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Old 4th June 2007, 13:20   #141  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by otaku975 View Post
The real file size is 0 Bytes.
Seemingly the Nero Audio Decoder didn't output anything, as the final audio file was 0 byte long (= empty). eac3to has no chance to do anything if the Nero Decoder doesn't work correctly. Now I'd really like to know why the Nero audio decoder doesn't work for you. Maybe it does only work if the HD-DVD/Blu-Ray plugin is registerd? I don't know...
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Old 4th June 2007, 14:52   #142  |  Link
otaku975
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Seemingly the Nero Audio Decoder didn't output anything, as the final audio file was 0 byte long (= empty). eac3to has no chance to do anything if the Nero Decoder doesn't work correctly. Now I'd really like to know why the Nero audio decoder doesn't work for you. Maybe it does only work if the HD-DVD/Blu-Ray plugin is registerd? I don't know...

well i installed nero normally , how do i know or get the hddvd bluray plugin to be registered ?

Last edited by otaku975; 4th June 2007 at 14:54.
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Old 4th June 2007, 15:43   #143  |  Link
madshi
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Originally Posted by otaku975 View Post
how do i know or get the hddvd bluray plugin to be registered ?
By buying it? Ok, I understand that it's ugly to buy something if you're not sure it will work. But well, don't know what else to say.
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Old 6th June 2007, 15:00   #144  |  Link
otaku975
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well i gave up and converted it via graphedit , worked fine
thanks for the help madshi
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Old 6th June 2007, 15:05   #145  |  Link
madshi
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Well, that's strange. If it works via graphedit, it should also work via eac3to. Hmmmm...
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Old 6th June 2007, 20:51   #146  |  Link
The_Keymaker
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I am travelling but hope to have a revised EAC3toGUI release featuring Madshi's newest options when I return.

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Old 9th June 2007, 10:17   #147  |  Link
starkhouse33
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Originally Posted by otaku975 View Post
well i gave up and converted it via graphedit , worked fine
How did you setup your graph? I'm trying to get this to work with a mono track I have.
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Old 9th June 2007, 10:43   #148  |  Link
madshi
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Originally Posted by starkhouse33 View Post
How did you setup your graph? I'm trying to get this to work with a mono track I have.
Does eac3to fail to convert that mono track for you, too? Does it also say that the Audio Decoder output seems to be 0 bytes long? Thanks...
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Old 9th June 2007, 18:18   #149  |  Link
ACrowley
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any news about the TrueHD Output 16bit or 24bit ?

Well, for a AC3/DTS/WMA reencode is doesnt Matters when íf the Source Wave Bitrate is 16 or 24bit.
Ouptut Filesize is the same on 16 and 24Bit Source.
For AC3 Aften can take 24Bit wave Input, Steinberg Nuendo Encoder too.
So 24bit Output from TrueHD is no Problem

But for a FLAC encode it matters cause the FLAC encoded Output Filesize on 24bit Wave Source is by far bigger

I cant hear a difference between 16 and 24bit TrueHD Output encoded to FLAC
So whats correct, 16bit or 24bit TrueHD Output from Nero Decoder ?

Question about NeroAudioDecoder:

Is NeroAudioDecoder using any DRC when i set it to Remixmode none" ? I dont thing so
And Sonic ? its still not cleared if the Decoder use any DRC ?

Last edited by ACrowley; 9th June 2007 at 19:22.
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Old 9th June 2007, 23:49   #150  |  Link
starkhouse33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Does eac3to fail to convert that mono track for you, too? Does it also say that the Audio Decoder output seems to be 0 bytes long? Thanks...
when I try to convert a mono track with eac3to I get this

E-AC3, 1.0 channels, 1:58:47, 64kbit/s, 48khz
Mono E-AC3 tracks can only be decoded by Nero's filters, switching to Nero.
Muxing eac3 file to raw. Please wait...
The file size of the raw file doesn't seem to fit.
The expected file size for 16 bit is 5.36 MB.
The expected file size for 24 bit is 8.04 MB.
The real file size is 0 Bytes.
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Old 10th June 2007, 07:09   #151  |  Link
xkodi
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@madshi

without a doubt TrueHD track found on 'V for Vendetta' HD-DVD is 24bit/48kHz.

why i'm sure about that? what is my test procedure?

TrueHD is based on MLP (aka Packed PCM), so i've used 'SurCode MLP' to create test MLP files from WAV files with different resolution and number of channels e.g. 24bit/44.1kHz/5.1, 16bit/48kHz/2.0, etc. and named them test2444151.mlp, 164820.mlp, etc.

then i've used WinDVD 8.0 B06.109 to open those test MLP files, WinDVD doesn't produce sound while playback MLP files, but every time for every test MLP file, WinDVD shows (from the menu 'Setup->Information') the right resolution and number of channels, exactly the same as the resolution and number of channels of the source WAV file from which the corresponding MLP file was created:

Quote:
Stream:
Type: Packed PCM
Bitrate: 0 Kbps
Number of main channels: 6
LFE Channel: None
Sampling Frequency: 44.1khz
Bits Per Sample: 24
Output:
Sample Rate: 44 KHz
Bits per Sample: 16
so that means without a doubt, that WinDVD checks the MLP (TrueHD) headers for the real resolution of the encoded audio.

the next step was to demux the 'V for Vendetta' HD-DVD using EVOdemux and to rename the resulted TrueHD file to truehd.mlp and then WinDVD 8.0 B06.109 said that it is:

Quote:
Stream:
Type: Packed PCM
Bitrate: 0 Kbps
Number of main channels: 6
LFE Channel: None
Sampling Frequency: 48khz
Bits Per Sample: 24
Output:
Sample Rate: 48 KHz
Bits per Sample: 16
so the TrueHD (MLP) track found on 'V for Vendetta' HD-DVD is 24bit/48kHz/5.1

to double check the accuracy of the information that WinDVD outputs, i've also done another test:

this time with the bonus TrueHD track from the 'Nine Inch Nails Live: Beside You in Time' HD-DVD, which is:

633 042 317 bytes in size

and WinDVD says it's 24bit/48kHz/5.1.

i've created, using eac3to, both 16bit and 24bit WAV files from that TrueHD track and then using 'SurCode MLP' compressed them to MLP, the result:

16bit WAV file size: 660 487 104 bytes
compressed to MPL size: 358 807 274 bytes

24bit WAV file size: 990 730 628 bytes
compressed to MPL size: 649 693 162 bytes

the MLP compressed size of the 16bit WAV file is 358 807 274 bytes and MLP compressed size of the 24bit WAV file is 649 693 162 bytes, which is almost the same number as the original TrueHD track - 633 042 317 bytes in size and because TrueHD is optimized MLP compression again can be concluded that the original TrueHD track is 24bit exactly as WinDVD reports.

Last edited by xkodi; 10th June 2007 at 07:33.
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Old 10th June 2007, 19:23   #152  |  Link
Rectal Prolapse
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An AVSForum Insider has mentioned that TrueHD decoders always output 24 bit.

I think you need to do your test again on a disc that is known to have a 16 bit TrueHD audio track. I have a feeling that you will think that all TrueHD releases are 24 bit, when in fact the majority (or even all) of them are 16 bit.
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Old 10th June 2007, 20:29   #153  |  Link
xkodi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rectal Prolapse View Post
An AVSForum Insider has mentioned that TrueHD decoders always output 24 bit.

I think you need to do your test again on a disc that is known to have a 16 bit TrueHD audio track. I have a feeling that you will think that all TrueHD releases are 24 bit, when in fact the majority (or even all) of them are 16 bit.
i do not agree, because in the first test i don't use the output of TrueHD decoders, instead i'm using series of homemade MLP tracks with known resolution to prove, that WinDVD can find and shows the real resolution of the MLP/TrueHD tracks correctly and so WinDVD uses the MLP/TrueHD headers to find that information and there is no usage of TrueHD decoders at all in that test.

in the second test, yes, but only to double check the results from the first test, i'm using Nero TrueHD decoder to decompress 600MB TrueHD track (demuxed from real HD-DVD disc) in both 16bit and 24bit WAV files and then compress them again to MLP and that test shows that the initial source for the original TrueHD track is 24bit, because if the original TrueHD track is created from 16bit WAV it will be only 340MB.

so i can't see any flaw in the tests and that is why i'm posting here, if you have something more concrete for the possible flaw, also why you are so sure, that TrueHD tracks are 16bit, WinDVD and the 'Surecode MLP' test shows exactly the opposite and in that test, i'm not using the output of TrueHD decoders at all.

[edit] and here is another prove, even if TrueHD decoders always output 24 bit, WinDVD shows that the stream is 16bit if and only if it is really 16bit (the output is from homemade 16bit MLP track):

Quote:
Stream:
Type: Packed PCM
Bitrate: 0 Kbps
Number of main channels: 6
LFE Channel: None
Sampling Frequency: 44.1khz
Bits Per Sample: 16
Output:
Sample Rate: 44 KHz
Bits per Sample: 16

Last edited by xkodi; 10th June 2007 at 22:23.
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Old 11th June 2007, 09:19   #154  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xkodi View Post
without a doubt TrueHD track found on 'V for Vendetta' HD-DVD is 24bit/48kHz.


Quote:
Originally Posted by xkodi View Post
TrueHD is based on MLP (aka Packed PCM), so i've used 'SurCode MLP' to create test MLP files from WAV files with different resolution and number of channels e.g. 24bit/44.1kHz/5.1, 16bit/48kHz/2.0, etc. and named them test2444151.mlp, 164820.mlp, etc.

then i've used WinDVD 8.0 B06.109 to open those test MLP files, WinDVD doesn't produce sound while playback MLP files, but every time for every test MLP file, WinDVD shows (from the menu 'Setup->Information') the right resolution and number of channels, exactly the same as the resolution and number of channels of the source WAV file from which the corresponding MLP file was created:

so that means without a doubt, that WinDVD checks the MLP (TrueHD) headers for the real resolution of the encoded audio.

the next step was to demux the 'V for Vendetta' HD-DVD using EVOdemux and to rename the resulted TrueHD file to truehd.mlp and then WinDVD 8.0 B06.109 said that it is:
Well, this does not fully convince me yet. Why? Because the headers of MLP files differ from the headers of TrueHD files. eac3to is able to analyze MLP files and extract the "bitdepth" information from the MLP header. But eac3to is not able to do the same for TrueHD files. I'm not sure. Maybe WinDVD is able to do that. Maybe WinDVD is cleverer than eac3to, that's possible. But it's also possible that WinDVD is reporting the correct bitdepth for MLP files while always reporting 24bit for TrueHD files.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xkodi View Post
to double check the accuracy of the information that WinDVD outputs, i've also done another test:

this time with the bonus TrueHD track from the 'Nine Inch Nails Live: Beside You in Time' HD-DVD, which is:

633 042 317 bytes in size

and WinDVD says it's 24bit/48kHz/5.1.

i've created, using eac3to, both 16bit and 24bit WAV files from that TrueHD track and then using 'SurCode MLP' compressed them to MLP, the result:

16bit WAV file size: 660 487 104 bytes
compressed to MPL size: 358 807 274 bytes

24bit WAV file size: 990 730 628 bytes
compressed to MPL size: 649 693 162 bytes

the MLP compressed size of the 16bit WAV file is 358 807 274 bytes and MLP compressed size of the 24bit WAV file is 649 693 162 bytes, which is almost the same number as the original TrueHD track - 633 042 317 bytes in size and because TrueHD is optimized MLP compression again can be concluded that the original TrueHD track is 24bit exactly as WinDVD reports.
Ok, that quite clearly shows that that bonus track is most probably 24bit. But that's still no 100% proof that Vendetta is 24bit, too. Can you do the same test with Vendetta, too? Or could you try to find a TrueHD track which WinDVD reports at being 16bit only?

Now if only we could make eac3to decode demuxed MLP/TrueHD files then we could do another double check and decode your home made MLP files and check whether the Nero decoder produces bit identical output! You don't happen to have an authoring software available which can package your home made MLP files into an EVO container, so that eac3to can decode your MLP files?
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Old 11th June 2007, 09:22   #155  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by starkhouse33 View Post
when I try to convert a mono track with eac3to I get this

E-AC3, 1.0 channels, 1:58:47, 64kbit/s, 48khz
Mono E-AC3 tracks can only be decoded by Nero's filters, switching to Nero.
Muxing eac3 file to raw. Please wait...
The file size of the raw file doesn't seem to fit.
The expected file size for 16 bit is 5.36 MB.
The expected file size for 24 bit is 8.04 MB.
The real file size is 0 Bytes.
I've just tried it again and it works on my test mono chunk. Would it be possible for you to make that mono track available for me for testing?
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Old 11th June 2007, 10:00   #156  |  Link
xkodi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Can you do the same test with Vendetta, too? Or could you try to find a TrueHD track which WinDVD reports at being 16bit only?
in several days i will do the same test with Vendetta and post the results; i have only two HD-DVD discs with TrueHD and they both say 24bit, but i will look for more TrueHD samples.

Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
You don't happen to have an authoring software available which can package your home made MLP files into an EVO container, so that eac3to can decode your MLP files?
actually i can pack them in AOB container and as far as i know EVOdemux can convert AOB to EVOB, but i don't know if 'Nero Audio Decoder 2' is capable to decode pure MLP, but i will try that test in several hours and post back the result.

Last edited by xkodi; 11th June 2007 at 10:09.
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Old 11th June 2007, 10:32   #157  |  Link
madshi
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Thanks, xkodi!
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Old 11th June 2007, 11:02   #158  |  Link
xkodi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xkodi View Post
actually i can pack them in AOB container and as far as i know EVOdemux can convert AOB to EVOB, but i don't know if 'Nero Audio Decoder 2' is capable to decode pure MLP, but i will try that test in several hours and post back the result.
24bit/48kHz/5.1ch WAV file -> 'SurCode MLP' -> 24bit/48kHz/5.1ch MLP file -> 'discWelder CHROME' -> AOB container -> 'EVOdemux 0.626' -> EVOB container

but the resulted EVOB file opened again with EVOdemux says that the stream is LPCM, not MLP (PPCM) and WinDVD also reports LPCM and nothing can playback that EVOB, so seems that is a dead end, because EVOdemux can't convert AOB with MLP to EVOB correctly, maybe MLP can't be muxed in EVOB at all, only the TrueHD modification.
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Old 11th June 2007, 11:08   #159  |  Link
mp4p2p
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help for eac3toGUI link

eac3toGUI 0.63 this link:http://www.sendspace.com/file/jwghja

my web can't open,may be is isp question,

please,who can send me?

my email:dhdbase@gmail.com

thanks
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Old 11th June 2007, 12:27   #160  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xkodi View Post
maybe MLP can't be muxed in EVOB at all, only the TrueHD modification.
Actually some HD-DVD tracks are MLP and not TrueHD. So it's definitely possible to mux MLP into EVOB. I think EvoDemux just doesn't do it properly, sadly...
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