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Old 10th January 2015, 23:51   #28021  |  Link
ktsbkt
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I have a question and I'd like to report a bug as well.

I'm using a Radeon R9 290 + catalyst 14.12 on Windows 8.1 64-bit, with 2 monitors. And I've found this strange behaviour with madVR:

I don't know if you are aware of this, but I'm reporting it here in case you weren't.



And then I have a question regarding madVR's GPU usage.
Please have a look at this screenshot: http://i.imgur.com/tTjmXId.jpg
It shows that madVR is ignoring the Clockspeed limits set by MSI Afterburner. The GPU just runs at full clockspeed, and this hurts the video, since my low voltage levels forced by Afterburner still applies even on full clockspeed.

Is there a way for me to configure madVR so it respects MSI Afterburner?
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Old 11th January 2015, 00:12   #28022  |  Link
Asmodian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragonQ View Post
The minimum refresh rate thing is strange to me. For technologies like CRT, plasma and OLED, it totally makes sense that refresh rates need to be high enough to avoid flicker. Indeed, my plasma displays 50 Hz inputs as 100 Hz and 24 Hz inputs as 96 Hz for this reason. However, don't LCDs use sample-and-hold? If so, why would there be flicker with any refresh rate?
Even with LCDs the pixel is not stable over time, it takes some time to get to the correct value and it will only stay at that correct value for a specific amount of time. They need to be "refreshed" (like volatile memory) or the pixels start to drift to other values. This refresh interval is the minimum frame rate.

If you don't refresh quickly enough you can notice the next refresh as a flicker because colors that were supposed to be static between the two frames changed to other values before the second frame was displayed. It is a very different mechanism for flickering (and a very different flicker) but it is still unpleasant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ktsbkt View Post
I have a question and I'd like to report a bug as well.

I'm using a Radeon R9 290 + catalyst 14.12 on Windows 8.1 64-bit, with 2 monitors. And I've found this strange behaviour with madVR:

I don't know if you are aware of this, but I'm reporting it here in case you weren't.
See the first post in this thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
known problems / limitations:

- rotated displays (portrait vs landscape orientation) don't work yet
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktsbkt View Post
And then I have a question regarding madVR's GPU usage.
Please have a look at this screenshot: http://i.imgur.com/tTjmXId.jpg
It shows that madVR is ignoring the Clockspeed limits set by MSI Afterburner. The GPU just runs at full clockspeed, and this hurts the video, since my low voltage levels forced by Afterburner still applies even on full clockspeed.

Is there a way for me to configure madVR so it respects MSI Afterburner?
madVR is a game to the GPU drivers, anything they do if you launch a game they will do for madVR. There is nothing you can change in madVR to effect this. It is not madVR that is not respecting MSI Afterburner but the GPU drivers.
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Old 11th January 2015, 00:13   #28023  |  Link
nevcairiel
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Rotated screens are not supported by madVR, known issue.
And personally I doubt madVR can influence the clockspeed that the GPU uses.
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Old 11th January 2015, 00:28   #28024  |  Link
DragonQ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
Even with LCDs the pixel is not stable over time, it takes some time to get to the correct value and it will only stay at that correct value for a specific amount of time. They need to be "refreshed" (like volatile memory) or the pixels start to drift to other values. This refresh interval is the minimum frame rate.

If you don't refresh quickly enough you can notice the next refresh as a flicker because colors that were supposed to be static between the two frames changed to other values before the second frame was displayed. It is a very different mechanism for flickering (and a very different flicker) but it is still unpleasant.
Thanks for the explanation. So what is the generally agreed minimum refresh rate for modern LCDs to avoid flicker then? Is G-Sync's 30 Hz minimum about right here? Or perhaps it's different for TN/MVA/IPS?

I know that my laptop screen is capable of reducing to 40 Hz to conserve power, although I turned this feature off because the difference is noticeable to me.
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Old 11th January 2015, 17:07   #28025  |  Link
Mr Alpha
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragonQ View Post
Thanks for the explanation. So what is the generally agreed minimum refresh rate for modern LCDs to avoid flicker then? Is G-Sync's 30 Hz minimum about right here? Or perhaps it's different for TN/MVA/IPS?

I know that my laptop screen is capable of reducing to 40 Hz to conserve power, although I turned this feature off because the difference is noticeable to me.
I've seen people complain about flickering with G-SYNC when the game stalls and the framerate drops. I suspect 30Hz might be cutting it too low.
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Old 11th January 2015, 18:12   #28026  |  Link
a8213711
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
did you used print screen?

and is your TV using PC mode there is a huge change your TV can't do PC mode in any other refresh rate than 60 hz (most samsung can't do this for what ever reason)so this may trigger the issue with the saturation. and if this is the case and you want to use PC mode think about 60 HZ only and smooth madVR motion.
Yes, print screen and no difference. Also I see there are more settings (no more greyed out) in my TV after I enter this "mode".
Do PC mode means 0-255 color range and no overscan? Because changing refresh rate doesn't seem to change those.
Also let's remember it enters in this mode only after switching back from Windows Media Center.
The problem is that I suppose the preferable rate (50Hz from 25fps source) is enabled only entering this mode, but colors get worse.
As the smooth option I can't use it because I can't handle it.
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Old 11th January 2015, 22:41   #28027  |  Link
huhn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a8213711 View Post
Yes, print screen and no difference. Also I see there are more settings (no more greyed out) in my TV after I enter this "mode".
a PC mode usually disables most settings in a TV to lower input lag and give it the possiblity to show a pixel perfect image.
Quote:
Do PC mode means 0-255 color range and no overscan? Because changing refresh rate doesn't seem to change those.
the change in saturation sounds like your TV needs full range but only gets limited.
a TV normally doesn't enter PC mode on it's own. so you should know if you set it up for this or not.

[quote]Also let's remember it enters in this mode only after switching back from Windows Media Center.
The problem is that I suppose the preferable rate (50Hz from 25fps source) is enabled only entering this mode, but colors get worse. [quote]
what refresh rate is madVR reporting be for you enter WMC and what after?

Quote:
As the smooth option I can't use it because I can't handle it.
can you say why? for example you see ghosting or your GPU can't handle it or what is the issue?
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Old 12th January 2015, 14:08   #28028  |  Link
XMonarchY
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Madshi, thank you so much for fixing madTPG. I couldn't get the 0.87.11 version to work with HCFR Calibration no matter what I tried. 0.87.10 worked, but there were some issues with using FullScreen, where patterns would play in FullScreen mode behind the madTPG window!

Now madTPG is very responsive and plays all the patterns without any issues at all! 3DLUT calibration is hassle-free once again, thanks to your excellent work and support!

madVR FTW - nothing beats it! Yet, I hope there will be more quality-improving goodies in the future!

Does G-Sync benefit film playback @ 23.976Hz with madVR or @ whichever other refresh rate (120Hz? 144Hz?) ? I figured it would run the film and screen at perfect 23.976Hz/Fps, making it the smoothest solution for film playback on compatible PC monitors, such as ASUS ROG Swift.
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Last edited by XMonarchY; 12th January 2015 at 15:38.
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Old 12th January 2015, 15:57   #28029  |  Link
a8213711
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
a PC mode usually disables most settings in a TV to lower input lag and give it the possiblity to show a pixel perfect image.

the change in saturation sounds like your TV needs full range but only gets limited.
a TV normally doesn't enter PC mode on it's own. so you should know if you set it up for this or not.

[quoteAlso let's remember it enters in this mode only after switching back from Windows Media Center.
The problem is that I suppose the preferable rate (50Hz from 25fps source) is enabled only entering this mode, but colors get worse. [quote
what refresh rate is madVR reporting be for you enter WMC and what after?


can you say why? for example you see ghosting or your GPU can't handle it or what is the issue?
With this "mode" I didn't mean PC mode, but this special mode in which enters after switching back from Media Center to a 25fps interlaced file, but actually I just realized it is enabled when my TV is set at 50Hz or 23.9Hz.
And is set at 50Hz: directly if I play a 25fps progressive file, and using the "alt+tab" method when I play a 25fps interlaced file (otherwise is at 59.9Hz).
As PC mode I think I enabled it once and for all; I can't say if it's actually enabled only at those 2 frequency.
Before and after WMC the refresh rate is always at 25.000 fps.
As Smooth Option: is too much power hungry for my low budget PC.

I just want my HTPC to always show the correct color gamma and to be always set to the properly refresh rate!
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Old 12th January 2015, 20:31   #28030  |  Link
vazel
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I'm getting green pixel artifacts with NNEDI3 enabled. I tried taking a screenshot but these artifacts don't show up in screenshots. Does anyone know what it could be and how to fix it?

Edit: Ok I was able to capture the artifacts in a screenshot by using printscreen instead of mpc-hc's built-in screenshot function. http://i.imgur.com/d2CkvKM.jpg

Last edited by vazel; 13th January 2015 at 01:50.
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Old 12th January 2015, 22:36   #28031  |  Link
e-t172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XMonarchY View Post
Does G-Sync benefit film playback @ 23.976Hz with madVR or @ whichever other refresh rate (120Hz? 144Hz?) ? I figured it would run the film and screen at perfect 23.976Hz/Fps, making it the smoothest solution for film playback on compatible PC monitors, such as ASUS ROG Swift.
madVR doesn't support G-Sync. Enabling G-Sync with madVR will not gain you anything, and it won't make the video smoother. It will behave as if G-Sync is disabled, or maybe worse.
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Old 12th January 2015, 23:51   #28032  |  Link
nevcairiel
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Note that G-Sync on many screens has a minimum refresh rate of 30 or 40 fps (depending on screen), so for full G-Sync compat at 24 fps, madVR would need to draw each frame at least twice, or the screen would drop out of G-Sync mode and re-draw the frame itself.
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Old 13th January 2015, 18:33   #28033  |  Link
DigitalLF
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What card would be best for MadVR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalLF View Post
I need to change my 280x i use in my HTPC.. that computer is used for well movie/series/web/mail no gaming. but PQ is priority 1 on that computer and the 2th priority is "heat vs performance"

What card would be best for MadVR? NNEDI3 128 neurons seems to demand a lot of the poor card :P
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Old 13th January 2015, 19:11   #28034  |  Link
michkrol
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vazel View Post
I'm getting green pixel artifacts with NNEDI3 enabled. I tried taking a screenshot but these artifacts don't show up in screenshots. Does anyone know what it could be and how to fix it?

Edit: Ok I was able to capture the artifacts in a screenshot by using printscreen instead of mpc-hc's built-in screenshot function. http://i.imgur.com/d2CkvKM.jpg
Try updating your drivers.
Check if the GPU is not overheating - run GPU-Z or similar to check temps while using NNEDI.
Try disabling DXVA decoding (if applicable).
Check if the GPU is not otherwise "bad" - run OCCT GPU test with error checking or similar tool.

Do post details of your config (hardware + software), if none of the above helps.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalLF View Post
What card would be best for MadVR?
We don't ask for "best" on this forum - read the rules
Sometimes integrated GPU can be good enough.
I'd rather ask what GPU can run smoothly with given setting, on given screen resolution, with given video format (resolution + fps + deinterlacing(on/off)), with minimum noise/heat or similar question.
Especially since 280x should be able to do NNEDI3 with 128 neurons for image luma doubling or chroma upscaling for SD content.
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Old 13th January 2015, 23:31   #28035  |  Link
IronRush
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Hello guys!
I need some help please.

I don't know if madvr here is doing his job. I think it isn't upscalling properly.
I formatted my PC yesterday. Now I am using Windows 8.1.
I always used madvr. Older version. And now with new OS and rig, I want to bring more quality to the table.

When I open a video file in windowed mode, the file is always same resolution than default, nothing change.
Madvr calibration tab I set 1080p24 and 1080p60.
I think normal if I open a 480p file, it need to open with 1080p resolution for properly upscalling, no?

Could you guys give me some tips please?
If important, my rig is i5-3570k/gtx 970.

Thanks in advance!
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Old 14th January 2015, 03:46   #28036  |  Link
Asmodian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e-t172 View Post
madVR doesn't support G-Sync. Enabling G-Sync with madVR will not gain you anything, and it won't make the video smoother. It will behave as if G-Sync is disabled, or maybe worse.
If you enable g-sync with madVR the screen flickers constantly. It is not watchable.
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Old 14th January 2015, 04:00   #28037  |  Link
BetA13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vazel View Post
I'm getting green pixel artifacts with NNEDI3 enabled. I tried taking a screenshot but these artifacts don't show up in screenshots. Does anyone know what it could be and how to fix it?

Edit: Ok I was able to capture the artifacts in a screenshot by using printscreen instead of mpc-hc's built-in screenshot function. http://i.imgur.com/d2CkvKM.jpg
had teh same problem, its the Driver...
ether dont use nnedi3 and use jinc or īrevert back to older driver..

http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...ostcount=27880

http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...ostcount=27912
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Old 14th January 2015, 14:54   #28038  |  Link
huhn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by a8213711 View Post
With this "mode" I didn't mean PC mode, but this special mode in which enters after switching back from Media Center to a 25fps interlaced file, but actually I just realized it is enabled when my TV is set at 50Hz or 23.9Hz.
And is set at 50Hz: directly if I play a 25fps progressive file, and using the "alt+tab" method when I play a 25fps interlaced file (otherwise is at 59.9Hz).
As PC mode I think I enabled it once and for all; I can't say if it's actually enabled only at those 2 frequency.
Before and after WMC the refresh rate is always at 25.000 fps.
As Smooth Option: is too much power hungry for my low budget PC.
what programs are running in the background when you try to use madVR?
the only potinal madVr bug i see here is that madVR stays at 60 hz and doesn't switch to 50 hz that's it. a simple screen from the OSD would have shown most of these issue.
Quote:
Before and after WMC the refresh rate is always at 25.000 fps.
refreshrate and FPS are 2 different things.

Quote:
I just want my HTPC to always show the correct color gamma and to be always set to the properly refresh rate!
you just have to setup your TV correctly if you switch back from 60 HZ to something else like 50 hz and the picture looks strange that is a huge indicator you are using PC mode and your TV is leaving it.
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Old 15th January 2015, 01:26   #28039  |  Link
Fullmetal Encoder
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Has anyone else had any persistent issues with UAC pop-ups upon running a video asking if I want to allow madHcCtrl.exe to make changes to my computer? On my original install of madVR I hadn't had this issue but have been receiving this response ever since upgrading to the latest version. I'm not sure what I could be doing differently. I unzipped the madVR download, selected and dragged and dropped the files into my current madVR folder location, "Program Files (x86)", then right-clicked the install.bat file and chose to run with administrator privileges. I'm using the latest Windows 8.1 Professional. Before copying the files over I did make sure to uninstall it properly.
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Old 15th January 2015, 01:47   #28040  |  Link
Asmodian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragonQ View Post
Thanks for the explanation. So what is the generally agreed minimum refresh rate for modern LCDs to avoid flicker then? Is G-Sync's 30 Hz minimum about right here? Or perhaps it's different for TN/MVA/IPS?
It is different for different screens, both the major technologies (TN/MVA/IPS) and for the individual panels (slow or fast IPS for example). It even varies for the color displayed, some colors will change faster than others.

Update rate is similar in that the starting and ending color has a huge impact on the speed of the transition. I have noticed that even fast MVA or IPS panels still have some color transitions that take well over 20 ms.

This is another reason variable frame rate is a little more tricky to get right even if it was possible to present frames with very accurate timing (without Windows stalling madVR for 10s of milliseconds randomly).
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