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Old 21st May 2019, 18:50   #1661  |  Link
dapperdan
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Faster decoding in Firefox thanks to Dav1d:

https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2019/0...ter-than-ever/

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We have seen great growth in the use of AV1 even in just a few months, with our latest figures showing that 11.8% of video playback in Firefox Beta used AV1, up from 0.85% in February and 3% in March.
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Old 21st May 2019, 19:49   #1662  |  Link
sneaker_ger
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11.8%? How? Did Youtube roll out AV1 big time?
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Old 21st May 2019, 21:33   #1663  |  Link
dapperdan
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The 80/20 rule would suggest you only need to encode 20% of the currently popular videos to get 80% of the views so getting up to 11% should be relatively straightforward if YouTube focus on the big hits.
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Old 25th May 2019, 16:37   #1664  |  Link
lvqcl
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11.8%? How? Did Youtube roll out AV1 big time?
It seems that Youtube now streams SD video (480p and below) in AV1 format by default.
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Old 25th May 2019, 17:52   #1665  |  Link
hin12
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It seems that Youtube now streams SD video (480p and below) in AV1 format by default.
All channels with >1 million subs I've seen have AV1 available in SD for videos uploaded from January onwards. I posted this on March 6th:

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Is 480p the highest quality option for all AV1 videos on YouTube? I'm seeing that a lot of popular videos are being encoded to AV1, but only at the 144p, 240p, 360p and 480p resolutions.
You had to enable the setting on testtube back then, though.
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Old 25th May 2019, 18:40   #1666  |  Link
lvqcl
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You had to enable the setting on testtube back then, though.
And now it's unnecessary; that's the point.
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Old 28th May 2019, 09:16   #1667  |  Link
stax76
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What is currently the fastest AV1 encoder?
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Old 28th May 2019, 12:35   #1668  |  Link
Tommy Carrot
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What is currently the fastest AV1 encoder?
SVT-AV1 with the default preset. The quality is bad though.

Aomenc with --cpu-used=8 --rt is even faster, but the quality is absolutely rancid.

Last edited by Tommy Carrot; 28th May 2019 at 12:38.
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Old 28th May 2019, 12:50   #1669  |  Link
stax76
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SVT-AV1 with the default preset. The quality is bad though.

Aomenc with --cpu-used=8 --rt is even faster, but the quality is absolutely rancid.
I'll be waiting for improved encoders then.
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Old 28th May 2019, 13:26   #1670  |  Link
ChaosKing
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rav1e is "fast" with ok quality.
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Old 28th May 2019, 13:36   #1671  |  Link
stax76
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rav1e is "fast" with ok quality.
Last time I tried rav1e 2019-04-30 and it was SLOW AS HELL, like < 1 fps.
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Old 28th May 2019, 13:38   #1672  |  Link
ChaosKing
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Last time I tried rav1e 2019-04-30 and it was SLOW AS HELL, like < 1 fps.
1 fps is fast for av1
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Old 28th May 2019, 14:19   #1673  |  Link
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I'm just wondering if the quality regression in rav1e has been fixed yet, with activity masking coming from GSOC it should be in a pretty good place quality wise if nothing is still broken.
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Old 29th May 2019, 06:56   #1674  |  Link
VincAlastor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stax76 View Post
What is currently the fastest AV1 encoder?
Again thank you very much for staxrip!!!

i use in staxrip a custom cmd line for ffmpeg aomenc from streaming media experts.

-c:v libaom-av1 -crf 40 -b:v 0 -strict experimental -threads 24 -tiles 8x2 -cpu-used 5 -row-mt 1

https://www.streamingmedia.com/Artic...ls-130284.aspx

https://www.reddit.com/r/AV1/comment...s_mostly_with/


also new version of rav1e with tiles support brings up to 3 fps for fullhd content

https://blog.rom1v.com/2019/04/imple...ding-in-rav1e/
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Old 29th May 2019, 13:35   #1675  |  Link
birdie
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At this time shouldn't we consider AV1 a failure and move on to newer codecs, e.g AV2?
  • It doesn't have fast enough decoders to decode on mobile at 1080p on most devices (>80%).
  • It still doesn't have encoders which are anywhere fast enough to be usable by mere mortals.
  • Its hardware adoption is not there - the spec was finalized almost half a year ago, and AV1 is nowhere to be seen in Zen 2.0 (Ryzen 3000), Radeon RDNA 5700 or Intel Ice Lake. No word on its decoding acceleration even in the recently announced Arm's Cortex-A77/Mali-G77.
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Old 29th May 2019, 15:19   #1676  |  Link
nevcairiel
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You do realize that a newer codec would end up even more complex, and thus even slower, and also slowing down hardware adoption even more?
All your points can be applied for any new codec.

- Mobile hardware, especially on the low-end, is inherently slow. The dav1d AV1 decoder can decode 1080p on mid-range and high-end mobile devices. But for mainstream roll out, thats not going to be used anyway, because it uses too much battery.
- Encoder development takes years. You must not have been around when any other codec was new. On top of that, any new codec is also always going to be slower then previous codecs. You pay for quality or compression with speed.
- Hardware development also takes years. Noone knolwedgeable ever realistically expected AV1 to show up in hardware before the end of 2020 or so. The turn-around times for hardware are really long. Hardware you see launch/announced today was long through the design process before AV1 was finished.

Any other new codec would be in the exact same situation a year or so after the spec was officially finalized. In fact this is already looking pretty good on adoption, most major browsers now include AV1 decoders, and YouTube is rolling out content.

Basically, do some more research on how codec lifetime has been in the past for any other codec.
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Old 29th May 2019, 16:50   #1677  |  Link
soresu
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Originally Posted by nevcairiel View Post
You do realize that a newer codec would end up even more complex, and thus even slower, and also slowing down hardware adoption even more?
All your points can be applied for any new codec.

- Mobile hardware, especially on the low-end, is inherently slow. The dav1d AV1 decoder can decode 1080p on mid-range and high-end mobile devices. But for mainstream roll out, thats not going to be used anyway, because it uses too much battery.
- Encoder development takes years. You must not have been around when any other codec was new. On top of that, any new codec is also always going to be slower then previous codecs. You pay for quality or compression with speed.
- Hardware development also takes years. Noone knolwedgeable ever realistically expected AV1 to show up in hardware before the end of 2020 or so. The turn-around times for hardware are really long. Hardware you see launch/announced today was long through the design process before AV1 was finished.

Any other new codec would be in the exact same situation a year or so after the spec was officially finalized. In fact this is already looking pretty good on adoption, most major browsers now include AV1 decoders, and YouTube is rolling out content.

Basically, do some more research on how codec lifetime has been in the past for any other codec.
I wish I could upvote this, you pretty much laid it out nice and clear there.
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Old 29th May 2019, 16:54   #1678  |  Link
soresu
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To add to Nevcariel's reply to Birdie, I would not expect any ASIC decoders to appear on AMD CPU's as they are generally integrated into the GPU design, which also means they end up in APU's aswell - once they have an ASIC it will be on the nearest APU or GPU release from that point.
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Old 29th May 2019, 21:43   #1679  |  Link
sneaker_ger
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We'll have to wait and see when or if free AV1 encoders surface that can beat e.g. x265 at not more than 10x slow down. It's hard to please the doom9 crowd. VP9 never got to that point, maybe AV1 will be the same.
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Old 30th May 2019, 11:10   #1680  |  Link
nevcairiel
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We'll have to wait and see when or if free AV1 encoders surface that can beat e.g. x265 at not more than 10x slow down. It's hard to please the doom9 crowd. VP9 never got to that point, maybe AV1 will be the same.
Encoders are no longer being made for this crowd. The primary design goal is massive-scale cloud encoding for YouTube, Netflix, Amazon, and everyone else that fits the encode-once, download hundreds of thousands of times scenario.

In such a scenario, even the slowest encoder is acceptable if it saves enough bytes.

In that scenario, VP9 also didn't fail. It gets used for a lot of content on the web.
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