AR and Kiss Players... again...

[len0x]

It's a known fact that Kiss players cannot properly display DivX/XviD videos which are playing fine on PC. While I was searching for more info about it I came across the following problems:

- Kiss players have issues with playing less than DVD resolutions (i.e. resized)
- Kiss players doesn't compensate for non-square pixels on TV
- Kiss players are not properly stretching widescreen videos
- Kiss players cannot display full screen video on 16:9 screens

Last one is my observation while I was playing with Kiss 1000. I couldn't get the player not to stretch the width by 1.33 and therefore display full screen on my widescreen monitor. It looked like I always have to have anamorphic encode, but what to do if source is not anamorphic? Make it anamorphic anyway ?

Actually what I'm asking owners of Kiss players is:
- are all those issues still exists in some players with currrent firmware?
- does video has less issues on 4:3 TV, rather then 16:9?
- how ppl are doing the rips for their standalones?

As I'm doing solutions which are supposed to work on standalones I'm interested in solving all sorts of issues standalones have atm.

[goofer456]

I receive my KISS dp-1000 tomorrow. Will check some encodes I made with AutoGK 0.8 and report back.

[len0x]

thanks, goofer456.

Anyone else? I can't believe noone has Kiss players...

[goofer456]

Originally posted by len0x
thanks, goofer456.

Anyone else? I can't believe noone has Kiss players...

Received the DP-1000 just 5 minutes ago. Will report back asap. Sorry for the delay.

[goofer456]

After getting the kids in bed I finally had some time to play around

2 CD encodes (1400 KB) work like a charm! I burn 3 encodes on one DVD and see almost now difference with an orginal DVD. Burn't in subs work also great. I use the included Xvid build by the way

1 CD encode (700Kb) with xvid is nice but give some marcoblocks with action scenes.

So far I am very happy with the combo AutoGK and Kiss Dp-1000!

Len0x: Please advise if you want me to check with specific settings.

[goofer456]

Originally posted by len0x
Actually what I'm asking owners of Kiss players is:
- are all those issues still exists in some players with currrent firmware?
- does video has less issues on 4:3 TV, rather then 16:9?
- how ppl are doing the rips for their standalones?

As I'm doing solutions which are supposed to work on standalones I'm interested in solving all sorts of issues standalones have atm.

*bump*

@len0x: See previous post

[len0x]

a couple of questions:

- do you use 4:3 or 16:9 TV for output ?
- do you see slight horizontal stretching of the image (probably due to the fact that pixels on TV are not squares like on monitors)

[goofer456]

Hi Len0x,

Thanks for taking the time to react on my post.

Originally posted by len0x
a couple of questions:

- do you use 4:3 or 16:9 TV for output ?

I use 16:9

- do you see slight horizontal stretching of the image (probably due to the fact that pixels on TV are not squares like on monitors)

Yes, although I can fix this with the TV itself which results in loosing part of the subtitles (outside of the screen)

I also encountered some slight stuttering with an encode with a width of 700+ (forget the exact width). I now encode with a fixed width of 576 which works great.

It seems that the existing KiSS players lack the horse power to cope with high-res encodes.

[len0x]

Originally posted by goofer456
I use 16:9

Oh, so you have ability to stretch the image on TV itself ? Coz I don't and all 1.85AR encodes look like 2.35AR

[goofer456]

Originally posted by len0x
Oh, so you have ability to stretch the image on TV itself ? Coz I don't and all 1.85AR encodes look like 2.35AR

Yup. I have the following "modes" on my tv (philips):

4:3
16:9
16:9 subtitles (handy when the subtitles don't show completly)
Superzoom

With Superzoom the image is very streched in some cases. My wife always thinks here favorite actors have become "fat"

[SeeMoreDigital]

I think a fairly obvious question needs to be asked!

What image pixel frame sizes are the encodes you guys have used?

Cheers

[goofer456]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
I think a fairly obvious question needs to be asked!

What image pixel frame sizes are the encodes you guys have used?

Cheers

Sorry if I look like a complete n00b:

Do you mean the resolution of the enncode? If so than the answer is that I encode @ 576 fixed width and AutoGK selects 306 for the height. So 576x306. I have other encodes with different sizes however.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by goofer456
Sorry if I look like a complete n00b:

Do you mean the resolution of the enncode? If so than the answer is that I encode @ 576 fixed width and AutoGK selects 306 for the height. So 576x306. I have other encodes with different sizes however.

Yes, that's what I meant!

This tell me that your encode has an 'frame sise' aspect ratio of 1.88:1 (which is very close to what your 16:9 (or 1.77:1) TV likes - 16 divided by 9 equals 1.77:1).

Now, is your 576x306 encode all image/picture. Or do you have some black mattes above and below the picture as well?

Cheers

[goofer456]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
Yes, that's what I meant!

This tell me that your encode has an 'frame sise' aspect ratio of 1.88:1 (which is very close to what your 16:9 (or 1.77:1) TV likes - 16 divided by 9 equals 1.77:1).

Now, is your 576x306 encode all image/picture. Or do you have some black mattes above and below the picture as well?

Cheers

Yes, the encodos do not have black borders above/below the image, but are full picture.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by goofer456
Complete picture.

That's OK then!

Things start getting a little more confusing when say, an 2.35:1 picture is 'overlaid' onto an 1.77:1 background. And even more confusing when say, an anamorphic 2.35:1 picture is 'overlaid' onto an 1.77:1 anamorphic 1.77:1 background!

What happens when you spin a 2.35:1 cropped and resized encode. Do you have any of these?

If not I will put some examples on my WebSite!

Cheers

[goofer456]

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
That's OK then!

Things start getting a little more confusing when say, an 2.35:1 picture is 'overlaid' onto an 1.77:1 background. And even more confusing when say, an anamorphic 2.35:1 picture is 'overlaid' onto an 1.77:1 anamorphic 1.77:1 background!

What happens when you spin a 2.35:1 cropped and resized encode. Do you have any of these?

If not I will put some examples on my WebSite!

Cheers

I don't have any 2.35:1 cropped and resized encode. If you can provide me with a dl link I will be happy to test it.

[SeeMoreDigital]

Originally posted by goofer456
I don't have any 2.35:1 cropped and resized encode. If you can provide me with a dl link I will be happy to test it.

OK I've added some encodes to my WebSite and navigate to 'Area 51 - Test Encodes'

Please note that the encodes that contain more than 414,720 pixels (ie 05 and 07) will work on an stand-alone player!

Cheers

EDIT: You might be lucky encode 05 should play

[goofer456]

Will try it when I get home from work this evening.

[len0x]

Originally posted by goofer456
Yup. I have the following "modes" on my tv (philips):

4:3
16:9

I might be loosing you here. Kiss 1000 ignores output AR setting for divx/xvid. So it can be corrected only on TV. I do have those modes on mine as well, but:

1) say you have 4:3 divx
say you have TV in 4:3 mode
Everything plays ok
2) now switch TV into 16:9 mode and you will see that it will stretch picture horizontally: no-go here.

3) say you have 16:9 divx
say you have TV in 4:3 mode
I can see everything perfect apart from the fact that I have black borders left and right (well, 4:3 mode)

4) switch TV into 16:9 and it only stretches image horizontally, leaving vertical resolution intact which results in flat distorted image...

So how do you manage to play widescreen videos full screen with perfect AR is beyong my understanding
(unless your TV has only vertical stretch, which obviously can fix the problem)

P.S. do you have auto-stretch enabled in Kiss setup ? which firmware are you running?

P.P.S. this problem was actually admitted by Kiss guys themselves...

[goofer456]

Originally posted by len0x
I might be loosing you here. Kiss 1000 ignores output AR setting for divx/xvid. So it can be corrected only on TV. I do have those modes on mine as well, but:

1) say you have 4:3 divx
say you have TV in 4:3 mode
Everything plays ok
2) now switch TV into 16:9 mode and you will see that it will stretch picture horizontally: no-go here.

3) say you have 16:9 divx
say you have TV in 4:3 mode
I can see everything perfect apart from the fact that I have black borders left and right (well, 4:3 mode)

4) switch TV into 16:9 and it only stretches image horizontally, leaving vertical resolution intact which results in flat distorted image...

So how do you manage to play widescreen videos full screen with perfect AR is beyong my understanding
(unless your TV has only vertical stretch, which obviously can fix the problem)

P.S. do you have auto-stretch enabled in Kiss setup ? which firmware are you running?

P.P.S. this problem was actually admitted by Kiss guys themselves...

Ok my misunderstanding (again I am relatively a n00b to this matter)

The "modes" on my TV and the results are exactly as you describe them. Sorry if I was unclear.