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Old 25th December 2011, 07:57   #321  |  Link
egur
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wanezhiling View Post


So what about previous generation Desktop Processors(i3/i5/i7..)?
The decoder will work on previous generation but at much lower efficiency due to different memory architecture (integrated memory controller) as well as different decode HW. Even Core 2 Duo machines will work (with GMCH graphics). I don't test these setups because of that. Better to use pure SW (similar performance to my decoder) or pure DXVA (faster but limited).
Fortunately, future generations (IvyBridge,...) will have the same performance as SandyBridge - probably much better. So my work isn't targeting a single generation.
Same goes for OS support - I'm officially testing only on Windows 7, although Vista should work fine. Windows 8 will be supported as well when it's released.
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Old 25th December 2011, 12:55   #322  |  Link
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I got it.
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Old 28th December 2011, 04:33   #323  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pulbitz View Post
I'm sorry. I don't speak English very well.

ffdshow video decoder configuration | Output | Stream settings
Check "Set interlaced flag in output media type"

- libavcodec
perfect smooth playback of 1080i content. (double framerate)

- Intel QuickSync
motion is steppier. (poor)

Is this a bug? Or QuickSync decoder limitation?
Quote:
Originally Posted by egur View Post
You need a SandyBridge (or newer) to enjoy the HW acceleration used in the QuickSync decoder.
Please specify which renderer was use as well other setup (driver version, OS version, 32/64 bit, player, display is connected to iGPU or dGPU, etc). If you can post a part of the clip (10-20 seconds) that would help development.
This thread is very busy so please report issues at the QuickSync decoder thread:
[ur]http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=162442[/url]
CPU: i5-2500 with HD Graphics 2000 (I don't use external GPU)
OS: Windows 7 Ultimate x64
Driver: 2559 (15.22.52.64.2559)
Renderer: EVR (not custom EVR)
Player
1. The KMPlayer(3.0.0.1441) http://cdn.kmplayer.com/KMP/Download....0.1441_R2.exe
2. PotPlayer(2011.12.26. beta) http://get.daum.net/PotPlayer/Beta/PotPlayerSetup.exe

sample file(1080i60) http://www.multiupload.com/2JMT9SLZQI

P.S. PotPlayer with built-in QuickSync decoder is OK. (Unlike ffdshow QuickSync decoder)
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Old 28th December 2011, 22:34   #324  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pulbitz View Post
CPU: i5-2500 with HD Graphics 2000 (I don't use external GPU)
OS: Windows 7 Ultimate x64
Driver: 2559 (15.22.52.64.2559)
Renderer: EVR (not custom EVR)
Player
1. The KMPlayer(3.0.0.1441) http://cdn.kmplayer.com/KMP/Download....0.1441_R2.exe
2. PotPlayer(2011.12.26. beta) http://get.daum.net/PotPlayer/Beta/PotPlayerSetup.exe

sample file(1080i60) http://www.multiupload.com/2JMT9SLZQI

P.S. PotPlayer with built-in QuickSync decoder is OK. (Unlike ffdshow QuickSync decoder)
I've reproduced/confirmed the issue on another player. Still root causing it.
BTW, PotPlayer seems to use a DLL (quicksync.dll) that has very similar export functions as well as file size, do they use an older version of my DLL or built their own? (either way is fine BTW).
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Old 28th December 2011, 23:19   #325  |  Link
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PotPlayer/KMPlayer are notorious for stealing code from open-source projects (MPC and ffdshow in particular) and violating the GPL.
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Old 30th December 2011, 20:39   #326  |  Link
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Hello.

I did some benchmarking with QS and I put my results here:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=163110

After the whole experience I have some questions that I would like to ask you.

1) After the installation of latest driver Intel 15.22.52.2559 I found 3 MFT decoders by Intel at C:\Program Files\Common Files\Intel\Media SDK\s1\2.0\

The names are Intel Hardware H.264/MPEG-2/VC-1 Decoder MFT.

But during the enumeration of available codecs in DXVA Checker when I try to benchmark a video file, those decoders never show up.

Why?

Also in their properties they don't seem to have a DXVA option (enable/disable)

2) Your work of QS Decoder is it possible to be installed without FFDShow ?
Because I don't want to install the package of FFDShow just to have your QS decoder.

3) After the installation of your QS decoder through FFDShow and the appropriate configuration to use QS for AVC, VC-1, MPEG-2, during the enumeration of available codecs FFDShow most of the times didn't show up.
And when it was available for benchmarking, it wasn't working at all.

My setup was a little different from what you recommend.
I didn't use Lucid Virtu or Virtual displays.

I just put two different cables of my two different GC (HD 2000 and GT440) at the same time on my two input display and automatically the driver got into Extended mode.
The QuickSync worked OK that way.

4) Why Intel restricts such a POWERFUL DECODER like QS for 1920x1080 only?

I think that the driver's team should "open" the driver up to 4K x 2K that QS could handle with ease.

And of course your decoder and every other decoder using QS must be updated too, to include 4K x 2K.

5) The video file number 9 has some issues (artifacts) during the last 3-4 seconds.

Thanks
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Old 31st December 2011, 11:25   #327  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
Hello.

I did some benchmarking with QS and I put my results here:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=163110

After the whole experience I have some questions that I would like to ask you.

1) After the installation of latest driver Intel 15.22.52.2559 I found 3 MFT decoders by Intel at C:\Program Files\Common Files\Intel\Media SDK\s1\2.0\

The names are Intel Hardware H.264/MPEG-2/VC-1 Decoder MFT.

But during the enumeration of available codecs in DXVA Checker when I try to benchmark a video file, those decoders never show up.

Why?

Also in their properties they don't seem to have a DXVA option (enable/disable)
I don't know - I'm not part of the Media SDK dev team nor the graphics driver team. I'll forward your question.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
2) Your work of QS Decoder is it possible to be installed without FFDShow ?
Because I don't want to install the package of FFDShow just to have your QS decoder.
My decoder is not a DirectShow filter. It's a DLL with a simple API that allows decoding - an abstraction layer (with enhancements) above the Intel Media SDK API. This is why it's bundled with FFDShow. It can be integrated into other DS filters quite easily but I started with FFDShow because it's very popular. Now it's part of the official FFDShow builds. This site will allow people to test the newest cutting edge versions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
3) After the installation of your QS decoder through FFDShow and the appropriate configuration to use QS for AVC, VC-1, MPEG-2, during the enumeration of available codecs FFDShow most of the times didn't show up.
And when it was available for benchmarking, it wasn't working at all.

My setup was a little different from what you recommend.
I didn't use Lucid Virtu or Virtual displays.

I just put two different cables of my two different GC (HD 2000 and GT440) at the same time on my two input display and automatically the driver got into Extended mode.
The QuickSync worked OK that way.
Your setup seems fine. Please tell me what's not working in greater detail.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
4) Why Intel restricts such a POWERFUL DECODER like QS for 1920x1080 only?

I think that the driver's team should "open" the driver up to 4K x 2K that QS could handle with ease.

And of course your decoder and every other decoder using QS must be updated too, to include 4K x 2K.
See answer #1. My guess would be that it made the HW more expensive and not worth the cost. I'll forward the question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
5) The video file number 9 has some issues (artifacts) during the last 3-4 seconds.
I'll check it out and report back.
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Old 31st December 2011, 13:03   #328  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by egur View Post
Your setup seems fine. Please tell me what's not working in greater detail.
From the whole range of clips from 1 to 10, only a few gave me the option to benchmark FFDshow.
I mean that only for a few clips the FFDshow codec appeared red which means DXVA2 capable codec ready for benchmarking with a suitable decoder device and codec.
Most of the times it was grey, available only for DXVA1.
And the few times that it was red, when I tried to benchmark FFDshow the only thing happened was to open the benchmark window and stuck there.
The clip wasn't moving at all.
If you haven't met that situation before, never mind.
I'll search it myself next time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by egur View Post
My guess would be that it made the HW more expensive and not worth the cost.
I mean the hardware as is - the QuickSync first generation - seems more than capable of 4K x 2K decoding.
I believe it's a matter of appropriate drivers and codecs to unleash the power.
I know that Intel advertises that the second generation of QS inside Ivy is capable of not only 4K x 2K, but of mulltiple streams of 4K x 2K and 4K x 4K - square resolution.
I think a simple 4K x 2K is feasible by first generation QS too

Waiting for your feedback.

Thanks
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Old 31st December 2011, 14:47   #329  |  Link
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Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
3) After the installation of your QS decoder through FFDShow and the appropriate configuration to use QS for AVC, VC-1, MPEG-2, during the enumeration of available codecs FFDShow most of the times didn't show up.
And when it was available for benchmarking, it wasn't working at all.
DXVA checker will only check DXVA - it loads FFDShow-DXVA which doesn't use the Intel QuickSync decoder.
Try benchmarking using GraphStudio, it's very easy to use. (menu->view->decoder performance). There you can select decoder and renderer (or NULL renderer).
BTW, I'm having a hard time downloading the clips since I don't have a rapidshare account. Please share them on www.multiupload.com, it's the easiest way to share files for free as it currently doesn't impose limitations (it allows concurrent downloads with download managers).
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Old 31st December 2011, 15:31   #330  |  Link
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From your answer I can understand now that I was looking at a wrong direction.

Your dll appears as a CPU codec not a DXVA codec, that's why you told me to benchmark it with GraphStudio.
Of course it's a CPU codec using DXVA through Intel Media SDK!

I have used GraphStudio and Timecodec at the past in order to benchmark CPU codecs, but after DXVA Checker I use it - DXVA Checker - for all kind of codecs, even CPU.
DXVA checker can use all kind of codecs (CPU, DXVA, CUDA etc)

So I will try again with DXVA Checker and FFDShow CPU codec and not FFDShow DXVA codec, when I'll have access again at the Core i5 system.

Maybe a good idea for Nevcariel could be to include the QS decoder in his LAV Video along with his pure CPU codecs and CUVID codecs, if it's OK by you.

BTW, I found the artifacts at 9th clip during playback with Potplayer and its default QuickSync.dll and then I replaced it and renamed your latest dll and still the artifacts were there.
You don't have to download everything, just clip 9.
I will try to reupload it to mediashare which is like multiupload, I think.
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Old 31st December 2011, 16:02   #331  |  Link
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One more thing...

There are a lot of minor issues regarding HD Graphics and QuickSync.

I couldn't find a desktop gadget to see the status of the graphics card (clocks, GPU usage, memory).
Even latest GPU-Z reports HD 2000 GC of Core i5 as GT2 at 45nm! and 12 GU, but reports GPU load.

QS is even harder to get info.

No gadget, no program no sign when it's used, no load.

Also DXVA checker disables CPU and GPU usage during playback and benchmarking with QS.

Because of the nature of GC and QS - inside the processor - I don't know if Intel can think a way of "separating" the operations of Graphics Card and QS from the "rest" of the CPU and monitor the activity and features of each component.
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Old 31st December 2011, 16:16   #332  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
One more thing...

There are a lot of minor issues regarding HD Graphics and QuickSync.

I couldn't find a desktop gadget to see the status of the graphics card (clocks, GPU usage, memory).
Even latest GPU-Z reports HD 2000 GC of Core i5 as GT2 at 45nm! and 12 GU, but reports GPU load.

QS is even harder to get info.

No gadget, no program no sign when it's used, no load.

Also DXVA checker disables CPU and GPU usage during playback and benchmarking with QS.

Because of the nature of GC and QS - inside the processor - I don't know if Intel can think a way of "separating" the operations of Graphics Card and QS from the "rest" of the CPU and monitor the activity and features of each component.
There's this tool for analysis:
http://software.intel.com/en-us/arti...ols-intel-gpa/

It's mostly used by developers.
BTW, the 9th clip plays fine using ffdshow-quicksync, I'll test the other clips for issues and performance (using graph studio).
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Old 31st December 2011, 17:25   #333  |  Link
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Huh it's free now ? wasnt it @ the beginning for Game Studios under NDA only ?
anyway this is really cool



much better then to just use Microsofts Generic stuff (WPA,WPR) which also goes deep but not so specific on the GPU (DSP) parts

also some very interesting information about the Motion Estimation part (and how turbo boost relates to it) http://software.intel.com/sites/land...d-applications

also this is showing the problematic with the lock/unlocking of the frame (copy back)

Quote:
There are two reasons: first, the compressed frame is smaller in size as compared to uncompressed frame, and second, the Intel Media SDK utilizes an optimized data copy with a combination of MOVNTDQA and MFENCE instructions.
ahh and we are @ beta 5 now http://software.intel.com/en-us/arti...edia-sdk-beta/

Quote:
Transcode enhancements
Increased performance
Enhanced quality
Easier usage with opaque memory
Abstraction of system buffer and DirectX* surface
Simplified memory between CPU and Intel® Processor Graphics
MVC encode and decode - stereoscopic 3D
Improved videoconferencing extensions
Dynamic bit rate control
Improved robustness (error resilience)
Improved error detection and reporting
Lower latency: Improved responsiveness
Improved long-term reference frame control
New samples
Decoding and stereoscopic 3D rendering sample
Videoconferencing usage sample
OpenCL™ parallel programming sample*

anything specific in information here about the improvements compared to beta 4 (especially on which level where the quality improvements, and how that shows in metric measurements) ?

I love Intel

http://software.intel.com/sites/land...el-gpa-advisor

you really doing it the right way
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Old 1st January 2012, 20:39   #334  |  Link
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New version released 0.21 beta

Version 0.21 beta is out with the following changes:
* Performance boost (~20%) + lower latency decoding by using a worker thread to perform post-decode work (mostly frame copy).
* FFDShow rev4216

Download from SourceForge home page
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Old 1st January 2012, 22:07   #335  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by egur View Post
There's this tool for analysis:
http://software.intel.com/en-us/arti...ols-intel-gpa/

It's mostly used by developers.
BTW, the 9th clip plays fine using ffdshow-quicksync, I'll test the other clips for issues and performance (using graph studio).
Happy New Year.

I tried the software and I really loved GPA Monitor.
Very easy to use and see the utilization of both GPU and QS in a beautiful and informative way.

I updated my results to include performance of your QS FFDshow v0.20. Unfortunately I didn't expect you to work today and release a new version!

From what I see from my results here http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=163110, there is a big penalty by using DXVA through Intel Media than DXVA directly.
It's two times slower in low bandwidth clips!
But in high bitrate clips from 7 to 10, the speed is the same.

I started to monitor MFX performance (QS) with GPA Monitor v4.3 and I found out that during benchmarking QS FFDShow was using from 65% - 75% of QS decoding hardware and QS DXVA was using 96% - 98% of QS decoding hardware.

Also during the monitoring of the benchmarking process, I found out that although QS FFDshow put the CPU in Turbo mode of 3.2GHz in contrast to QS DXVA that put the CPU at a frequency range of 1.6GHz - 2.1 GHz the QS utilization was only slightly lower in QS FFDShow despite the twofold CPU frequency.
Probably because of the lower utilization of QS in general by QS FFDShow I mentioned above.

But the main problem in my opinion is the CPU usage of QS FFDshow.
During playback in both WMP12 and PotPlayer using DXVA, the CPU was at lowest point 1.6GHz for most of the clips, most of the time.
During playback with DXVA checker and PotPlayer with your QS FFDShow dll, the CPU went very high in Turbo mode of 3.2GHz in all 1080p60fps clips!
For the rest of the clips, even the "tough" ones like from 7 to 10 the CPU frequency went from 1.6GHz to 3.1GHz

PotPlayer in DXVA mode couldn't play clips 2 and 3 - it falls back to software mode.
WMP12 plays fine in DXVA mode from clip 1 to 10 as PotPlayer with QS FFDshow.

I INSIST ON writing you that during playback of clip 9 (Ducks Take off) with both DXVA checker and PotPlayer using QS FFDShow I see ARTIFACTS at the last few seconds with version 0.20.

I know nothing about version 0.21.
I'll try it when I go to Core i5 system again.
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Old 1st January 2012, 22:48   #336  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
Happy New Year.
Happy new year to you too

Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
I tried the software and I really loved GPA Monitor.
Very easy to use and see the utilization of both GPU and QS in a beautiful and informative way.
Very nice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
I updated my results to include performance of your QS FFDshow v0.20. Unfortuantely I didn't expect you to work today and release a new version!
Well, most of the work was done in '11.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
From what I see from my results here http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=163110, there is a big penalty by using DXVA through Intel Media than DXVA directly.
It's two times slower in low bandwidth clips!
But in high bitrate clips from 7 to 10, the speed is the same.
There's a performance penalty which is low during normal playback. When going full speed, the CPU utilization goes up because of the memory copying (GPU->CPU). The CPU stays at LFM (1.6GHz) for the duration of playback.
FYI, QuickSync is part of the GPU not the CPU so it operates on the GPU frequency (650-1350GHz). The GPU frequency is determined by dynamically. There's a nice overview on SandyBridge's architecture from AnandTech.

Regarding performance, I'm not a magician, DXVA will always be faster and use less power. But it's not good for everyone due to it's many restrictions. Actually the hassles of DXVA are abstracted by my code as well the Media SDK. The Media SDK add practically zero overhead. Copying the frames to system memory so all plays can enjoy HW acceleration is the main feature of the Intel QuickSync decoder.
It's also has features like using a different GPU for rendering.

You should try v0.21 which is the first beta. It's faster and will probably get even faster once I finish tuning the code in a week or two.

BTW, DXVA is fast buy it's not always working well for me (and others).

Regarding corruption, sometimes it's a matter of what splitter is used.
The best to date are: LAV and Haali.
None of them is perfect but they are very good. Haali has aspect ratio issues and LAV doesn't seek as well on broken TS streams (slow seek+corrupted frames). I had little issues with MPC's splitter as well. With PotPlayer I got crashes I don't know how to fix.

I played clip #9 using ZoomPlayer (32 bit) and Windows Media Center (64 bit) and no corruption.

Another thing, when benchmarking using Graph Studio, the first run is always slower for some reason, so you should either omit it or run 10 passes. It looks like the graph init time (happens only on the 1st run) gets into the stats.
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Old 1st January 2012, 23:17   #337  |  Link
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performance scores

Setup:
* GraphStudio, 10 passes, NULL renderer.
* 10 clips from http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=163110
* FFDShow rev4216 (QS 0.21) 32 bit.
* Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit, Aero on.
* Intel driver: v2559.
* Lucid Virtu: not installed.
* CPU: i7-2600 (3.4GHz), power management on. HD 2000 (GT1) iGPU.
* DDR3 @1333MHz (nothing fancy)
* Score are lowest/avg/highest frame rates for the entire clip.
* Note - the first pass was always slower due to graph contruction time which affects short clip benchmarks. The most interesting results are the highest FPS as the median score is very close to them.
1.Twinpeaks1080p30fpsRef2-27Mbps.mov
264/297/303

2.Samsung.Demo.Oceanic.Life-1080p30fpsRef16-40Mbps.mkv
240/260/263

3.Basketball-1088p60fpsRef8-10Mbps.mkv
310/315/319

4.Girls.YoonYoon-1080p60fpsRef5-21Mbps.mkv
298/307/310

5.Birds_1080p60fpsReF2-30Mbps.mp4
283/294/298

6.Cat-1080p60fpsRef4-25Mbps.m2ts
291/290/301

7.Vortexx_1088p24fpsRef3-109Mpbs.mp4
119/134/140

8.Birds_1080p24fpsRef4-112Mbps.mkv
122/134/137

9.Ducks.Take.Off.1080p30fpsRef5-108Mbps.mkv
147/154/156

10.Crowd.Run.1080p25Ref4-116Mbps.mkv
115/126/128
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Old 1st January 2012, 23:36   #338  |  Link
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Thanks for the info.

Next time I will try to check the GPU speed, but I think that GPA Monitor doesn't provide this, I'm not sure.

I think GPU-Z can help, although it's reporting wrong HD 2000 features.
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Old 1st January 2012, 23:40   #339  |  Link
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Happy New Year everyone

@Egur
did you benchmark how the glass shader of aero is hurting performance i did some tests and it seems quiet heavy compared to all other effects disabling it gives me a rather big boost and also lowers GPU usage without losing Aeros V-Sync . Im also experimenting how the GPU Frequency impacts Performance currently my Motherboard is capable overclocking the HD 2000 (GPU overclocking bits enabled)

Also it seems that actually the CPU is never staying @ the same Frequency but always changing it even with a High Performance Profile it constantly switches over here see with http://www.mediafire.com/?kwrwnj41428lzzg coded on Intel Specs very great work (capable of changing multiplier on the fly if bios allows it)

@NikosD
Hwinfo32 is a great tool sensoring GT1 frequency and power consumption for free it also shows correct data compared to GPU-Z
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all my compares are riddles so please try to decipher them yourselves :)

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Join the Revolution NOW before it is to Late !

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=168004

Last edited by CruNcher; 2nd January 2012 at 00:21.
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Old 1st January 2012, 23:51   #340  |  Link
egur
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Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Atlit, Israel
Posts: 916
Quote:
Originally Posted by CruNcher View Post
Happy New Year everyone

@Egur
did you benchmark how the glass shader of aero is hurting performance i did some tests and it seems quiet heavy compared to all other effects disabling it gives me a rather big boost and also lowers GPU usage without losing Aeros V-Sync . Im also experimenting how the GPU Frequency impacts Performance currently my Motherboard is capable overclocking the HD 2000 (GPU overclocking bits enabled)
These are preliminary test that will serve as a performance benchmark mostly for development purposes - I want to be able to get the maximum out of the code and I think I can do a little better.
It's best that "official" benchmarks are produced by others for objectivity sake
Also when you have an 8 thread CPU (i7-2600), SW decoders can perform very well. Especially on low bitrate clips.
I also didn't test with faster memory, my new HTPC setup will have an i7-2600K with 1600MHz DDR3. My aging Core 2 Duo + Nvidia 7600 is having a hard time pushing a Full HD TV...
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Processor Application Engineer for Overclocking and CPU technologies
Intel QuickSync Decoder author
Intel Corp.
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