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Old 2nd October 2006, 23:14   #1  |  Link
shon3i
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Explanation for new switches in x264

Can somebody explain new switches in x264

--direct-8x8 <-1|0|1>
--deadzone-inter <int>
--deadzone-intra <int>

and can it improve picture in low-mid bitrate encoding?
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Old 2nd October 2006, 23:20   #2  |  Link
Kostarum Rex Persia
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That's good question. Sharktooth, can you or Bond explain there switches?

Thank you.
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Old 2nd October 2006, 23:28   #3  |  Link
Sirber
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I'm interrested to know too. For RealAnime
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Old 2nd October 2006, 23:46   #4  |  Link
IgorC
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--direct-8x8 for better HD-DVD compability.
--deadzone to increase detail level at high bitrates. Noises, filmgrain another misc. details
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Old 2nd October 2006, 23:49   #5  |  Link
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so what would be good examples when to use deadzone (bitrate or which crf number) and what value to enter there then?
btw. i cant see those options to be toggled in megui, hasnt the gui been updated for this yet ?

Last edited by Thunderbolt8; 2nd October 2006 at 23:54.
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Old 3rd October 2006, 00:21   #6  |  Link
Sirber
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Does --direct-8x8 change the quality? or it's just a comptability flag?
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Old 3rd October 2006, 07:18   #7  |  Link
foxyshadis
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Yes, turning it off will probably slightly lower the quality. I have no idea how much or little though. In the past it's always been on (when allowed), but not exposed as an option.
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Old 3rd October 2006, 07:23   #8  |  Link
akupenguin
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In the past it has always been off whenever possible, even when that violated Levels, (under the assumption that off was better quality). Then I ran some tests and found that it had no measurable effect on quality one way or the other, so I fixed it to be compliant.

Last edited by akupenguin; 3rd October 2006 at 08:09.
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Old 3rd October 2006, 07:38   #9  |  Link
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Oh, I must not have looked back enough in the sources, since it looked like it could be set on in the old diffs. Sorry!
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Old 3rd October 2006, 15:22   #10  |  Link
AlexW
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Hi everybody.

As IgorC said --deadzone should help to preserve more fine details and film grain at medium - high bitrates, i would suggest that people start by tweaking --deadzone-intra because that seems to make the most difference here, the default value for --deadzone-intra is 11 but something closer to 0 should help detail preservation a bit, it might also be beneficial to combine it with a CQM.
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Old 3rd October 2006, 19:36   #11  |  Link
Sharktooth
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Uhm... doing some usual movie trailers encodings...
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Old 3rd October 2006, 19:42   #12  |  Link
virus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexW
Hi everybody.
OMG he has talked

(9 patches committed to x264's SVN, 6 posts. this guy must have a zipper instead of a mouth )
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Old 3rd October 2006, 20:40   #13  |  Link
lexor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexW View Post
Hi everybody.

[...] --deadzone should help to preserve more fine details and film grain at medium - high bitrates [...]
what would you define as medium to high.

for me >3mbps is high, 1.5-3mbps is medium and <1.5mbps is low (this is where most my encodes are). So is the switch unlikely to affect me, or are your numbers lower for respective ranges?

this info should be put in some sticky, I hear people all the time saying low/mid/high bitrate, those words mean nothing without numbers.
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Last edited by lexor; 3rd October 2006 at 20:58.
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Old 3rd October 2006, 21:00   #14  |  Link
Sharktooth
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when someone generalizes on the bitrate, it means a number would be useless.
It ALL depends on the source compressibility.
Think it this way:
ultralow bitrate = the encoding looks like crap.
low bitrate = the encoding looks acceptable but certainly not good.
mid bitrate = the encoding looks good but it's not perfect.
high bitrate = the encoding looks near perfect.
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Old 3rd October 2006, 21:02   #15  |  Link
Sharktooth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexW View Post
Hi everybody.

As IgorC said --deadzone should help to preserve more fine details and film grain at medium - high bitrates, i would suggest that people start by tweaking --deadzone-intra because that seems to make the most difference here, the default value for --deadzone-intra is 11 but something closer to 0 should help detail preservation a bit, it might also be beneficial to combine it with a CQM.
Can you please also specify the encoding time relation between default values and user set values>
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Old 3rd October 2006, 21:21   #16  |  Link
lexor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharktooth View Post
when someone generalizes on the bitrate, it means a number would be useless.
It ALL depends on the source compressibility.
Think it this way:
ultralow bitrate = the encoding looks like crap.
low bitrate = the encoding looks acceptable but certainly not good.
mid bitrate = the encoding looks good but it's not perfect.
high bitrate = the encoding looks near perfect.
hmm an interesting rating system, quite different from what I do (especially since the thing you rated high is, to my taste, unachievable withing x264+DVD5 limits).

DVD5 = great movie that I'd watch over and over
1/2 DVD5 = a (cult)classic that wouldn't be watched more then a few times a year (if that)
1 CD - 1/3 DVD5 = movie is worth a chuckle, but not the bitrate

this farily stably derives the value ranges I gave above.

Series are of course exempt from the above.
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Last edited by lexor; 3rd October 2006 at 21:24.
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Old 3rd October 2006, 21:25   #17  |  Link
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Just to give people a bit more of an idea of what deadzone does; Deadzone determines how much "insignificant" information is droped. Higher values of deadzone help avoid artifacts by eliminating useless information at lower bitrates, and freeing up the bitrate that information would have used - to keep more important information with better quality. Lower values preserve more of the original source information, but to reach a given bitrate that information will have to be compressed more then if a higher value of deadzone was used.

Higher values of deadzone will give a cleaner, smoother, less detailed look, while lower values will give a noisier, crisper, higher detail look, similar to older mpeg varients.

Edit: updated the description of deadzones effect, after preliminary testing 6 seems to have about the same detail preservation as Xvid.

Last edited by *.mp4 guy; 3rd October 2006 at 23:28.
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Old 3rd October 2006, 22:42   #18  |  Link
Thunderbolt8
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again my question, i cant find that in megui, so is this implented in the x264 installer only to be found on x264.nl ? if so, will this implemention also be done for the megui (or if its already there enlighten me plz how I can find it).
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Old 3rd October 2006, 22:54   #19  |  Link
asdfsauce
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Use the "Custom CommandLine Options" field in the Zones tab of the x264 configuration window.
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Old 3rd October 2006, 23:20   #20  |  Link
Sharktooth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderbolt8 View Post
again my question, i cant find that in megui, so is this implented in the x264 installer only to be found on x264.nl ? if so, will this implemention also be done for the megui (or if its already there enlighten me plz how I can find it).
it's not implemented in megui (yet).
do what asdfsauce said.
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