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Old 14th November 2006, 19:02   #1  |  Link
Suchy
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Remove grain in Anime

Hi.

I have some anime with quite strong grain/noise. I try remove it by various AVISynth filters but always effect is not enough good.


I tried and I've got this problems:
- Convolution3D (anime BQ or LQ or HQ)
>> grain still exists

- Deen (a3d +a2d)
>> edges are frayed

- frfun3b, 3d, 7
>> lose details and edges

- MSmooth
>> lose details and smooth black lines

- removegrainSSE3 (mode 17, 18)
>> fading aren't smooth

- FluxSmooth + TemporalSmoother
>> fading aren't smooth

- sPresso
>> grain still exists

Moreover there often appear moving or appearing&disappearing blocks in colour very similar to background.



After filtering I compress it by 1 pass quant 2 (enabled: Chroma optimizer, trellis, CartoonMode, Matrix: H263, all quants ranges: 2-31)


Any ideas or presets filters for removing, grain?

I Can upload some sources to check this.
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Old 14th November 2006, 20:25   #2  |  Link
Daodan
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Obviuosly, you can't have a perfect denoiser that removes just what you think it's noise. A very small amount of noise should be preserved to prevent banding (at reasonable bitrate). Also you may try a masked frfun to keep it off the edges, or maybe vaquedenoiser (these two are very powerfull). hqdn3d is also a pretty good choice for mild denoising.
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Old 15th November 2006, 00:29   #3  |  Link
Suchy
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I know that it isn't possible to have perfect denoising, but I search optimal. Thank you very much. I try with vaquedenoiser. If results will no been enough good, then I upload short sample for better visualisation a problem.
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Old 15th November 2006, 04:30   #4  |  Link
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I regularly use DeGrainMedian() or FFT3DFilter(sigma=1 to 3,bw=32,bh=32,bt=3,ow=16,oh=16) with good results.
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Old 17th November 2006, 14:12   #5  |  Link
DarkZell666
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For anime hqdn3d() is my favorite, it's jolly fast and works marvels.
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Old 17th November 2006, 17:15   #6  |  Link
Suchy
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SSE3 Removegrain(mode=1) as faster UnDot alternative + DeGrainMedian + optional Convolution3D works great.

I will check this second anime with noise which is much harder to remove.

I try hqdn3d() and FFT3DFilter on sigma 2.

Thanks.
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Old 20th February 2007, 12:39   #7  |  Link
martino
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Sorry for picking up this old thread, but my own experiences are:

1) HQDN3D - In high motion areas it seems to remove too much detail and blur the picture by quite a fair margin.

2) FFT3D - In most cases it works wonders. It's very strong, but it does get rid of some detail which should be left intact (like thin lines in dark areas). Also, the blurring effect is quite noticeable, so the picture has to be sharpened afterwards.

3) Deen - It just simply gets rid of too much detail.

4) VagueDenoiser - So far I have found it to be the best option for a compromise between denoising and preserving small detail.

5) Coming soon...

I have quite an interesting source for this kind of experiments, so I might post some pictures later on once I get home.
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Old 20th February 2007, 14:13   #8  |  Link
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Please do. Sounds interesting.
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Old 20th February 2007, 14:48   #9  |  Link
DarkZell666
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- I've seen VagueDenoiser introduce what looks like dot crawl on sources that didn't have any at all to begin with, so I'll stay definately away from that one.

- hqdn3d() can be tweaked (no need to keep the strong defaults if you have near-clean anime already), and is just so fast compared to the others that I prefer it over, say, fft3dfilter. hqdn3d() is also implemented directly in mencoder (and since I use that very often I don't need to use avisynth at all in most cases ).

- you might want to invest some time in motion-compensated and area-based stuff (cf. MVTools & MaskTools) to get cleaner results. All depends on how much detail you're prepared to discard (you'll discard some detail no matter what you try anyway ).
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Last edited by DarkZell666; 20th February 2007 at 14:51.
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Old 20th February 2007, 14:48   #10  |  Link
Mug Funky
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fft3d can be gentle if you allow it. play with the sigma value - lowering it will get you more detail, but more noise.

setting bt=0 and having a very low sigma (less than 1 normally) should be a good help.

most of the anime i get is clean though for live action i'll use a combo of clouded's simplewarpcompensate and kassandro's removedirt. helps compressibility heaps, and doesn't (much) change the look of the input - if it's grainy it'll stay grainy, just a friendlier grain that is much more digestible to an encoder.
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Old 20th February 2007, 21:48   #11  |  Link
martino
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Here it is: http://martino.8888mb.com/removegrainanime2.htm

Source, VagueDenoiser and FFT3DFilter for now. I will add more later on, and hopefully put it into a table for better comparison.

Also, you have to note that I've been using AVS for something like 3 or 4 months, so please have patience with me.


EDIT: I have changed the link to the new updated HTML with tables.

Last edited by martino; 20th February 2007 at 22:29.
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Old 21st February 2007, 21:42   #12  |  Link
martino
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Sorry for this double post, but look no further than FRFun3d. It works wonders, I won't even bother adding more screencaps to that page that I made. You just have to play around with it, and use mild settings. That's when I found it working at it's best...
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Old 22nd February 2007, 07:51   #13  |  Link
DarkZell666
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From what I gathered using FrFunXX, the FrFun7() version is faster but doesn't filter exactly in the same way.
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