tried selecteven(), the stream becomes very jerky.

I used:

selecteven()

wich produces a 29,97 f/s stream but in this stream I find duplicates frames wich are the source for the jerkyness


I used:

selecteven()
decimate(mode=0,cycle=5)

wich produces a 23,97 f/s stream wich is still jerky, the cause of this is also duplicate frames.

when i use

decimate(mode=0,cycle=2)
decimate(mode=0,cycle=5)

wich produces a 23,97 f/s stream witout any duplicates frames so this stream has no jerkyness at all.

the imortant thing is that i don't use normal decimate but mode=0 wich removes only duplicates. I used 2x decimate duplicates Because 1x would not remove all duplicates. This way works here because the original movie is 23,97 f/s and the ts-stream is a 59,97 f/s progressive stream wich wil reduced to its original framerate by just removing the duplicates.

Last edited by lord_malebolgia; 12th June 2004 at 00:26.
lord_malebolgia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2004, 06:20   #12  |  Link
SeeMoreDigital
Life looks better in HD
 
SeeMoreDigital's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Notts, UK
Posts: 11,211
Quote:
Originally posted by len0x
Thanks for sending it to me. The source is a real progressive NTSC 30fps, I believe, shot on video. I don't see any duplicates there, so just SelectEven() works just fine. I was hoping to find something more challenging
You would think with so many of us on the forum someones bound to have (and send you) what you want!

I tried quite a few 'non-script' based applications to try and half the frame rate of the 720p clip, but to no avail.

Trying to get 720p 'film' sources accurately back to film speed is going to be quite a feat.

I'll keep an eye out for some more clip and post them to you if find them.


Cheers
__________________
| I've been testing hardware media playback devices and software A/V encoders and decoders since 2001 | My Network Layout & A/V Gear |
SeeMoreDigital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2004, 07:13   #13  |  Link
eb
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Poland
Posts: 515
@ lenOx,
I converted the file that was mentioned by neuron2 above.
Using DVD2AVIT3 it was downsized to 640x360 from 1280x720 (to be able to playback on Athlon 2200+working 1794MHz and on GeForce 2 400mmx) but keeping frame rate at 60frames/s.Audio is orignal AC3 5.1.
VirtualDubMod was used to mux video and audio.
Convertion was done in 1-pass mode by 3ivx with bitrate 200x8.
No filters were used.
I am interested what is your opinion about it.

Sample mmmm.avi 1:22 (25MB) on:
ftp://www.eb.enterpol.pl
user: www.eb.enterpol.pl
password : eb

eb
eb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2004, 10:05   #14  |  Link
lord_malebolgia
Registered User
 
lord_malebolgia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7
Quote:
Thanks for sending it to me. The source is a real progressive NTSC 30fps, I believe, shot on video. I don't see any duplicates there, so just SelectEven() works just fine. I was hoping to find something more challenging
I am going to make a 60 second sample 1280x720p 60f/s xvid 3000 kbs.
Afterwards I wil create a 23,976 sample from this stream.
My intend is to post both samples in "alt.binaries.hdtv".
the size of the post is about 50 mb. I wil "rar and par" those samples for saftey.
The header will be "ATTN:lenOx"
password for rar will be "lenOx"

Is it possible for you to get it there ?
Or do you have enough email space so i send it to you directly?

I have chosen this sample because of the smooth movement it contains.
With the avisynth script mentioned in my replies (59,976 -> 23,976) i get about 3 to 11 f/s with a P4 1.8Ghz

the reason for using xvid is it can be played in native resolution on the XBOX media center wich can give the HDTV component video-out in 720p. 1280x720 is also the native resolution of the beamer I use for watching movies. I can tell you watching this on the beamer changed my view on DVD....its time for HD-DVD
lord_malebolgia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2004, 11:31   #15  |  Link
len0x
I'm afraid we've to stop
 
len0x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Amongst mad people
Posts: 5,400
Quote:
Originally posted by lord_malebolgia
I am going to make a 60 second sample 1280x720p 60f/s xvid 3000 kbs.
Afterwards I wil create a 23,976 sample from this stream.
My intend is to post both samples in "alt.binaries.hdtv".
the size of the post is about 50 mb. I wil "rar and par" those samples for saftey.
The header will be "ATTN:lenOx"
password for rar will be "lenOx"

Is it possible for you to get it there ?
Or do you have enough email space so i send it to you directly?
Can you make a bigger sample ~ 200Mb and upload to my ftp (I'll PM you with details)? Coz my analysis routine is running over 10% of the source, so the longer it is - the better.

@EB I'll grab you sources on Monday (I have no good internet connection on the weekends) and have a look as well.
__________________
Gordian Knot Family:
Gordian Knot: website, download
Auto Gordian Knot: Website and download, tutorial, FAQ
len0x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2004, 11:45   #16  |  Link
lord_malebolgia
Registered User
 
lord_malebolgia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 7
Quote:
Can you make a bigger sample ~ 200Mb and upload to my ftp (I'll PM you with details)?
OK

my upload speed is 32Kbyte/s
so it might take a while
lord_malebolgia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th June 2004, 12:18   #17  |  Link
Zep
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 587
Quote:
Originally posted by len0x
Thanks for sending it to me. The source is a real progressive NTSC 30fps, I believe, shot on video. I don't see any duplicates there, so just SelectEven() works just fine. I was hoping to find something more challenging
haha ask DG to send you the the 60 FPS 1280 x 720p I just sent him

Selecteven() will DESTROY it and Decimate(5) with nuke it even worse.
In fact DG has had to write a whole new decimate for these wacko patterns.

go read this thread for more info

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=77798
Zep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th June 2004, 12:25   #18  |  Link
SeeMoreDigital
Life looks better in HD
 
SeeMoreDigital's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Notts, UK
Posts: 11,211
Quote:
Originally posted by len0x
Can you make a bigger sample ~ 200Mb and upload to my ftp (I'll PM you with details)? Coz my analysis routine is running over 10% of the source, so the longer it is - the better.
I would not mind a copy of this too!

Can somebody PM me with download info please?


Cheers
__________________
| I've been testing hardware media playback devices and software A/V encoders and decoders since 2001 | My Network Layout & A/V Gear |
SeeMoreDigital is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th June 2004, 12:36   #19  |  Link
len0x
I'm afraid we've to stop
 
len0x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Amongst mad people
Posts: 5,400
Quote:
Originally posted by Zep
go read this thread for more info
sounds interesting indeed!
It would help a lot to have universal Decimate. My problem though is not to find out how to decimate properly, but just if I need to decimate at all in automatic way (i.e. without looking at the source manually). That's why I'm looking for sources with dupes for analysis.
__________________
Gordian Knot Family:
Gordian Knot: website, download
Auto Gordian Knot: Website and download, tutorial, FAQ
len0x is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th June 2004, 12:40   #20  |  Link
len0x
I'm afraid we've to stop
 
len0x's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Amongst mad people
Posts: 5,400
Quote:
Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Can somebody PM me with download info please?
As soon as it gets uploaded - I'll contact you. So far I don't see anything going my way
__________________
Gordian Knot Family:
Gordian Knot: website, download
Auto Gordian Knot: Website and download, tutorial, FAQ
len0x is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 20:28.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.