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Old 25th December 2008, 23:03   #1  |  Link
LonelyPixel
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Easy to use HDTV cut software?

Hi,

I've recently discovered that I can receive an HDTV station with my DVB-S card and DVBViewer. Watching the HD video it looks much better than old SDTV. Recording is easy, I get the same .ts files only at the double size. The format is 720p.

Now comes the hard part: Post-processing like cutting and converting. While there exist several tools to demux, cut and convert MPEG-2-TS files, I couldn't find any for H.264-TS. At least none that doesn't seem to require deep knowledge of the matter - which I assume would suffice to create my own software for it. Avidemux looks promising but cannot handle my recordings. ProjectX fails at them, too.

So my question is: Is there some easy software like Avidemux or VideoReDo for HDTV or should I just watch and forget and never record anything HD from TV for another 5 years? I really am better off not spending months into trying and failing with processing of HDTV recordings. I hope you guys know if there's a solution or not. The doom9.org website guides seem to be unmaintained for years, with DVB being brand-new and HD not even used yet...

PS: If a piece of software costs money, I really expect easy usage and frame-accurate cutting, which I haven't seen yet.

Last edited by LonelyPixel; 25th December 2008 at 23:06.
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Old 26th December 2008, 00:30   #2  |  Link
setarip_old
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Hi!

The following is just one of several possible solutions referred to in this sub-forum:

http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...41&postcount=7
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Old 26th December 2008, 11:39   #3  |  Link
LonelyPixel
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Thank you. I've found that and it doesn't look easy to use at all. And it's quite expensive for that. Also the website says it doesn't support frame-accurate cutting. [--]

Anyway, I've tried it out now. Doesn't work. It cannot open my video file. At least the log says so. From then on I have no idea what to do in the window. Saving the video or the Play button have absolutely no measurable effect. [--]

Doesn't meet my average user requirements.
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Old 26th December 2008, 13:45   #4  |  Link
Atak_Snajpera
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Install haali Media Splitter and latest FFDShow and try again. I have not had any problems with new TSPE. In my opinion it's very to use.
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Old 26th December 2008, 15:43   #5  |  Link
LonelyPixel
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Alright, this time I eventually managed to cut a TS file. But now I've still got a TS file. And it doesn't play fluidly, it often stops for a short while, at high CPU usage. Seems the HD TS file requires much more power than HD video playback or live HD TV. (On my Core 2 Duo 2.4 GHz) How can I convert the TS file into something else like MKV? Avidemux still refuses to convert the new TS file.
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Old 26th December 2008, 18:07   #6  |  Link
mvBarracuda
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Did you try mkvmerge? It worked for me AFAIR.
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Old 26th December 2008, 19:11   #7  |  Link
LonelyPixel
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Never heard of it before.

It doesn't read .ts files.

Btw, is there a website somewhere that lists all known applications with their input formats, output formats, processing features etc. for video files? Maybe with a filter selection on those features? It's more than confusing to use a chain of 3+ different programmes for converting the same MPEG-2 data from DVB or DVD to cut it and convert it into some other format. HD video needs entirely different tools of course. Some only accept elementary streams, some only program streams. Some do error correction, most not. Very few support smart copy (frame-accurate cutting but only re-encoding the necessary parts) and most fail to advertise it. Another output format can change the entire tool chain from the first part on. In the last years, I've used at least 12 different programmes - only for video cutting and converting; information tools, codecs, players and audio editing not included. If someone not-so-into-computers asks me how video processing works, I always tell them "it's too complicated, you won't understand it".
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Old 30th December 2008, 18:28   #8  |  Link
midnightsun
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Once you have cut the TS (which you say you did successfully), use dgavcindex (look for it) to demux the streams, load them up in mkvmergegui and let it create a MKV for you. Now you have a fully working MKV which should be playable in media player classic.

BTW if the file takes too much out of your CPU to decode, it may not play fluidly whether as a TS, a MKV or a MP4. You just have to check that yourself.
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Old 5th January 2009, 08:13   #9  |  Link
Jay Bee
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Videoredo with AVC support has been announced within the next few weeks. Yay.
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Old 5th January 2009, 21:01   #10  |  Link
midnightsun
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about time!

at the moment it's too much of a hassle to quasi-losslessly (i.e. reencode only at the cut points if needed) trim files frame-accurately.
I've been doing it the manual way with dgavcindex,avisynth,megui,tssplitter,tsmuxer but it takes an awful amount of time.
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Old 8th January 2009, 18:06   #11  |  Link
TheResidentEvil
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I cannot wait. I use videoredo religiously
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Old 14th January 2009, 13:27   #12  |  Link
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So do I - VideoReDo is fantastic and well worth the few $ it cost (I'm not associated with it, only as a very happy user). Good active support forum, too.
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Old 17th January 2009, 06:35   #13  |  Link
guodongzhe
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This is NOT free, but it can edit m2ts frame accurately, it may help. I tried it on m2ts files, it works. you may need rename file extension from .trp to .m2ts

[link removed for GPL violation]

Last edited by Guest; 15th July 2009 at 17:05.
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Old 17th January 2009, 22:28   #14  |  Link
Ventolin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guodongzhe View Post
This is NOT free, but it can edit m2ts frame accurately, it may help. I tried it on m2ts files, it works. you may need rename file extension from .trp to .m2ts

[link removed for GPL violations]
Hi,

I just tried this and unfortunately it did was not able to edit my h264 ts file successfully. Instead it decided to re-encode my 1440x1080i h264 video to MPEG2 @ 720x576, my AC3 to MPEG1 Layer2 Audio and used a bitrate of 4 Mbit/s.

I even tried to set the parameters to match the source, but the settings were ignored.

I also noticed the authors claim the software is Open Source, yet I did not find any sources in the package or any place to download the source files.

I did find MPlayer binaries in the codecs folder however, but was unable to find any mention of any GPL licences either.

Frame Accurate in the context of a video editor in my view should imply a "Smart" editor where only the frames that need to be re-encoded are, the rest is left untouched.

As far as I know, there are only GOP level H264 editors out there and only 1 Sub-GOP editor (not mentioning any names!)

Sincerest Apologies if my findings are incorrect in any way.

Regards,

Vent

Last edited by Guest; 15th July 2009 at 17:04.
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Old 18th January 2009, 03:36   #15  |  Link
guodongzhe
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Ya!It is NOT free, so I am not surprised that it is close sourced. I just downloaded its trial version and had a test.
FRAME ACCURATE only means accurate on the start and end point, I do not think leaving middle part untouched is a necessary demand. Ya, perhaps that is okay in technology. But, have you ever think about that, if the first and last GOP on cut points were chopped and re-encoded, then the visual quality will be lowered down than the middle part. Same thing happens to the bitrate, I mean the result may have a bitrate on start and end other than its middle part. As I have been working for some video stream TRANSPORT (satellite) program, that will be sometime a problem.
I now use this program to be a movie browser, like a ACDsee, but on videos. It is funny to scrub video in the FRAME PRO mode, like an animation.
Any way, have a good day.
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Old 18th January 2009, 03:40   #16  |  Link
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And what is "Sub-GOP"? You mean cutting out IDR in the stream, but leaving some (orphan) I frames as starting point of stream? But in the theory, that will be a illegal 264 structure.
Perhaps I am wrong?
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Old 19th January 2009, 01:29   #17  |  Link
midnightsun
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I do not think leaving middle part untouched is a necessary demand.
You don't???
Of course it is!!!!
What do you think we're all talking about then?

If all it does is re-encode the video stream then we already have reliable tools to do that, so what's new about it that dgavcdecode, avisynth and x264 cannot do already?
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Old 19th January 2009, 03:22   #18  |  Link
guodongzhe
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Originally Posted by midnightsun View Post
You don't???
Of course it is!!!!
What do you think we're all talking about then?

If all it does is re-encode the video stream then we already have reliable tools to do that, so what's new about it that dgavcdecode, avisynth and x264 cannot do already?
Nope. I mean leaving middle part untouched is necessary demand of RE-MUX or RIP, but it is NOT necessary demand for the definition of FRAME ACCURATE EDIT. Those are totally different two things. At least in the TV and satellite broadcasting industry it is so.
Thanks.

Last edited by guodongzhe; 19th January 2009 at 03:37.
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Old 19th January 2009, 12:23   #19  |  Link
LonelyPixel
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No re-encoding of unedited parts is necessary for me. I'm not one of those lucky owners of an 8-core machine, and I do think that the broadcast H.264 streams is already compressed well enough. There's absolutely no need to do it all again, losing a bit more quality. It would actually be dumb and inefficient. If the application can already open, cut and encode the video, I assume it should be smart enough to simply copy the parts it doesn't alter.
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Old 19th January 2009, 12:57   #20  |  Link
guodongzhe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LonelyPixel View Post
No re-encoding of unedited parts is necessary for me. I'm not one of those lucky owners of an 8-core machine, and I do think that the broadcast H.264 streams is already compressed well enough. There's absolutely no need to do it all again, losing a bit more quality. It would actually be dumb and inefficient. If the application can already open, cut and encode the video, I assume it should be smart enough to simply copy the parts it doesn't alter.
Actually it is possible in technology. And several years ago, I did programmed such kind of application for MPEG2 stream. We re-encode first gop and last gop, and copy middle part directly. It worked, but not perfect in theory.

On the contrary, why so heavily depend on FRAME ACCURATE. If the FRAME ACCURATE demand is off, I mean just demux and re-mux from GOP boundary, that will be more easy, and applicable. That will be totally visual quality LOSSLESS. I'd prefer that. And it will be fast.

FRAME ACCURATE may cost too much.

As we often referred to, when we define a in(start) point, that frame will be most important in a program. But re-encoding will just lower its visual quality, leaving other part untouched. So we do not operate like this, we usually keep the whole GOP, but when we start playing, we start from the in point(not GOP boundary), this operation is called 'PREROLL'. That will solve this well.
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