Welcome to Doom9's Forum, THE in-place to be for everyone interested in DVD conversion.

Before you start posting please read the forum rules. By posting to this forum you agree to abide by the rules.

 

Go Back   Doom9's Forum > Video Encoding > MPEG-4 AVC / H.264

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 22nd July 2008, 17:22   #261  |  Link
ncahammer
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoRd_MuldeR View Post
If you want to achieve a certain level of quality, then use CRF. If you need to hit a certain target filesize then use 2-Pass. That's it.
I don't want neither.
I don't want to waste bitrate or quality or media.
For example the problem is find out how many episodes of a series do fit in a DVD5, with a transparent (or close to it) quality and then encode targeting the DVD5 size or to align the encoded size of a movie to a DVD5/4 units.

Anyway, back on topic, I already do what you suggested on non-Psy builds, but it seems that I cannot balance it on "psy Rdo" builds. I don't have a starting point and numbers don't mean much any more. Must be something I am missing.

Thanks
ncahammer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd July 2008, 17:27   #262  |  Link
LoRd_MuldeR
Software Developer
 
LoRd_MuldeR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Last House on Slunk Street
Posts: 12,756
Find out which CRF value still gives acceptable quality for you. Then encode all your episodes with that CRF value.
Finally put as many episodes on the disc, as fit on the disc. That's it...
__________________
There was of course no way of knowing whether you were being watched at any given moment.
How often, or on what system, the Thought Police plugged in on any individual wire was guesswork.


LoRd_MuldeR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th July 2008, 12:17   #263  |  Link
Sharktooth
Mr. Sandman
 
Sharktooth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Haddonfield, IL
Posts: 11,768
line 273 please add:
\n after Does nothing at subme < 6.
Sharktooth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th July 2008, 12:27   #264  |  Link
bob0r
Pain and suffering
 
bob0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharktooth View Post
line 273 please add:
\n after Does nothing at subme < 6.
Dark has already fixed this "internally".
Also the 1.00000 value is fixed to 1.0 i guess.
bob0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th July 2008, 15:31   #265  |  Link
Dark Shikari
x264 developer
 
Dark Shikari's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 8,690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharktooth View Post
line 273 please add:
\n after Does nothing at subme < 6.
I have a couple minor fixes of the sort in my internal code tree--no point in releasing a new version for that yet.
Dark Shikari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th July 2008, 11:09   #266  |  Link
Revgen
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Near LA, California, USA
Posts: 1,543
Is "Turbo" in MeGUI a good option to use with PsyRDO?

Will it affect the quality significantly? Some posts here mention that settings need to be the same on both passes.
__________________
Pirate: Now how would you like to die? Would you like to have your head chopped off or be burned at the stake?

Curly: Burned at the stake!

Moe: Why?

Curly: A hot steak is always better than a cold chop.
Revgen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th July 2008, 15:12   #267  |  Link
Sharktooth
Mr. Sandman
 
Sharktooth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Haddonfield, IL
Posts: 11,768
Turbo option just speeds up the first pass.
it does it using different (lower) settings than the second pass. that means a very slight final quality loss but a huge gain in first pass speed.

Last edited by Sharktooth; 29th July 2008 at 13:38.
Sharktooth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th July 2008, 18:48   #268  |  Link
smok3
brontosaurusrex
 
smok3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 2,359
Sharktooth; looking at the insane profile, isn't trellis disabled there by default? (with psyrdo version of x264 i mean)?
__________________
certain other member
smok3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th July 2008, 18:52   #269  |  Link
LoRd_MuldeR
Software Developer
 
LoRd_MuldeR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Last House on Slunk Street
Posts: 12,756
Only Trellis=1 is disabled when Psy RDO is on, Trellis=2 works just fine with Psy RDO ...
__________________
There was of course no way of knowing whether you were being watched at any given moment.
How often, or on what system, the Thought Police plugged in on any individual wire was guesswork.



Last edited by LoRd_MuldeR; 27th July 2008 at 18:55.
LoRd_MuldeR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 13:37   #270  |  Link
Vit
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3
I've encoded full STEM clip at 15 MBits/s using this patch and Sonic CineVision 2.6. Sonic's encode is consistently better, am I doing something wrong or commercial encoders are not as crappy as some x264 apologists claim?

Here's the command line:
x264.910.modified.exe --pass 1 --fps 23.976 --bitrate 15000 --level 4.1 --keyint 24 --min-keyint 1 --ref 3 --mixed-refs --no-fast-pskip --bframes 2 --b-pyramid --bime --weightb --filter -2,-2 --subme 6 --analyse p8x8,b8x8,i4x4,i8x8 --8x8dct --vbv-bufsize 45000 --vbv-maxrate 30000 --threads auto --thread-input --progress --no-dct-decimate --output "f:\stem_x264.264" "F:\Source Files\StEM_full.yuv" 1920x1080 --aq-mode 2

Second's pass settings are the same, but with --pass 2. I can post some pictures if anyone is interested
Vit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 13:42   #271  |  Link
Sharktooth
Mr. Sandman
 
Sharktooth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Haddonfield, IL
Posts: 11,768
why did you use min-keyint 1 and keyint 24, only 2 b-frames, filter -2,-2, VBV limits, etc?
however look at the comparisons x264 is way better than commercial encoders.

Last edited by Sharktooth; 29th July 2008 at 13:45.
Sharktooth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 13:58   #272  |  Link
Vit
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharktooth View Post
however look at the comparisons x264 is way better than commercial encoders.
Laughing out loud. That's perfect argument
Vit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 14:01   #273  |  Link
Sharktooth
Mr. Sandman
 
Sharktooth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Haddonfield, IL
Posts: 11,768
laugh whenever you want. you're a n00b and not even able to set up an encoder correctly and you're still talkin? get out or learn something before speaking.
and, yes, it's a fair comparison made by competent ppl, not incompetent ppl like you.
x264 also won the last doom9 codec comparison... so better SEARCH before speaking as per forum rules.
if you came here for insulting the devs hard work then you're NOT welcome.

Last edited by Sharktooth; 29th July 2008 at 14:47.
Sharktooth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 14:55   #274  |  Link
Manao
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: France
Posts: 2,856
Sharktooth : VBV & gop restriction come probably from Bluray constraints, so he can't avoid them. And imho, you're overreacting (and that's an understatement)

Vit : I don't remember Bluray preventing you from using 3 bframes in a row. And VBV bufsize, iirc, is half a second, thus 15000, not 45000.
__________________
Manao is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 14:58   #275  |  Link
Dark Shikari
x264 developer
 
Dark Shikari's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 8,690
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vit View Post
I've encoded full STEM clip at 15 MBits/s using this patch and Sonic CineVision 2.6. Sonic's encode is consistently better, am I doing something wrong or commercial encoders are not as crappy as some x264 apologists claim?

Here's the command line:
x264.910.modified.exe --pass 1 --fps 23.976 --bitrate 15000 --level 4.1 --keyint 24 --min-keyint 1 --ref 3 --mixed-refs --no-fast-pskip --bframes 2 --b-pyramid --bime --weightb --filter -2,-2 --subme 6 --analyse p8x8,b8x8,i4x4,i8x8 --8x8dct --vbv-bufsize 45000 --vbv-maxrate 30000 --threads auto --thread-input --progress --no-dct-decimate --output "f:\stem_x264.264" "F:\Source Files\StEM_full.yuv" 1920x1080 --aq-mode 2

Second's pass settings are the same, but with --pass 2. I can post some pictures if anyone is interested
So basically:

1. You use awful settings and wonder why the output sucks (sorry folks, but I'm not going to make x264 compensate for user stupidity here).
2. Instead of asking "how can I make these settings better", you start whining about "x264 apologists"...

Now, if what you actually meant was "How can I improve the quality of my output" and you just mistyped, try this instead:

x264.910.modified.exe --pass 1 --fps 23.976 --bitrate 15000 --level 4.1 --ref 4 --mixed-refs --no-fast-pskip --bframes 3 --b-pyramid --me umh --mixed-refs --bime --weightb --filter -2,-2 --subme 7 --b-rdo --8x8dct --threads auto --progress --no-dct-decimate --output "f:\stem_x264.264" "F:\Source Files\StEM_full.yuv" 1920x1080

15 megabit 1080p is a rather bad place to compare at though, given that any decent encoder should be able to basically give transparency, and if you can't pick out the details between two encodes without using a microscope, its hard to compare them.

Last edited by Dark Shikari; 29th July 2008 at 15:17.
Dark Shikari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 15:05   #276  |  Link
cogman
The Crazy Idahoan
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Idaho
Posts: 233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharktooth View Post
laugh whenever you want. you're a n00b and not even able to set up an encoder correctly and you're still talkin? get out or learn something before speaking.
and, yes, it's a fair comparison made by competent ppl, not incompetent ppl like you.
x264 also won the last doom9 codec comparison... so better SEARCH before speaking as per forum rules.
if you came here for insulting the devs hard work then you're NOT welcome.
now now, be careful lest you violate rule #4

Though, VIT Sharktooth is right, x264 when given the proper settings is a miracle worker. Try the settings that he gave you and see if there is any improvement.
cogman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 15:09   #277  |  Link
DarkZell666
aka XaS
 
DarkZell666's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: France
Posts: 1,122
- Any screenshots and the details of the settings you used in CineVision to share ?
- CineVision isn't the only commercial encoder out there, so maybe you are right and it might well be better than other commercial encoders, but those have indeed been proven weaker than x264, you can't deny it. But the former also needs proving with pictures or samples

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vit View Post
I've encoded full STEM clip at 15 MBits/s using this patch and Sonic CineVision 2.6. Sonic's encode is consistently better, am I doing something wrong or commercial encoders are not as crappy as some x264 apologists claim?

Here's the command line:
x264.910.modified.exe --pass 1 --fps 23.976 --bitrate 15000 --level 4.1 --keyint 24 --min-keyint 1 --ref 3 --mixed-refs --no-fast-pskip --bframes 2 --b-pyramid --bime --weightb --filter -2,-2 --subme 6 --analyse p8x8,b8x8,i4x4,i8x8 --8x8dct --vbv-bufsize 45000 --vbv-maxrate 30000 --threads auto --thread-input --progress --no-dct-decimate --output "f:\stem_x264.264" "F:\Source Files\StEM_full.yuv" 1920x1080 --aq-mode 2

Second's pass settings are the same, but with --pass 2. I can post some pictures if anyone is interested
__________________

Q9300 OC @ 3.2ghz / Asus P5E3 / 4GB PC10600 / Geforce 8600 GTS
DarkZell666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 15:24   #278  |  Link
smok3
brontosaurusrex
 
smok3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 2,359
I think Vit is targeting bluray? (--keyint 24)
__________________
certain other member
smok3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2008, 16:59   #279  |  Link
Dethis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by smok3 View Post
I think Vit is targeting bluray? (--keyint 24)
If so, he should set
vbv-baffsize 30000 (1 sec),
vbv-maxrate up to the smaller among 40000 or 48000 minus the required bitrate by the sound tracks subtitles etc.
Dethis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2008, 02:01   #280  |  Link
Sharktooth
Mr. Sandman
 
Sharktooth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Haddonfield, IL
Posts: 11,768
he could also use 3 bframes (it's ok with blu-ray and could give a major boost in quality), eliminate --no-dct-decimate (that often results in bigger filesize hence worse quality for a bitrate based RC) and --no-fast-pskip, higher the deblocking (-2,-2 often means blocks), -b-rdo and -me umh are missing but he used other useless slow options (like --no-fast-pskip or --no-dct-decimation), --aq-mode 2 is redundant since it's the default, also the VBV paramaters are completely wrong... that shows he is incompetent (so my comment even if may sound a bit harsh is not an offense, it's just the reality). He shown he doesnt know anything about x264 coz he set the options almost randomly and he is still offending ppl and destructively criticizing x264 and the devs work without even asking if he was doing something wrong...
he joined the forum on march 2007 so he had all the time to document himself but obviously he didnt. He made 3 posts of which 2, in this thread, contain insults and are plain provocations...
IMHO if he keeps that behaviour he better find another place.

OT: anyone knows the AVC-HD exact vbv-buffsize?

Last edited by Sharktooth; 30th July 2008 at 02:22.
Sharktooth is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
psy-rd, psyrdo

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 15:48.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.