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Old 21st April 2018, 16:48   #50301  |  Link
oldpainlesskodi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by el Filou View Post
With correctly functioning hardware (TV and GPU drivers), it still is.

Are you using an NVIDIA?
With some older driver branch - don't remember which one - I had kind of the same issue you have, with clipping. I had to set the GPU (and TV of course) to Limited to get it fixed permanently but of course you then lose in picture quality.
Is YCbCr the only mode that fixes it on your TV, or does RGB Limited works too?
Do you by any chance have another device to test with?
If you have an NVIDIA, try changing the "Content type reported to the display" setting and see if it changes something. When I had that issue with NVIDIA drivers, changing that option to literally anything else than the one currently selected fixed the problem until the next display resync, at which point I had to change it again.
The problem was then fixed in the following driver branch.
Thanks for sharing el Filou.

I'll look into your suggestions and compare ( yes, I'm Nvidia driver 352.83 - HDR switching working, Atmos etc etc) and report back as it may help others.

YCbCr444 produces a significantly different image in colour and luminance uniformity, and less image noise without an apparent degradation of sharpness or image quality (more film like, if you will) compared to RGB Limited, and as I mentioned, RGB full chain washes out the image slightly along with a different colour and gamma presentation, and has more noise - but I will do more tests with the combinations you mentioned and report back.

K

Last edited by oldpainlesskodi; 21st April 2018 at 16:52.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 06:59   #50302  |  Link
huhn
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madshi this is maybe interesting if you want to add VFR support to madVR.

https://forums.blurbusters.com/viewt...tart=30#p31943
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Old 22nd April 2018, 07:08   #50303  |  Link
70MM
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I keep reading on here that a number of people prefer YCbCr444 over RGB for whatever reasons. Yet madshi keeps saying we should use RGB @ 8 bits with dithering.

To those that do, why is 444 better for you than RGB?
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Old 22nd April 2018, 07:15   #50304  |  Link
huhn
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it's inquestionable inferior if you have an end device that is not broken.

the benefit of YCbCr is the display know for sure if it is limited range or full range so you can't screw this up because it is always limited.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 07:24   #50305  |  Link
70MM
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So huhn you are saying still RGB is far better?
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Old 22nd April 2018, 07:30   #50306  |  Link
70MM
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When one is upscaling BD to 4K and using any image enhancements like sharpen edges and enhanance detail, who also uses the same two settings in upscaling refinement?

Can it be detrimental or cause artifacts if sharpening is used in both areas when upscaling from BD to 4K?
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Old 22nd April 2018, 07:46   #50307  |  Link
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No it's fine, it's only a problem if you're over sharpening, in which case it highlights preexisting artifacts more than anything.. Just don't use sharpening so much you can see halos.

Doesn't hurt to evaluate a higher setting in either area before using sharpening in both in order to save performance.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 08:46   #50308  |  Link
70MM
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ryrynz, do you sharpen in both areas or just in one?
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Old 22nd April 2018, 09:11   #50309  |  Link
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I refine only after upscaling is complete.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 11:03   #50310  |  Link
e-t172
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Originally Posted by huhn View Post
madshi this is maybe interesting if you want to add VFR support to madVR.

https://forums.blurbusters.com/viewt...tart=30#p31943
That's fascinating, especially the discussion that follows on that thread - people are discussing how to circumvent real-time Windows thread scheduling limitations to time Present() calls in the most accurate (least jittery) way possible, which is exactly the problem that madVR would have to solve if it were to leverage variable sync for smooth video presentation.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 11:28   #50311  |  Link
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I refine only after upscaling is complete.
Same here
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Old 22nd April 2018, 14:02   #50312  |  Link
HillieSan
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Originally Posted by mclingo View Post
Hi, what do you mean you need the latest nightly, DIRECT3D 11 has been working for ages on my system, its required for HDR to work.

What does it fix?
Direct3D11 in MadVR didn't work well with the first version of LAV filter 0.71.0. The latest updates fixed the problem. Now Direct3D11 works again.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 14:05   #50313  |  Link
ashlar42
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Edited. Not important enough. I lack the time to debate stuff like this on the internet. sorry.

Last edited by ashlar42; 22nd April 2018 at 14:08.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 15:10   #50314  |  Link
mclingo
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Originally Posted by HillieSan View Post
Direct3D11 in MadVR didn't work well with the first version of LAV filter 0.71.0. The latest updates fixed the problem. Now Direct3D11 works again.
I didnt notice any issues with it and dont remember anything being posted, so I know what to look out for should problems recurr with later updates which problems was it causing?
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Old 22nd April 2018, 15:51   #50315  |  Link
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D3D11 native and AMD drivers have (had?) its problems. CB not to my knowledge.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 16:44   #50316  |  Link
oldpainlesskodi
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Originally Posted by huhn View Post
it's inquestionable inferior if you have an end device that is not broken.

the benefit of YCbCr is the display know for sure if it is limited range or full range so you can't screw this up because it is always limited.
I think you might be correct - with the Samsung range of SUHD sets, there maybe an error in how it treats full range RGB vs 4.4.4, and using HDR+, further adds to the issue (even on the very latest firmware)

The problem with perfection.....oh, don't get me started :-)

As I have no intention of writing off my investment (I bought the set at peak), I'll live with 4.4.4 and use HDR+, but I do wish these manufacturers would get their act together ffs.

K

Last edited by oldpainlesskodi; 22nd April 2018 at 16:48.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 17:12   #50317  |  Link
huhn
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you have todo what you have todo...

i have to use smoothmotion even through i would like to match refreshrates but my screen has some dumb bug in this regard it is as it is and it doesn't change it would be better the other way.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 19:31   #50318  |  Link
ui123
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Hello guys, quick question about HDR passthrough

Do i need to enable windows 10 HDR option ? My TV is switching to HDR i can see the HDR logo on my tv but when i go to windows 10 HDR option windows say it is disabled.

Thanks for the clarification

TV: SONY 4K HDR 10 Bits
MPC-HC v1.7.16
MadVR .12
GTX 1080
Windows 10 last update
HDR file : A Series of Unfortunate Events 2160p HDR Netflix WEBRip DD5.1 x265

http://www.imagebam.com/image/2ad241831726033
Attached Images
 

Last edited by ui123; 22nd April 2018 at 19:41.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 20:20   #50319  |  Link
Warner306
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madVR uses the private APIs provided by Nvidia and AMD. There is no need to use the Windows HDR switch.

You should probably use a better scaler than DXVA2 with that graphics card. Something in the NGU family would be preferable.
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Old 22nd April 2018, 20:24   #50320  |  Link
Asmodian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ui123 View Post
Do i need to enable windows 10 HDR option ? My TV is switching to HDR i can see the HDR logo on my tv but when i go to windows 10 HDR option windows say it is disabled.
No, do not enable the Windows HDR option. The (NV HDR) after the display mode tells you madVR is using Nvidia's API for displaying HDR. This is a good thing because the Windows HDR mode damages the video, it seems to assume you have a perfect 4000 nits HDR10 display or something (which no one has) and maps all content to that. I don't know what metadata it then sends to the TV. It seems like Microsoft has the resources to do HDR better... but they have always been amazingly dense when it comes to HTPC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
IMHO the OS HDR switch is pure evil, and should be avoided at all cost, until Microsoft gets off their high horse and finally learns how to do things right. But that's just my personal opinion, of course.
EDIT:
Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
madshi this is maybe interesting if you want to add VFR support to madVR.

https://forums.blurbusters.com/viewt...tart=30#p31943
That is very interesting but it doesn't sound like it solves the problem madshi was worried about. This software event will not be as regular as the hardware events so even with madVR controlling the present() times as accurately as possible they would vary +/- Xms. We don't know what this variation would be and it would probably vary a lot system to system, depending on hardware, background tasks, etc. Windows is not a real time OS after all.

I think these small frame time variances would be unnoticeable and worth it to have 0 dropped or repeated frames for content with any frame rate, even mixed, without needing to tune custom refresh rates (and the drivers don't support custom refresh rates very well).

I do see madshi's point though. The work to implement a mode that is probably slightly worse than what is available currently, and only offers convenience as a benefit, could be spent on other things.

That said, I do have an extra G-sync monitor (Asus PG278Q) that I would be happy to ship to Europe if it would help.

Edit2: hmm.. reading the rest of that thread it does sound like there are a few ways to get very low jitter in frame times.
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Last edited by Asmodian; 22nd April 2018 at 22:53.
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