Welcome to Doom9's Forum, THE in-place to be for everyone interested in DVD conversion. Before you start posting please read the forum rules. By posting to this forum you agree to abide by the rules. |
25th February 2015, 15:13 | #1 | Link |
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 485
|
Lossless output smaller than original
Subject kind of says it however I have a 45 minute clip that is 1.8GB and has an average bitrate of 5,130 Kbps.
I run it thru the following script: Code:
import ("D:\Program Files (x86)\AviSynth 2.5\QTGMC-3.32.avsi") DirectShowSource("D:\Conversion\2 - Working\Rodgers\title00.mkv") AssumeTFF() QTGMC(preset="Slow")
Resulting file is 559 MB and it says the overall bitrate is only 1,559 Kbps. If I look at the file in MediaInfo where the above info came from says Compression Mode: Lossless. Any idea what's going on here? Note original source comes off a DVD. Thanks. JR EDIT: I just saw a potential problem. Entire clip is black. When I scroll thru the source file in VirtualDub it's there and shows everything so not sure why the output is black. Took about 3 hours to render and guessing most of the file size is the audio output. Last edited by jriker1; 25th February 2015 at 15:21. |
25th February 2015, 16:45 | #2 | Link |
HeartlessS Usurer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Over the rainbow
Posts: 10,980
|
Is that your usual habit, ie does it usually work correctly,
Code:
Video > Fast Recompress Video > Compression > Lagarith > Mode YUY2 Suggest try something other than Lagarith (eg HuffYUV or UT_Video[better than Lagarith]). Also might want to turn on Menu/View/Show Decompressed Output/ to see if shows as black (which it most likely will). Very mysterious. EDIT: Might also want to take a peek at Menu/Video/Video color Depth/ just to see that its not set to something stupid. (dont know what it is usually set to, guessing "Same as decompression format"). EDIT: might also want to try alternative VDub, eg VDubMod if you have it, just a few seconds.
__________________
I sometimes post sober. StainlessS@MediaFire ::: AND/OR ::: StainlessS@SendSpace "Some infinities are bigger than other infinities", but how many of them are infinitely bigger ??? Last edited by StainlessS; 25th February 2015 at 17:20. |
26th February 2015, 04:00 | #6 | Link |
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 485
|
Thanks for your replies. Couple things:
HuffYUV is out as I am on Win 7 64-bit and can't get it working beyond the encoding. No decoding so can't open it up after it was created. Sure Lagarith is good. Lossless is lossless no unless it's a final file? I also have MagicYUV but can use UT_Video if there is a good reason to and will work universally in my system. My files are MKV so I can pull out the individual movies on the DVD and not deal with one big file. I will however use ffmpeg to copy the mkv content to a vob and go from there with you suggestion StainlessS. I do know the footage is telecine and when I use tfm(mode=5,pp=0,slow=1) tdecimate(cycle=5) there are still some interlace artifacts after using it so not sure if in d2v it will work better. Thinking: d2v="file.d2v" MPEG2Source(d2v=d2v,cpu=0,idct=5) TFM(d2v=d2v, pp=0) Above from cihub I think so not sure what is necessary or not. I think Handbrake can get rid of the interlacing completely from testing but not sure what detelecine tool it's using so don't like not knowing nor know if there are better tools. creaothceann, I'm using that because I was deinterlacing. No talk about why are you doing this. I'm not using it now as I am of the belief my content is telecined not pure interlaced. Thanks for the help. Stay tuned tomorrow for me to test it. JR |
26th February 2015, 10:06 | #8 | Link |
Angel of Night
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Tangled in the silks
Posts: 9,559
|
No, Lagarith is just old and inactive, not quite abandoned. It still mostly works, and it's still usually smaller than anything but x264 and FFV1 (but faster, obviously). MagicYUV and utvideo are much faster, smaller than huffyuv but larger than Lagarith. They're also better at handling more pixel formats than Lagarith.
Huffyuv should only be used for compatibility, it doesn't compete on any other measure with the newer formats. x264 lossless can usually take advantage of highly optimized hardware and software decoders, and it's usually the smallest, but it's also usually the slowest of all to create. What you use just depends on what tradeoffs are best for you. As for the broken encode this thread is about, I'm guessing that forcing YUY2 for a YV12 video might be breaking it somehow, and it's certainly unnecessary when it gains nothing over the input, combed or not. (Lagarith supports YV16, if you must upsample, use that!) |
26th February 2015, 14:46 | #9 | Link |
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 485
|
Thank you all. I will start using MagicYUV, already installed, and see how that goes. Starting to think my problem was a fluke. Probably chalk it up to watching the first minute or two of encoding and make sure VDub is showing the estimated file size is going to be in gigs and not megs. Now hopefully I will get some takers on my telecine thread as the materials I originally wrote about here took a twist and holding me up.
Thanks again. JR |
26th February 2015, 17:41 | #10 | Link |
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 365
|
I have had and am having problems with Lagarith too. In most contexts using the default of "RGB (default)" works. But I tried YV12 again lately. Caused Vdub to blow up in middle of a run. Then discovered when I convered a Lag. Yv12 file to Lag. RGB, that YV12 takes less space!! (Caused me a space problem as I hadn't budgeted for a bigger RGB file. Also did a test, RGB-YV12, then back, and the final did not equal the original in size.
Even Lag RGB cannot be used for what I think is characterized by an app scrubbing back and forth wildly. Forced me in one situation to convert from Lag to Hufyuv JUST so I could run the video through a certain app that barfed at Lag. (It didn't barf at the codec, but failed to process.) I realize this is muddy. I actually tried a few days ago to email the author who says he welcomes bug reports. Haven't heard back yet, but he could be out of town or something. |
26th February 2015, 17:47 | #11 | Link |
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 485
|
Yeah, I did have a couple cases when I selected Lag the screen went black on the output preview. Staying away from HuffYUV as I think it's really old and compatibility is crap especially with newer OS and 64-bit systems. Just doesn't work. From what I hear it only encodes, doesn't decode which matches my situation. Still using Lag at the moment as I'm a stickler of sticking with something when you start with it and it was working, but think I need to bite the bullet and switch. That's assuming when I encode in MagicYUV in VDub that it opens in Premiere. Haven't tested yet. Still putzing around with Lag but unlike you TCmullet using YUV for my DVD content.
JR |
26th February 2015, 18:02 | #12 | Link | |
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 308
|
Quote:
It shouldn't be surprising that lossless compression of an input with less information would lead to a smaller output. Furthermore, even disregarding the chroma subsampling, converting between YCbCr and RGB is lossy, so I'm not really sure what exactly you're trying to accomplish.
__________________
Say no to AviSynth 2.5.8 and DirectShowSource! |
|
26th February 2015, 18:13 | #13 | Link | |
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 365
|
Quote:
|
|
26th February 2015, 18:16 | #14 | Link | |
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 365
|
Quote:
Are you saying that the AviSynth command "ConvertToYV12()" is inherently lossy?????? |
|
26th February 2015, 19:41 | #16 | Link | |
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Germany
Posts: 357
|
Quote:
|
|
|
|