madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[mr.duck]

Originally Posted by madshi

That's really bad. madVR's DXVA2 calls are now pretty much identical to EVR's. Well, I guess I'll have to install win7 x64 and the latest ATI driver and then hope to be able to reproduce the problem on my own PC.

I tried a different video decoder and got a slightly different result. Using a cyberlink decoder, each frame step was unique as opposed to each frame being doubled with LAV Video. But the picture quality isn't any better (in terms of getting 50 FPS) until I switch back to EVR.

Hope that helps.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by cremor

But I still don't get how the decoder queue can affect anything on the GPU. Isn't this all on CPU and system RAM (with LAV software decoding)?

I don't understand it, either. Maybe the decoder has upped his thread priority, so that the render thread doesn't get enough juice? But still, if the queue is full, the decoder sleeps. And the decoder queue is pretty much always full in your logs, regardless of whether it's 8 or 12 frames big. So I've really no clue.

JFMI, which decoder are you using? Can you try different ones?

Originally Posted by mr.duck

I tried a different video decoder and got a slightly different result. Using a cyberlink decoder, each frame step was unique as opposed to each frame being doubled with LAV Video. But the picture quality isn't any better (in terms of getting 50 FPS) until I switch back to EVR.

Can you see the difference in screenshots, when using the Cyberlink decoder? What happens if you use the internal madVR decoder as a test?

[Thunderbolt8]

Originally Posted by madshi

Yes, that's quite possible. Though, the 4770 should be pretty powerful. I'm surprised it has problems with deinterlacing when using madVR. You're sure you've disabled anti-aliasing, anisotropic filtering etc? Does your GPU run near 100% GPU usage?

its all reset to defaults, so 'use application settings' is ticked. I remember you said to leave all those settings at its default status (apart from edge enhancement and DNR, I disabled those). 'use automatic deinterlacing' is still active though, but thats also the default value.

when playing normal progressive videos, my GPU load usually seems to be around 35-50% according to the catalyst activity clock. can only test windowed mode with it though.

[mr.duck]

Originally Posted by madshi

Can you see the difference in screenshots, when using the Cyberlink decoder? What happens if you use the internal madVR decoder as a test?

I can see a difference. http://imgur.com/a/1W9r4


Using internal intel decoder I had to manually enable deinterlacing and then it seems give the same result as LAV Video decoder. Every 2 frames are the same.

[pankov]

Originally Posted by madshi

P.S: Can you please double check whether you get the same results with this test build?

http://madshi.net/mrduck.rar

I don't expect any changes, but who knows. The ATI smoothness fixes might also help NVidia GPU Load. I kinda doubt it, though.

You are correct - there are no changes and I too don't think it's worth using CUDA just to get a percent or so improvement.

I guess we'll have to give this round (GPU load) to EVR but it looses in so many others things that it's not even in the same league.



Thunderbolt8,
you can use GPU-Z to monitor/record your GPU load even in exclusive mode by enabling and looking at the history graphs.

[Thunderbolt8]

Originally Posted by pankov

Thunderbolt8,
you can use GPU-Z to monitor/record your GPU load even in exclusive mode by enabling and looking at the history graphs.

thanks. did some testing with it:

1080p AVC 30-35mbit: ~35-40 % GPU load
1080i 29.97fps AVC 16,7 mbit: without deinterlacing: 30-46%
1080i 29.97fps AVC 16,7 mbit: with deinterlacing: 45-73%

1080i VC-1, without deinterlacing: for a few seconds 25, 38, 42% load, after that load = 0 (????)
1080i VC-1, with deinterlacing: 0 % load all the time (????)

only time of those 5 times, the video played absolutely smoothly was when I played the 16,7mbit 1080i AVC video with deinterlacing deactivated. even in case of the 1080p video, in between smooth playback often stopped for 2 seconds before it went back to smooth again.

so I guess the conclusion is my CPU is too slow? -.-
I can definately get all normal progressive AVC stuff to play smoothly if needed. but no chance in case of VC-1 up from a certain point, because multithreading is not supported.

[StrifeLeonhart]

Originally Posted by madshi

What does "don't seem to pause" mean exactly? Do they continue to play, line after line?

No, the subtitleline at that moment on that frame just disapears with the mouse click but that doesnt happen when i press the spacebar to pause.

[nx6]

Originally Posted by madshi

So why does it occur only on your PC, but not on anyone else's? I've added extra code to madVR to block the "Pause" OSD message. However, you seem to be using a translated version of MPC-HC. Your MPC-HC shows "Pausa" instead of "Pause". And madVR doesn't block "Pausa". You can fix the problem by translating just the "Pausa" text back to "Pause". I'm not sure where and how to do translations, though. The next madVR build will also block "Pausa". I'm aware that this all isn't really a good solution, but that's all I can do right now.

Couldn't he just turn off the OSD in MPC's Preferences so it wouldn't display the Pause message?

[psymed]

Is there a way to turn off the "Exclusive/Windowed" message at the top left whenever control+shift is used? ( shows up for a few seconds )

[cremor]

Originally Posted by madshi

I don't understand it, either. Maybe the decoder has upped his thread priority, so that the render thread doesn't get enough juice? But still, if the queue is full, the decoder sleeps. And the decoder queue is pretty much always full in your logs, regardless of whether it's 8 or 12 frames big. So I've really no clue.

Shouldn't a Core i7 be powerful enough?
CPU load is at 40-50% during playback of the problematic files. Is there a way to find out how many threads are currently active in the MPC-HC process?

Originally Posted by madshi

JFMI, which decoder are you using? Can you try different ones?

I'm using LAV splitter/audio/video 0.39. But since the one VC-1 sample which uses the Microsoft splitter/decoder shows the same problem I don't think the decoder is the problem.
But I'll also try the MPC-HC internal ones when I get home.

[cyberbeing]

Originally Posted by cremor

Is there a way to find out how many threads are currently active in the MPC-HC process?

Process Explorer -> Double Click on MPC-HC -> Threads Tab

From there you can see CPU use on a per thread basis, what's running under each thread, and thread priorities.

[nevcairiel]

Originally Posted by madshi

I don't understand it, either. Maybe the decoder has upped his thread priority, so that the render thread doesn't get enough juice? But still, if the queue is full, the decoder sleeps. And the decoder queue is pretty much always full in your logs, regardless of whether it's 8 or 12 frames big. So I've really no clue.

FWIW, LAV does not increase thread prioritys. If anything, it even reduces the priority of the audio thread so that video is ensured to have faster queue fills.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by Thunderbolt8

when playing normal progressive videos, my GPU load usually seems to be around 35-50% according to the catalyst activity clock. can only test windowed mode with it though.

Originally Posted by Thunderbolt8

thanks. did some testing with it:

1080p AVC 30-35mbit: ~35-40 % GPU load
1080i 29.97fps AVC 16,7 mbit: without deinterlacing: 30-46%
1080i 29.97fps AVC 16,7 mbit: with deinterlacing: 45-73%

1080i VC-1, without deinterlacing: for a few seconds 25, 38, 42% load, after that load = 0 (????)
1080i VC-1, with deinterlacing: 0 % load all the time (????)

only time of those 5 times, the video played absolutely smoothly was when I played the 16,7mbit 1080i AVC video with deinterlacing deactivated. even in case of the 1080p video, in between smooth playback often stopped for 2 seconds before it went back to smooth again.

so I guess the conclusion is my CPU is too slow? -.-
I can definately get all normal progressive AVC stuff to play smoothly if needed. but no chance in case of VC-1 up from a certain point, because multithreading is not supported.

Well, does the decoder queue get empty (or near empty) when you get stuttering/frame drops? If so, the CPU is probably the problem.

Originally Posted by mr.duck

I can see a difference. http://imgur.com/a/1W9r4

Using internal intel decoder I had to manually enable deinterlacing and then it seems give the same result as LAV Video decoder. Every 2 frames are the same.

Hmmmm... Can you please test with the Cheese Slices you can get here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1157287

Do you see the same problems with that? If not, can you please upload a sample of your MPEG2 50i sample you've been testing with? Thx.

Originally Posted by StrifeLeonhart

No, the subtitleline at that moment on that frame just disapears with the mouse click but that doesnt happen when i press the spacebar to pause.

That doesn't happen here. Does MPC-HC show a little "Pause" OSD at the top of the screen, when you pause playback?

Originally Posted by nx6

Couldn't he just turn off the OSD in MPC's Preferences so it wouldn't display the Pause message?

Probably, but that would also disable other messages which are useful (e.g. when changing audio delay).

Originally Posted by psymed

Is there a way to turn off the "Exclusive/Windowed" message at the top left whenever control+shift is used? ( shows up for a few seconds )

Not at the moment. Planned for a future version.

Originally Posted by cremor

Is there a way to find out how many threads are currently active in the MPC-HC process?

Yes, but this information won't help in any way.

Originally Posted by nevcairiel

FWIW, LAV does not increase thread prioritys. If anything, it even reduces the priority of the audio thread so that video is ensured to have faster queue fills.

Good to know. I'm just wondering why in cremor's log the rendering seems to always take the back seat compared to other things, although I've already increased the render thread's priority. Weird, will have to look for locking problems.

[mr.duck]

Originally Posted by madshi

Hmmmm... Can you please test with the Cheese Slices you can get here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1157287

Do you see the same problems with that? If not, can you please upload a sample of your MPEG2 50i sample you've been testing with? Thx.

Yeah it seems the same. Doubled frames in madVR compared to EVR. Plus with madVR + deinterlacing, it is seriously choppy. Looks like my graphics card is nowhere near powerful enough (Radeon 5750).

There is another good sample on that page at the bottom of post #1 that shows clearly the fluidity of 50 FPS in EVR compared to 25 FPS (or whatever is happening) in madVR. It's called "PAL: MPEG2 - 720x576 (4:3) - interlaced - 25.00fps - 8000Kbps".

[madshi]

It should be powerful enough. One thing worth trying might be to downdate to 10.11 drivers. In the meanwhile I'll try to reproduce the problem somehow.

Edit: But maybe it makes sense to wait a bit before changing driver versions. I've still some ideas on what to try here.

[madshi]

@mr.duck and @pankov, can you please try this build?

http://madshi.net/mrduckPankov.rar

[TheShadowRunner]

hi madshi, whatever you did in this mrduckPankov build corrected this bug:

Did you say that you were using ZoomPlayer? I don't remember that. I tried to reproduce with MPC-HC. Anyway, the problem occurs with ZoomPlayer, but not with MPC-HC. Don't know why, will investigate...

[Boltron]

Madshi. I'd like to better understand how madVR makes use of video card memory. I have an 1GB ATI5670. Watching standard 24p movies I see the GPU memory utilization sit about ~65%. The other day I watched a 1080i rip from a Bluray (interlacing was enabled) and it showed usage of ~90%. Not that I think anything is wrong, I just want to understand how memory is used so I can make a more informed decision the next time I purchase a video card. My criteria so far has been to go with 1GB and faster DDR5 memory.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by TheShadowRunner

hi madshi, whatever you did in this mrduckPankov build corrected this bug:

Really? That's good news, I haven't even tried to fix that bug yet!

[TheShadowRunner]

Originally Posted by madshi

Really? That's good news, I haven't even tried to fix that bug yet!

Interesting haha, but yes it did fix it on my system for sure

ps: it didn't fix the slow-ZP-freeze-on-seek-after-madvr-frequency-switch one tho ^^;;